UL packs with “real” hipbelts?

I really admire all you men who are comfortable with no hip belts on your packs! If it's comfortable for you, go for it! However, most of you seem to have forgotten that men and women are built differently, and I'm not referring to the obvious differences :-).

As a general rule, men have their primary strength in their shoulders. With women, it's in the hips. Our center of gravity is also different–for most women it's lower than for men–which is why most of us load our packs differently. What works for most men isn't necessarily going to work for most women!

I can't carry even an 8-lb. pack without a supportive hipbelt. My shoulders are very pressure-sensitive, and without a hip belt and load lifters, the result is excruciating pain. I suspect this may be a genetic thing, not just sex or age, because my grandson (age 11) has exactly the same problem.

The pack I have (Six Moon Designs Comet, 2005 model) has a good hipbelt–at least it's comfortable for me. It has two straps connecting the belt to the pack, at top and bottom. I can adjust those straps to achieve the conical effect (narrower at top than at bottom) needed for my (ample!) hips. It also has enough padding to keep my hip bones happy. The newer model that came out in 2006, on the other hand, has a very minimal hipbelt with very little padding that cannot be adjusted for my shape as can the older model. Interestingly, although the 2006+ model (since discontinued) has a far more minimal hip belt, it weighs more than my 2005 model!

Sumi, please let us know if ULA can come through with a satisfactory hip belt. I can tell you that you definitely are not the only person with your problem!

You may have a point, Mary, but there are plenty of men who insist on belts and plenty of women happy to hike without them. Onesuch is Mrs. Ray Jardine.

"To Jerry Adams> "I don't believe hipbelt necessary." Yeah, right Jerry. and two shoulder straps are one too many!

Ya know, mimimalism sometimes becomes "Psycho Lite" A padded hipbelt is "necessary" on any pack where you are out for more than a day with more than 20 lbs. total weight. It is why we have frames in packs. Not just to give them some shape but to TRANSFER weight to the hipbelt. Great invention the modern padded pack hipbelt – puts pack weight on the largest bones and muscles of the body. "

Like I said

with 20 pounds max

which is 4 nights for me

I do maybe 13 miles a day max

Also no frame

Works for me, and some other people I've noticed

One shoulder strap?

That's an interesting idea

Thanks for bringing that up

I'll have to try that : )

I can reason with you on this one. I hate my entire load always feeling as if is directly on my shoulders and the ability to comfortably transferee the weight makes most backpacks cumbersome in the way it is done.

The only pack I have used that takes care of everything and is extremely comfortable is Arcteryx packs with the "Load Transferee Disk" . Although not ulta light, it is a dream.

The next option would be to try on the Black Diamond packs with the same type of transferee system. Black Diamonds disk is much smaller and does not do that well of a job. It has more of a jarring feeling as it works well until the load on the small diameter of the circle stops carrying the weight and the weight of the pack suddenly falls from shoulder to shoulder as you step.

The Arcteryx is a dream and the weight you are holding will feel like nothing with its massive overly built hipbelts.

Theres a BPL pack in size small in gear swap right now.

Sumi,

You said "What I see in hipbelts designed for women is a differential between the top and bottom of the belt, so that it has a skirt-like shape."

I'm going to use your words from now on when describing hip belts. What you wrote paints a better picture than my use of "conical".

Anyway, depending on how a person is shaped, a skirt-like shape of some degree really helps with the fit. With a lot of the belts I tried and made I could easily put a finger between the upper part of the belt and my body because the belt had no skirt-like shape at all.

Daryl

Ben, Jerry,

I seldom flame and realize "to each his own" in gear choice is paremount, BUT to
say that hip belts aren't "necessary" takes at a bit too far.

Howsomever I revert to my own byline, "There are no comfortable packs, some are just less uncomfortable than others." (Yes, I love to quote myself.)

Vertical pack stiffeners of some type help in pack comfort. For the vast majoruty of us when those stiffeners can transfer most of the pack load to the hips via a hipbelt it makes for even more comfort. I've always been for short suffering,if I must suffer at all.

Ben, I was quoting Jerry, not you.
V
V
V

Eric wrote, "BUT to say that hip belts aren't "necessary" takes at a bit too far.".

I agree, Eric! Which is why I wouldn't say something like that. A misquote on your part, methinks?

Sumi – Daryl has it right on the money. I also make my own packs – have done so for almost 40 years now. My current packs have hipbelts that are 1/4" thick padding, 3-4" wide (tapered), and conically cut. I've made them for myself, my son and a few friends, and all agree this sort of belt is comfortable to about 30 lbs. Total weight of the packs is about 18 oz. So a big fat belt is definitely not needed, but a wide enough and properly shaped belt is needed if you want it to do anything.
By the way, even with bigger loads (like 50 lbs) I have found that padding beyond about 5/8 to 3/4" of medium density foam ( like real EVA) does nothing for comfort except in the showroom. A little stiffening can help above 40 or 45 lbs, but it doesn't take much.

