Tarps

I had this website bookmarked yrs ago when I was thinking about using a tarp. You may find it useful or not

http://www.equipped.org/tarp-shelters.htm

tarps are nice, but you are correct in some ways. they won't provide as much protection as a tent or tarptent, and if you get a ground cloth, bivy, and tarp, you might be in the same weight range.

One option you might consider is a modular type setup. Look at shelter systems like the go-lite shangri-la series or MLD's doumid with inner net. Another option is a traditional tarp with a net inner such as MLD's serenity. The nice thing about these shelters is that the net can be left at home when it is not needed. Also if you go with a shaped tarp, (like the shangri-la, MLD doumid, MLD patrol shelter, etc) you will get more coverage than a flat tarp.

Setting up a tarp isn't rocket science and the best thing you can do is practice. I'd suggest getting a cheap tarp and give it a try on an overnight. Set it up a few times in your yard or a park. If you wind up liking it, then invest the money in a nicer tarp.

All that said, if you want bug protection all the time (imo, probably not necessary in the rockies) a tarptent is a good way to go.

http://www.bearpawwd.com/tents_tarps/tarps.html

http://gossamergear.com/wp/support/videos/demo-videos

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=35838

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=29108

http://blackwoodspress.com/blog/2532/video-tarp-camping-in-the-rain/

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=43668

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=15273

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=19243

I really like my tarp. I have a twin size tarp from gossamer gear and use it with a polycryo ground sheet only – no bivy. Its a simple set up. It is much lighter than a tent set up and keeps a very large dry area. I think its a bit easier to set up than any tent I have used, including a tarptent that I occasionally carry. I also prefer the experience of being in a tarp over being in a tent. There is just a lot more openness and connection to your camp area.

The biggest down side (or up side, depending on your perspective) is that it is not fully enclosed. I find biting insects to be much worse during the day (especially sunrise/sunset) than at night. I will often bring a headnet just in case; that's the only spot exposed when I'm in my bag.

Some people just aren't comfortable with just a roof and no walls. Its been great for me though.

My use is mostly in the Appalachia but I have used the setup just fine in Colorado too.

Good luck in your shelter search.

I recently took the tarp plunge for an overnighter in SNP, using an 8×10 blue Wally World tarp. I was a bit nervous but…I LOVED it. When I woke up during the night, I saw the stars…heard the creek…the wind. No animals came by, which surprised me, or if they did I was sound asleep. The only thing for me was being creative in dressing as others were nearby. Using a tarp allowed me to really study the wind and weather so I could at least figure the best pitch. I did a flying diamond and it worked just fine.

Now I am debating on getting a flat 8×10 or something like a tapered tent that MLD or GG offers.

I am about in the same place as you (I think) Jeff and I just ordered a TT Notch. Part of why I chose the Notch over the Moment is that tarp/inner net tent design. I chose that partly because it makes it a double wall shelter, but also because I want to dabble/try tarping at some point. The Fly on that tent makes for a nice 17oz shaped tarp essentially. I plan to get a piece of Tyvek and make a ground cloth for the inside to experiment in non-buggy weather with tarping.

I think I saw you mentioned you might be looking for a 2 man tent. You could accomplish the same thing with a Stratospire 1 or 2.

Thanks for the input everyone. After adding up the costs it looks like a tent will be much cheaper. Two bivy sacks, one for my son and one for me, at about $130 a pop. The tarp I was looking at is $175. That adds up to $435. A Tarptent would be quite a bit cheaper.

As someone who has backpacked in the Rockies for 40 years, I would recommend not giving up on a tarp so quickly. I would highly recommend Ray Jardine's Tarp Book and learn some of the basics and try out a "poly tarp". Assuming a shelter for 2 people: A 3 mil poly tarp, about 2 1/2 yards of mosquito netting from the surplus store, some polycryo for a ground cloth (heat shrink window covering from Home Depot) some light line and about 10 tent stakes might cost you $40-$45 and that is at the high end. And weigh maybe 2 pounds. And then you can experiment, play, check it out, learn and have fun. I've only gone to a bivy recently as I've gone to just a poncho/tarp for my shelter. (And I'm not completely sold yet on the bivy.) With a 10 x10 or 8×10 sized tarp there is no need for a bivy. For mosquitos just throw the mosquito netting over the upper part of your body and sleeping bag. Mosquitos almost always quite down in the Rockies in the cool of the night. As for ticks–just check yourself and don't pitch your tarp over a deer lie.

