Liberty Ridge Jacket – Thru-hiker

[Steven Evans]

Quick question…does anyone know how many yards of fabric is required to make this? I've got the kit on it's way but might make it out of breathable cuben if I have enough.

[Chris Lucas]

I could measure my fabric for sure if you need me too but I recall it being around 2.5 yards. Can't wait to see what you've got cooking!

[John Donewar]

Steve,

I was just looking at these kits, especially the shell kit, on Thru Hiker's site.

Can the patterns be bought without purchasing the material?

What is the weight of the breathable cuben fabric as compared to the M50 fabric?

What actually makes the cuben breathable? Is it perforated with many microscopic holes?

I'm a hiker on a budget. I'm interested in the bang for the buck vis a vis cuben vs M50 vs $ per ounce.

Steve, will this be done on your machine or Miss Helen's and who will be at the controls? ;-)

Party On,

Newton

Edited to answer my own question regarding the pattern availability.

Note: The pattern is not available for purchase from Thru-Hiker by itself.

[Brian Senez]

A size medium takes 1.5 yards of fabric. I have made six so far using different materials.

[Christopher Zimmer]

I just measured the fabric I got in my kit and it was just short of 2.5 yards.

Chris

[Jim Colten]

Thru Hiker kits usually come with a sheet suggesting how to layout the pattern pieces on the fabric for cutting. That may or may not be usable since the cuben fabric width is less than that of the nylon supplied with the kit but you can try it out by marking a space on your floor that is as wide as the cuben would be (or use tape or string) and lay the cut pattern pieces inside that area. (remembering that you'll need to cut 2 fabric pieces for the arms)

[Rob Hubbard]

Breathable cuben…I thought this was a mythical fabric which hadn't been produced yet?

[ziff house]

cuben is two mylar sheets, it's hard to see how to make it breathable, easy to see how to make it leaky.

[Jerry Adams]

WPB Cuben – http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=41104

[Patrick Matte]

Anyone know the finished weight of a medium?

[Brian Senez]

The finished weight of a medium:
.76oz M50 with stretch lycra wrists and waist: 1.8oz
1.1oz RS nylon with 1/16" shockcord wrists and waist: 2.3oz
1.3oz Sil nylon with stretch lycra wrists and waist: 3oz
2.0oz Dri Ducks material with hood and 1/16" shockcord wrists and waist: 4oz

The stretch lycra is much heavier than the shockcord. I could shave almost .5oz off the M50 jacket switching to shockcord!

I am currently working on a jacket which should come in at 1oz using .33 cuben, M50, and nanoseeum netting in different areas. It is a tricky project due to the delicate material and my limited skills!

I have two jackets in the 1.1oz nylon and another from fleece (12oz). My favorites that get the most usage are my green RS nylon jacket and my M50 jacket. I will eventually make another M50 with a hood and using shockcord. The material is quite difficult to work with though and I am in no hurry.

The wrinkles are explained by my storage technique: crumple and stuff.

[Steven Evans]

Thanks guys, I think I should be good.

I've got ~2 yards of the CTB1B3-1.0/NF (30.6 g/m^2) coming next week. An additional 9 yards of CTB0.3B3-1.0/NF (not sure of the weight yet) is coming at the end of the month – apparently they've never made it that light before so I'll be sure to let you guys know how it performs.

Jon,
I don't have many answers to your questions other then it will probably be made by the greatest mom in the world :) Javan has worked with CTB1B3-1.0 (48g/m^2) so maybe he can chime in. I will update as I find out more info. Also, I asked Paul if you can buy just the pattern and he said I couldn't so I bought the kit and figure I'll use the material for something else.

I'll also add that I believe, but not 100% positive that this material is waterproof/breathable as opposed to M50 and M90 which is water resistant/breathable…so they are 2 different beasts.

[ziff house]

I gather you have the inside track on this stuff, CTB0.3B3-1.0/NF not even listed on their product sheet.

[Tim Marshall]

They are still in a testing stage with this material. I know a number of cottage guys are making some test pieces with it. the lightest stuff Steve got should have the best breath-ability of any of the new WPB laminates as there is less spectra to inhibit breathing. I was thinking of getting some too but it wouldn't work for my quilts so it would have just went on the big pile of "for me" projects that i have had material for over 2 years now to work on. no point in putting more money on the shelf. i am excited to see how Steve's new bivy (i'm sure there will be a new bivy) and rain kit will work out. Because this is still in testing they don't have the 9m order limit so this is the time to contact them about getting some (not sure if they will but i'd guess yes) as they are willing to run short batches to work on their process and get some feedback on the material. (hope Jon H doesn't punch me in the face for telling you all to give him a call) Jon is claiming breath-ability on par with the major players

bellow are the stats he sent me (he made it sound like it was fine to share this info, if i hear otherwise it may disappear)

"Here are some performance numbers for one of the W/B products we have developed.
– Cubic P/N: CTB1B3-1.0/NF
– Weight: 30.6g/m^2
– Waterproofness: ~9,000mm of hydrostatic head at 100mm Diameter
– Tear strength: ~45 N
– Breathability: ~1100 g/m^2 / 24 hours @ 75°F & 47% RH"

-Tim

[Steven Evans]

So I'm gonna start this tomorrow, but I have another question. How do I know what size I am if I can't try it on? I'm probably the biggest size because of my height and I wouldn't mind it being a little baggy to help pump any heat out, but any of you guys who have made one care to comment?

I'm 6'3" and ~185 lbs for reference…XL?

