Oct 27, 2011 at 7:59 pm #1281209
@danepackerLocale: Mojave Desert
Is the Six Moon Designs Cuben fiber Skyscape X tent (at about 16 0z.) considered SUL or "merely" UL?
P.S. I do realize that there are far lighter Cuben tarps out there but they have no ground cloths or netting. Those items, in my opinion, should be "weighed in" to compare apples-to-apples.Oct 27, 2011 at 10:25 pm #1795852
Classifying stuff as either UL or SUL is tough, as there are many ways to SUL. My personally view is to have a good chance at hitting SUL you're limited to about 1 lbs for a shelter, so the Skyscape X would qualify. I really like the look of the Skyscape X.
My personal weight goals for reaching SUL are roughly:
Sleeping Quilt: 16oz
Non-worn Clothes: 16oz
Sleeping Pad: 9oz
Cooking / Eating: 6oz
That leaves 12oz for hygiene, first aid, headlamp, water treatment, camera etc. This would vary by where you hike and the weather forecast though. In many areas (ie. utah) you could get away with much less than 16oz of clothing in the summer. I did 2 days in Utah recently and it was so warm and dry that in 48 hours I never put on anything besides a t-shirt…..even in the evenings hanging around camp.
Some areas are easier to shave weight in than others, if I had to go SUL (I'm currently at ~6.25 lbs), I'd probably leave the cookset at home and eat cold food so I could put a little more weight into my shelter, sleeping pad and quilt.Oct 27, 2011 at 11:14 pm #1795857
@eugeneiusLocale: Nuevo Mexico
I believe it falls into the XFUL category.Oct 28, 2011 at 2:37 am #1795868
@maynard76Locale: New England
In my experience with tarping if I want a usable tarp it has to be a decent size like 9×7. This will end up weighing around 8 ounces, a little less if you use cuben a little more possibly if its made of something else. I also can not us a tarp were I live without bug protection. So, I have to add a bivy or net tent. The net tent will also weigh about 8 ounces. Again, a little less if you get the most lightest/expensive materials and forgo room.
So I might save a few ounces over the Skyscape X but I would lose roominess ( of the inner) and the Skyscape is a nice simple single piece shelter and easy to put up.
I have the Skyscape trekker so Im familiar with it. I really thought about getting the X but the price a bit too much. I got the Trekker on GS and Im liking it. Ive always been a tarp guy, but between the MLD Duo mid and the trekker for the first time I feel like Ive been convinced to switch over to tents/shelters. The skyscape greatly reduces the problems Ive had trying tarp tents in the past. In the past Ive found tarp tents to be too much of a compromise- bad condensation and limited views and ventilation compared to a tarp/bivy set up. But the hybrid double wall seems like it may greatly minimize this problem ( I havn't been able to use it much as I got it after bug season an have been using mids). Also the ability to roll away the fly and have surrounding views is a BIG plus for summer and I can pull down the fly and have 360 degrees of wind and rain protection. The only downside is the relatively small vestibule space.
But ya I could easily do SUL with a Skyscape X.Oct 30, 2011 at 10:18 pm #1796924
@danepacker: Is the Six Moon Designs Cuben fiber Skyscape X tent (at about 16 0z.) considered SUL or "merely" UL?
We all, I suspect, are going to have our own opinions on this.
In my gear setups I only have a single item that weights over 10 ounces in my shoulder season SUL setup and no 10+oz items in my summer XUL setups.
The only thing over 10 ounces in shoulder season setup is my sleeping bag, and I could likely get that down by half its weight just by buying a different bag, but I am rather attached to the one I have.
No one item in your back is UL/SUL/XUL – it is gear as a whole that either is or is not UL/SUL/XUL.
But with that statement set aside for a moment, for me a tent that weights in at 16 ounces is hard for me to consider a SUL piece of gear. But again, this is just me. If going to a lighter weight tent helps you break the barrier from being a HH to a UL hiker, than sure, it could be called a UL tent. Same applies for breaking the SUL/XUL levels if we carry on that logic of thought.
I had a chance to see the Skyscape X a couple weekends ago and I think of the double-wall tents on the market, the Skyscape X is a serious contender within the UL/SUL cottage industry tent market. If it had been around a year or two ago I would have bought one without a doubt. And I still might for that fact. I had about an hour to sit and really play around with it and it really does solve many of the issues that the other tents in that weight category have. Ron put some serious thought into the small details of the tent and should be commended for it.Oct 30, 2011 at 10:32 pm #1796929
@ngatelLocale: Southern California
Agree that it is difficult to call a single item UL or SUL, it is the total package. To hit SUL with any 16oz item is going to be difficult unless all the "larger" pieces of equipment are really light. For a shelter to work, it probably needs to do double duty as rain gear. For me a SUL kit needs to include shelter, sleeping system, rain/wind gear, and an insulating jacket/vest of some sort. In my opinion a SUL kit should work in the shoulder season also.Nov 17, 2011 at 7:04 pm #1802952
@danepackerLocale: Mojave Desert
It seems that as a COMPLETE shelter, the SMD Skyscape X does qualify as SUL when one checks the weight of Cuben tarps, ground cloths and netting and adds them all up.
As tent designs go it is very versatile and light, especially for a hybrid (partial double wall).
Ten years ago a one lb. tent was still a pipe dream so we have come a long way.Nov 17, 2011 at 10:12 pm #1802999
@biointegraLocale: Puget Sound
If you can take a 4 lb. tent and have the rest of your pack contents and pack be less than 1 lb., than it too could be an SUL tent, eh?
IMHO, SUL = SUP (sum of parts = sub-5).Nov 17, 2011 at 10:24 pm #1803003
drowning in spamMember
The complete shelter argument holds water under some conditions. For example, the Zpacks Hexamid starts off quite light, but my Hexamid gains quite a few ounces once I add the bathtub floor, door and pole…around a total of 1 1/2 pounds I believe. The need to carry 8 stakes can make it heavier than some other systems too.
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