Some of my best memories and stories come from the benefits of using a tarp over a tent. You get to see and experience so much more beauty, wonder, and mystery. Nighttime lightning, gorgeous sunrises, baby porcupines, field mice, herds of deer and elk coming to visit me! Tents have a tendency to close you off from some of that.

Please understand I'm not dissing Tarptents. I just love tarps and many other backpackers do to. They've worked for me for a long time.

I would go tarping with a friend who tarps, if possible. There is a fear of the unknown with tarps. We've been told our whole life that you camp in a tent; it just seems wrong to do otherwise. There's also some fear of the critters around when you are sleeping. I got over that fear by hearing from dozens of people here and elsewhere who have yet to have their eyes gouged out by a raccoon as they sleep and have backpacked way more than me.
Once the fear of the tarp is gone, most people strongly prefer the experience, as you can see from the above posts. It seems that most people who go to a tarp don't go back to a tent.

Jason – When sleeping under a tarp are you able to keep dry without a bivy during a heavy rain? If it is raining and the wind is blowing seems like it would be hard to keep dry without additional protection. I will order the Ray Jardine book. Thanks.

http://www.rayjardine.com/ray-way/Tarp-Kit/index.htm

A 8 X 10 tarp will keep you dry, if pitched properly. You can buy a 13 ounce one for $80 or less, or two of them for less than most single UL tents. More exotic material costs more.

Tarps are not for everyone.

For some people there is a lot to be said for free standing, easy to pitch shelters especially double walled.

I prefer tarps for the most part, although I have been mesmerized with my Hexamid (no inner net, and the poncho/ground sheet). It is really a tarp with only one pitch option.

But you need to decide for yourself. If you want to experiment, just get a simple inexpensive flat tarp. No need to go out and spent megabucks if you are sure if it will work for you. Even for one person I recommend a 8 X 10. You you go with something smaller, then a bivy will probably be needed.

Try it at home first, too. I discovered that my cheapo tarp had the grommets in odd places, so I got a grommet gun and put in more so I could really get some different pitches. I did go with another person who knows tarps and pitches, and we spent lots of time doing different configurations of the tarp.

I have become more damp from condensation in my tarptent than I have yet to get from any blown rain in my 8 x 10 tarp. Maybe I have been lucky.

I agree, try cheap poly tarps first, then decide if you want to purchase, or better, sew your own tarp.

Read Jardine's book, he covers everything related to tarp usage. I've been using tarps exclusively for 3-season for a number of years without a bivy and had no problems (aside from the time it was raining and the wind shifted and I was too lazy to get up to lower that end of the tarp because it was our last night and I didn't care if my bag got slightly wet).

Jardine also uses a "bat wing" that can close off one end of the tarp if needed. With this there is no problem with typical wind shifts while it is raining, or if for some reason you cannot orient the tarp broadside to the rain/wind. I hope to sew one during the upcoming holidays.

I have been using tarps for many, many years. I always have one in the ADK's. My first one was an old military tent that the ground had rotted away. After that I got a nylon tarp. Then I spent 13.50/yd on the new stuff, siliconizided rip-stop nylon at ~2oz per yard. Then it was some stuff from Quest at about 1.5oz/yd. Now I am using a new one (about 5 years old) at 1.3oz/yd. Whether I bring a tent or not, a tarp is real usefull. I got a Stevensons several years back, but after three steady days of rain, it was completely soaked. I set it up under the tarp for the wife and myself and got a fire going (again a smaller fire, under the tarp) and we got dried out as it rained for the fourth night. The rest of the trip was great.

Tarps have more uses than just tents so even if you get a largish one, say a 9×12 or 10×12, you WILL find a use for it. After two days of rain, they become very important to just provide a dry place to have lunch. On our canoe trips we often take the tarp and wrap our packs in it. Besides at camp, on the trail, and in boats they work well as floor covers in a state lean-to. There really isn't much difference between an ADK lean-to and a tarp lean-to. Though, the wife still objects to racoons licking her mouth, ha. She doesn't seem to object too bad if I pitch it as a three sided shelter, though…she just makes me sleep towards the door so I get "tasted" first, of course.

Have I been abducted by aliens and missing some time? Didn't even know there WAS a TT Notch until I read this thread. So I went to Tarptent's site and checked it out. Neat!

I have a TT Moment and the Notch looks like a Moment for trekking poles. Verrrry interesting. Now let's see it in Cuben fabric. C'mon Henry, if Ron Moak can do it so can you. There will be customers.

Another use for tarps: covering the open side of an ADK lean-to when it's cold and the wind is blowing in.