Gear for the Non-ultralight wanting to go a little lighter

Adan, That twelve pack comment was priceless dude. Too funny!!!

Adan, wasn't your pack weighed before The Rae Lakes Loop last year. I thought everyone weighed theirs prior to heading out?

I got my first aid kit down to around 3 oz using the principle of having something to clean the wound, prevent infection (antibiotic ointment), cover it, and having some medications for minor pain, allergies, and diarrhea. If you're bleeding or broken worse than that can handle, the trip is probably over anyway. In that case, use a bandanna or cut up gear and clothing to make a large bandage, brace, or splint.

yeah, we did, we weighed our packs with food, water, etc ready to go. I thought that was very UL of us. :) But then I didnt get to see what mine weighed. i meant to ask but i guess i was having so much fun i forgot. That was my first BPL trip and I dont even know what my gear weighed, anybody remember? I thought that sort of thing would go in my "permanent record" in the grand halls of BPL somewhere.

"I thought that sort of thing would go in my "permanent record" in the grand halls of BPL somewhere."

From what I've read lately, the only thing that goes in your permanent record is how loud you snore……;-)

Adan, I think you had the lightest pack of all….though I was awake most of the night from someone's snoring….(shhh whispers Jack's name!) so I am not sure. I am pretty sure yours was…I could be wrong though

Getting back on subject…

Mary, I'd like to add that I dont mean to discount the advice you've gotten from other folks here. I'm a complete rookie compared to most folks here and I owe alot of what I know to some of the very people in this thread. These folks definitely know their shat and if you follow their advice you will be in real good shape.

Well, the people here seem to know what they are doing. Heed their advise.

I would suggest a couple things.

Shelter:
You have a tarp. Get a light weight bug tent for under it. This should weigh between 2-3#. (The tarp and bug tent the wife and I use weigh ~44oz including stakes and hiking sticks.) Rolling up the bug tent lets us have a dry place in the morning, at
rest stops and at supper. I don't know about black flies, mosquitoes and punkies on the west coast, though.

Raingear:
Get as light as possible. I don't bother with pants. My feet and socks get wet no matter what, that creeps up my pants. An hour into hiking in the rain, everything from my thighs down is wet. My rain jacket covers below my hips. So, I am only talking about 4-6" of leg that the rain pants would help with. Instead, go for quick drying nylon pants, convertables if the weather will allow it. They will dry out in about a half hour. My rain jacket weighs 5.6oz.

First Aid:
Mostly this is knowledge. You do not need anything you are not already carrying. Maybe a couple finger sized bandaids for cuts. Use your Duct tape for any hot spots and blisters…it works. Pieces work good for taping a boiled bandana over more serious injuries while hiking out. Anything else, you have to bail on the hike, anyway. Snake bite kits don't work. Just don't panic, and, get help. Boil water for dressing and cleaning wounds, don't just treat it. Fuel for sterilizing minor scrapes and cuts. Get a book, read it. Any personal needs, make sure you and your partner are aware of. Alergies? Benydryl. Pain? Alieve or tylenol 3. I have diabetes, so my needs will be different from your needs. But, if I get hurt, someone needs to comunicate that with the EMT.

Food:
You need 1-1.5# per person per day of high density food. Bread is out, too much water, too much bulk, take wraps instead. Or, take bisquik and make biscuits. If water is available, all dehydrated vegies, and meats. Rice, macaroni, angel hair pasta. Parified butter, olive oil with all suppers, and so on. Soups, stews, chili, pot pies, etc. A couple BIG bars of dark chocolate. For a week, you will be fine. You *might* loose a couple pounds over a week. Not a big deal. You will always loose weight the first week out.

Clothing:
That depends on the temp, but assuming no colder than 40F, three layers should be fine. I think I would also recommend a seperate sleeping base layer to let you dry out some stuff. Light weight base, a shirt of various thickness(depends) and a sweater of some sort(depending on temp, again.) Probably I would add a down camp sweater/sleeping sweater if the temp is closer to freezing. For a single week?? No, you do not need more cloths than that. Again: 1 light weight, 1 midweight base layer. 1 set of underwear. 1 shirt. 1 set of pants, convertable(from the rain gear, above.) 1 knited sweater. 1 down sweater for camp/sleeping. You might not be real comfortable at 32F, but you will survive. At 40F you will be fine. It depends on the thickness of what you bring. Add layers, or, subtract them as needed.

These are only suggestions. I carried about 25# for ten days. My daughter carried 17#. We came back with extra food (about a days worth) using 1.5# per person at 40F nights in the ADK's. I do NOT consider myself a UL backpacker.

"You dont have to weigh every little tidbit and type it into an Excel spreadsheet. Leave that to the folks that can take their spreadsheet to the store and "buy" their weight down."

I see the spreadsheet as serving a two fold purpose. It allows a person to prioritize what weighs the most for replacement. In this case shedding ounces with fancy rain gear (maybe) or more ounces and some pounds for similar monetary outlay if driducks and a new shelter is chosen.

The second reason to weigh everything is to show how all the little things add up and how much weight and space can be saved by carrying what you need instead of bulk packs. Until many people do this they just don't get it. Performing a similar exercise with your money is revealing too.

Then when all is said and done you have a great packing list so you don't leave anything important behind. I guess that's three reasons….

