Bivy? What bivy?

If I were you I'd grab one of the new cuben-bottom MLD Superlights, size large. You'd be happy as a, what's the expression?, as a . . . backpacker in a bivy.

Take a look at the TiGoat Raven, a larger-sized version of their Ptarmigan bivy (which I have and like a lot).

Now about that shaved bear image floating around my head . . . .

Maybe a larger tarp, so that no bivy is needed?

Interesting post by Ron Moak on the PCT-L: http://mailman.backcountry.net/pipermail/pct-l/2011-February/046232.html
Here's a quote: "…a larger tarp that provides better rain protection you can eliminate the need for the bivy. Three ounces of additional tarp weight can eliminate the need for an eight ounce bivy."

I'd love to see comments!

Thanks for all the replies!

As for getting a larger tarp . . . . well unless I want to go up to a very large tarp (at least 10×10) getting a larger tarp is't an option in my area. I rather liked sleeping in a bivy and am looking to find the right one, not get a larger tarp. ;)

I too opt to skip the bivy in favor of a larger tarp. I dont know how sound an idea this is but that's what I'm doing for now. In my backyard my 8×10 tarp kept me dry in a pounding rain and I'm fairly confident with this setup now for all but wind driven snow. I dont have any condensation issues that come with the bivy and I have palatial space under my tarp. In really bad weather i could probably get a small tarp to make a door and still do without a bivy but I havent tested that. Any other folks doing this?

I used to do that but with the need for a ground sheet, guylines, stakes, and a complicated pitch I've found that that a smaller shaped tarp and bivy are lighter and better protects me from the rain.

Don't get me wrong, I've been using an 8 x 10 tarp for years as my primary shelter an liked it but for where I backpack (northern Minnesota) a tarp and bivy combination is the way to go. At least for me that is.

superlight in large should do the trick, I'm 6' ~ 200# and the regular fits me fine (that's w/ a full length neoair and highloft bag), so a large should be just about perfect

my regular weighs 6.9 oz and that's w/ a full zip (very handy imo), the sil bottom is waterproof and the momentum top breathes very well, but still is very water resistant

I use mine w/ a small tarp and have been very satisfied w/ the bivy :)

I think you probably can't go wrong with a bivy from MLD, TiGoat, Katabatic or Oware, as long as the size is right. All make quality stuff.

My current favorite is the MLD superlight. Good elbow room and comes in large sizes. I know Katabatic has won some followers with its Bristlecone. They're also coming out with a larger bivy (for larger pads) in early April, so might wait for that.

My Bristlecone takes a Downmat 7 and a winter bag/quilt. The larger Katabatic bivvys must be for really big folk?

Aaron said they were making one that would accommodate the large-size Neoairs and other pads of that width.

Ooo that sounds nice!

Thanks for all the replies everyone! I think right now I'm torn between an XL-MDL Superlight or a larger Katabatic.

Now I just have to tell the wife I want to buy one. Anyone got any advice on how to do that?

That's my trick with the wife. It doesn't really work, but what the heck?

I wonder if we could do a 'pay if forward' type thing. Someone calls another guys wife, explains how the husband really needs said gear and . . . ?

"I wonder if we could do a 'pay if forward' type thing. Someone calls another guys wife, explains how the husband really needs said gear and . . . ?"

Great idea! I'm not married, but I'm happy to call EVERYONE'S wives and explain to them, in my own inimitable way, why their husbands need gear and they just need to accept it. More than happy to!

You, of course, will have to deal with the aftermath…..

PM sent to Douglas with my phone number! :P

Sometimes we get orders with notes to email (to a work email) before shipping so they can beat the spouse to the mailbox…haha

I don't care about beating my wife to the mailbox. I care about her beating me after seeing the online bank statement.

Ron is leaving out the fact that you have to add back at least 2 ounces for a groundsheet. And, the lightweight bivies are around 6 ounces, so that cuts down any potential difference to 1 ounce.

The bivy
1. adds warmth
2. resists condensation
3. protects sleeping bag from debris
4. keeps out bugs

^ I think a lot of folks overlook that fact about bivies, they definitely add some warmth to your sleeping system and are a built in ground cloth, they also get rid of any pesty bugs

I've never used a bivy and so have no experience with one. Under an 8 x10 tarp I have trouble envisioning the need for one for weather protection. Do y'all really encounter circumstances where you benefit from the extra warmth and insect protection of a bivy at the same time?

I remain open to the possible utility of a bivy in combination with my poncho/tarp, which I use on shorter trips when major storm fronts are not anticipated. But I do like the extra living space provided by a 1.5 oz polycryo ground sheet. Stakes and cord are virtually the same with either tarp choice. If its warm enough for bugs I'll likely be in my hammock.

I guess I need to try one out and see for myself. Hard to say no to a new piece of gear…

geoff

"Do y'all really encounter circumstances where you benefit from the extra warmth and insect protection of a bivy at the same time?"

many, many nights in the Rockies :) biting bugs are often out pretty good early and by morning there is often a little ice in the water bottle

I'm certainly not advocating a bivy for larger tarps, I use a small tarp/poncho (5×8'), so it's really not a luxury item :) but I think there are clearly benefits to using a bivy

Ah, my experience in your neck of the woods is limited to fire camps and some spike camps with heavier sorts of gear…

geoff

"Ron is leaving out the fact that you have to add back at least 2 ounces for a groundsheet. And, the lightweight bivies are around 6 ounces, so that cuts down any potential difference to 1 ounce.

The bivy
1. adds warmth
2. resists condensation
3. protects sleeping bag from debris
4. keeps out bugs"

My groundsheet weighs around an ounce and a quarter, so "at least 2 ounces" is not entirely true in all cases.

A bivy may add a slight bit of warmth by cutting drafts, yes
A bivy may resist condensation drips, but may be more likely to cause condensation inside it, which seems riskier to insulation integrity
The argument could be made that the bivy itself may collect debris, and make it more likely to dirty your quilt/bag.
If you already carry a headnet for bugs, the last could be a moot point as well.

In the end, it's different strokes for different folks. Both the big tarp/no bivy and small tarp/with bivy setups have merit, pros and cons abound for both.

Try tarp camping in the high deserts of the west and you will appreciate a bivy to keep
blowing dust and cold out of your sleeping gear. In particular, a waterproof/breathable
fabric will keep you dramatically warmer in high winds.