Thanks!

[Javan Dempsey]

I've worked with both the CTB1B3-1.0 and the CTB1B3-1.0/NF.

There's a bivy collabo between myself and TiGoat in the works using the NF. ;) It weighs essentially the same as 20D Intrepid/Momentum, and does appear to be very breathable. The durability for this type of use seems completely adequate from what I've seen so far, but that doesn't include any significant field testing yet.

One disadvantage of the CTB1B3-1.0 is that it can't be bonded, period. It could be dielectrically welded or laser welded, but I don't think it would be very strong. However since the spectra is ptfe coated on both sides, it seems to be more resistant to tearing than the mylar faced stuff.

One quirk of both fabrics though, is very high bias stretch. I'd be really interested to see some in an HB configuration with a very light spectra core, but I'd be very afraid to see the price tag!

Another awesome thing about the NF stuff is that the color shows well on the non-ptfe side.

And yes, it's definitely waterproof. I'm kind of confused by the MVTR/HH numbers I've seen, but I"m guessing it's just because they're realistic instead of hypothetical test-magic that the normal WPB manufacturers comes up with.

[Steven Evans]

I feel like I got bumped down too fast for a response…

Starting my LR in a few hours…How do I know what size I am if I can't try it on? I'm probably the biggest size because of my height and I wouldn't mind it being a little baggy to help pump any heat out, but any of you guys who have made one care to comment?

I'm 6'3" and ~185 lbs for reference…XL?

Thanks!

[Adam Rothermich]

I'm 6'0", 180 lbs, and the large fits me well. The length in the sleeves and the torso is good and its loose but not baggy. You would probably be best off with the XL, especially if you have long arms, like I do.

Have fun! The only thing that bugs me is that the zipper doesn't go down as far as the one on my Kinsman jacket. Plus the fact that the LR is only useful for 2-3 weeks here. We only had 1.5 weeks of spring last year and probably about the same of nice fall weather. But during those 2-3 weeks I love my LR!

Adam

[Steven Evans]

Adam,
Thanks! Exactly what I was looking for. I'll go with the XL and let you guys know how it goes. I'm gonna give it a try on my own and call in mom when things hit the fan. :)

[John Donewar]

Steve,

>>I'm gonna give it a try on my own and call in mom when things hit the fan. :) <<

Outstanding!

Miss Helen is an outstanding MYOG resource. You'll do great. One stitch in front of the other, speak softly to your sewing machine and make friends with your seam ripper. ;-)

Post pictures of the jacket being worn if you can find a suitable model. ;-)

Good luck. Looking forward to seeing the finished jacket.

Party On,

Newton

[Henk Smees]

>>You'll do great. One stitch in front of the other, speak softly to your sewing machine and make friends with your seam ripper.<<

@John. LOL – Totally agree on speaking softly to the sewing machine but…… I honestly don’t think Steve wants to become too close friends with the seam ripper :). Not a good idea when working with garments that is supposed to be WPB.

@Steve. Yes. Pictures would be nice.

Henk Smees
TFD

[John Donewar]

Hi Henk,

>>LOL – Totally agree on speaking softly to the sewing machine but…… I honestly don’t think Steve wants to become too close friends with the seam ripper :)<<

On the subject of the seam ripper I am in total agreement. ;-)

Used in the way a seam ripper is designed to be used it could hurt as much as help when working with WPB material. But for the occasional "doh!" using the point to gently pick out one stitch at a time until you have retreated enough to forge ahead again it is a necessary evil.

Ask me how I know! ;-)

Sew enough spinnaker, silnylon and .9 oz DWR ripstop and sooner or later a seam will have to be ripped/picked out and redone. It is all part of the experience.

Have a great day Henk. I am on my way out the door to go on a my first 24 hour "winter" hike. I am usually a summertime hiker. :-0

Party On,

Newton

[Adam Kilpatrick]

Brian-did you ever get a chance to make your Liberty Ridge with a cuben/M50/nanoseeum combo? If so can you post pictures, weights, etc?

I've been thinking lately (mainly for cycling but it would work well for walking and running too) that I'd love a liberty ridge with M50 sleeves and a WPB cuben torso. I find that in anything beyond a short light shower, no rain jacket keeps water right out of the sleeves of my WPB jackets when cycling, and when bushwalking off track gets rough/vertical and the weather is terrible, water always ends up sleeves too as I'm always raising my arms over my head. It might also be a factor that my arms sweat a lot! Thinking I may as well just have windproof + DWR sleeves if my arms are getting wet anyway, and benefit from better breathability and faster drying. Weight would also be lower cf even WPB cuben. In a medium, I'm guessing it could approach 2oz?

Added bonus of the momentum is there are some brighter colours, and on sleeves that is pretty handy for a cyclist, particularly when signalling turns to other road users.

[Brian Senez]

Adam, it was a project that I never managed to finish. I will briefly explain my idea though. The plan was for a cycling jacket with a finished weight of 1oz. I wanted to use .3oz Cuben for the chest and collar, M5 for the sleeves, and nano seeum netting for the back. I believe this would work out really well. I think the disadvantage would be that none of the materials stretch at all. It would either have a loose fit and flap in the wind or be very difficult to remove while sweaty without tearing it off.

I have all the materials and many of the pieces cut. I have chosen to focus my energy on other projects at this time. If anybody would like I would be happy to sell the materials (plus extra) for a very reasonable price.

I'm a little disappointed that I never finished this, I think it would have looked really cool at least!

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