>The biggest chunks (and simplest to find) of weight are almost always in the tents, sleeping bags, mats, packs, and cook stove/pots. Since these are off the table, you're going to be left finding nominal amounts in food and clothing.

Yeah, this is sort-of true, but I saved 9 pounds eliminating excess weight from those nominal items. Also I agree with Adan that you don't need a scale or spreadsheet. It is nice, but if you reduce weight, you've helped, you just don't know how much, that's all.

You've already gotten a lot of good advice on gear. Here's how I managed to reduce my packweight from the other items.

#1 is my sunscreen
#5 I don't remember what that is and don't carry whatever it is anymore
#6, 7, 8, 9, 13, 16 My first-aid supplies. #7 is immodium. #8 is a sample-sized foil packet of neosporin inside a tiny zip-lock. I have refilled it, if you can believe that, using a toothpick. #13 is Vicodin. #16 I don't carry the moleskin or the foam toe bandage anymore. Don't need it.
#10 is reading glasses. I don't use the little cover anymore. Just stick the glasses in my pocket.
#11 was a large needle in a pencil lead container. I just use a little piece blue foam on the sharp end of the needle now.
#14 is emergency waterproof matches and trick birthday candles. I carry only 3 matches and a couple candles and I had to cut the candles short to fit in the little plastic glitter container I got at the craft store. There is sandpaper glued to the plastic vial for striking the matches.
#12 includes a bar of soap. This whole thing is my personal items for hiking the Pacific Crest Trail. I only used the soap a couple of times. For a short trip I would not bring it at all. The small plastic bottle next to it is shampoo. I have long hair below the waist. That bottle of shampoo will wash my hair 2 or 3 times. I wouldn't bring shampoo on a short trip but on a long one, it is nice to have soap and shampoo if I find a public shower. I refill the shampoo with pink hand soap in gas stations. It works really well on my long hair.

Now that I think if it, I think #5 was DEET. I ended up finding an even smaller container for DEET: A tiny sample-sized bottle of Visine.

I was able to eliminate 9 pounds of non-big-four weight with these tiny items plus also going through every other item in my pack one-by-one and replacing or eliminating any parts of that item I did not need. For example, I did not need the heavy lid on my pot if I replaced it with heavy-duty foil. I like fingerless gloves better than fingered ones. Snip snip. I don't bring a pack towel, I use a bandana for small jobs and for drying off after a shower, I use my hiking shirt.

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I'll be the bad guy here and tell you that you dont need a scale. (nervous silence overcomes the room)

You dont have to weigh every little tidbit and type it into an Excel spreadsheet. Leave that to the folks that can take their spreadsheet to the store and "buy" their weight down. David got it right, what you need is experience, common sense and courage.
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I think the "get a scale" advice is key. It really makes me ask, "Do I really need this?" Without a scale, an ounce here and there was no big deal, but those add up – especially in "ditty" kits. I had a bunch of extra stuff in my pack and it wasn't until I looked at it all in a spreadsheet did it really get through to me. Some may not need the wake up call; I did.

As a lot of the remarks in the thread have been great – don't take doubles of clothes (if you wouldn't wear everything at once, you're doing something wrong). Tops are the big waste IME – base, midweight (e.g. down), shell (wind shell optional – at 3oz, this is where you will get any extra warmth on the move). You don't need that fleece (yikes! just put it on a scale) that you have "extra" in addition to your puffy layer. One piece of everything (perhaps a sleep shirt, depending on climate and how dry you stay during the day – use your experience!) will suffice. It can be fun to see how much you can go without! Testing out new UL pieces lately has been fun as I go out asking, "Can I stay warm with just this vest?" and I've been surprised that the answers have been, "Yes!" Cutting weight can add a bit of an edge to your experience – trust that you'll survive, you can always crawl into your sleeping bag, and despite some discomfort you're having a great outdoors experience!

Piper, my personal ditty bag is very similar. I splurge on a handle for the toothbrush, and I have a little more first aid stuff, more meds. This stuff can add up and the little bottles help.

+1 on a scale and the spreadsheet. It makes you honest. You can see where things need to be tweaked and what to look for with any new purchases. This is where you get down to gram-pickin'. If you save an ounce on each of 16 items, you got yourself a pound. It costs a lot less to tweak the little things like toiletries than say, a sleeping bag– dropping a pound on sleeping gear can cost hundreds, especially if you are already on the light side.

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It costs a lot less to tweak the little things like toiletries than say, a sleeping bag– dropping a pound on sleeping gear can cost hundreds, especially if you are already on the light side.
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Amen to that!

A WM Summerlite Bag weighs ~19oz. For someone already with a light bag, you're talking of a cost near $50/oz.

Cutting out ibuprofen costs me nothing. Replacing my bandages the same. All the other "medical necessities" was free too.

Not a knock on Western Mountaineering––their gear products are impeccably made (in the USA) in addition to being lightweight––but so often we talk about all the progress we can make with this type of gear or that. The right TYPE of gear is often more important than WHAT we ultimately purchase.

"It costs a lot less to tweak the little things like toiletries than say, a sleeping bag– dropping a pound on sleeping gear can cost hundreds, especially if you are already on the light side."

I used to cary my wallet – 4 ounces

Now I carry some dollar bills and several credit cards/license/… in zip top bag – totally waterproof – 1.6 ounces

2.4 ounces saved isn't significant, but added to some other things it is