There are some UL packs that weigh less than 8 ounces. Obviously you won't have a heavy load in something like that, and typically we are talking about 10-15 pounds maximum. In a pack and load of that nature, there isn't much need to carry weight on the hips unless you have a back problem, so there isn't much need to have a serious hipbelt. OTOH, as you start to head out over uneven terrain, or especially for X-C skiers, it is important to stabilize the pack just to keep it from bouncing around. So, even on my packs of 8 ounces or less, I have a non-serious hipbelt just for stability. In one case, I made my own non-serious hipbelt out of lightweight 3/4" nylon strap with buckles. I made some "hip pads" that surround that strap but only at my actual hip bones. That keeps them UL.

One small problem is that some UL backpacks are short, i.e. from the top to the bottom. So, even if you have a non-serious hipbelt at the bottom of the pack, it may not hit your hips at the correct level.

–B.G.–

Sumi, Daryl & Paul,

Have any of you experimented with the horizontally split style of hipbelt? I saw it on a British pack in the outdoor trade show report here on BPL.

Seems to me that it would be even more comfortable because it would likely conform better to individual hip configurations. It LOOKS good and I have a feeling it may actually perform as good as it looks.

Do any of you stitch-meisters think it's worth experimenting with a split hipbet?

That's okay, flame away : )

I say hipbelt isn't necesary

this is a fact because I hike 13 miles comfortably, and Ray Jardine does thru-hikes

many people like hipbelts

same thing with frames

maybe the reason you think there are no comfortable packs, is you haven't tried a frameless, hipbeltless pack : )

Eric – If you mean the McHale type hipbelt with the dual buckles I can tell you that they work great.
Ron

Eric: Hip belt is necessary. If you disagree, you haven't done any long hikes.
Jerry: Hip belt is not necessary. If you disagree, you haven't tried a hipbeltless pack.

Glad you found what works for you. But YMMV, eh? :)

Okay, let's argue about canister vs alcohol now

LOL. I HATE caldera cones! :)

Ben, you don't like Caldera Cones? Really, are you kidding? (or just dangling bait :)

I just got a CC Sidewinder & Inferno kit. So far so good with the Inferno woodburner. Amazingly efficient compared to an open fire.

Tomorrow I'll try ESBIT & the Gram Cracker in different configurations of tablet placement.

But Ben, if ya truly don't like the CC why?

I'm with Ben on this.
The main reason I'm not a big fan of the caldera cone is the bulk compared to my current system (Four Dogs Combination Alcohol/Esbit Stove, Trappers Mug with CF Lid) which including windscreen nestles nicely inside my Mug. The Caldera is more efficient but more so when cooking for two and I'm generally solo.

Eric,

You asked "Have any of you experimented with the horizontally split style of hipbelt? "

I haven't and haven't seen one so I can't even comment.

Ronald,

I have used an upper and lower buckle. Perhaps this is similar to the one you have used? I liked it. My wife and a friend of mine weren't interested in trying it on the packs I made for them, however. They preferred the convenience of a single 2" buckle.

Daryl

Guys, my "hate Caldera" post was just a response to Jerry's post about alcohol vs. canister. With a smiley at the end!! Something lighthearted to douse the flame that Eric started. That's all.

OK, back to ripping hip belts….

Eric – I don't think it's worth playing with due to the added complexity of sewing one. My hipbelts are so light (160d uncoated cordura/1/4" FY20 foam/160d uncoated cordura) that a split design would make almost no difference in weight, and the lightweight fabrics and foam are supple enough to conform quite readily to the shape of the hips. Plus it seems to me that a split belt has by definition less area, and distributing the same load over a smaller area means higher pressure and less comfort.
I have tried Dan McHale's double buckle arrangement, and for bigger loads (like over 35 lbs) I think it works well, giving more adjustablity and a geater ability to spread the pressure more evenly. But unneeded for loads under 30 lbs.

sumi

i just got the absaroka pack because i have light loads for desert hiking but sometimes need to carry 2 or more gallons of water- climbing the red slide out of muley twist canyon in capitol reef is sublime and enchanting but not fun with 20 lbs of water

>> Don't mean to bang on this drum again, but if you are carrying 30 lbs you don't want a UL pack.
>> go to a store and try all the "name brand" lightweight packs you can … most big names have fairly decent hipbelts

I've been thinking about these suggestions and spent a good part of yesterday trying on mainstream production packs. I tried to concentrate on women-specific packs but I have to say that ~40-liter women's packs were few and far in between. They all seemed to be >50 liters or <30 liters. And, even more frustrating, even when the pack does come in a women's version, the stores apparently rarely stock them. I was told, more than once, "It's just like this men's version… but made for women." Well, DUH, that's a no-brainer. But when I asked about the width/shape of the straps and the angle of the hipbelt… nobody seemed to know.

I'm having a women's Deuter ACT 40+10 (thanks, Ty, for the suggestion) and a Gregory Inyo 45 brought in to try on based on trying the men's versions/equivalents.

THEN, I came home and put on the Ohm again… and I have to say that there's something about the simple UL packs that I still really like. While the Deuter/Gregory packs felt so rigid and solid (which, I realize, translates to supportive), the Ohm feels really nimble. I really think that, given the choice, I would still prefer the Ohm with a "better" hipbelt.