Winter Canister/Multifuel stove suggestions

The Fyrestorm reviews suggest it's great on canister but ultra finicky in white gas mode despite following directions The earlier Apex got great reviews for white gas use. I still like my Optimus for gas , but it doesn't take a canister. A Coleman Extreme is my winter canister stove.That Denali is a very odd set-up with harsh reviews at Amazon. Some have been sitting around Ebay for a t least 6 months. Also take a good look at Coleman parts availability. Zilch on many rebuild kits, although some are floating in the aftermarkets. Coleman itself is pretty spotty at supporting these products.

The BIG problem is the jet and air mixing. Very different requirements for these two fuels.

Frankly, I just don't think you can make a single stove which uses canisters and white gas really effectively. And you would have to carry the weight of the tank and pump all the time.

The Fyrestorm is a nice stove, especially with a canister.

Cheers

Thanks guys,

So you think I'd be better off just keeping the Whisperlite for my flyout endeavors and getting a decent remote inverted canister stove?? If so is the fyrestorm be best option for this??

Appreciate any input

Do you burn unleaded gasoline in the Whisperlite? Or just White gas?

–B.G.–

I mainly use white gas but on occasion used unleaded. I have the international model not just the whisperlite.

Keep in mind that this setup will primarily be used in the winter and I will be melting snow for all my cooking and drinking water needs. Was thinking about going with a 2.1L Primus ETA power pot on top of the Coleman Fyrestorm in order to melt the snow a little faster. At 25 oz (including 7 oz fuel canister)it probably wouldn't be the lighest setup, but atleast it could probably melt some snow in a hurry with this stove/pot combo???

Absolutely use the Whisperlite international stove in winter & forget canister stoves for winter. The reliability of the white gas stove in the cold, esp. extreme cold, is unquestioned. Not so the canister stoves.

Also be sure to take a stove platform to keep it from sinking into the snow. Varnished or water sealed 3/16 plywood W/ aluminum door screen holder tabs can be used to hold the legs in place.

Hi Luke

Ok, whether to run canister or white gas (or kero) in winter can be a topic for much passion. However, we can give some facts.

Fact 1: Canister fuel and canister stoves have more energy than white gas. This comes as a surprise to many. Typically a white gas stove can get up to maybe 2.8 kW, while even simple canister stoves easily get over 3.0 kW.

Fact 2: Many experienced walkers and skiers use remote canister stoves in winter. The Coleman Xtreme is the Gold Standard, much beloved of many, but the Powermax canisters are hard to get in some places. Failing that, the Coleman Fyrestorm and the Primus Express Spider are highly-rated choices for use with screw-thread canisters.

Fact 3: Remote canisters will work quite happily at -20 C. Below that you need to warm up the canister a bit to get enough pressure, but that can be easy to do. Sitting the canister in a small bowl of liquid water is a perfect solution.

Fact 4: Trying to use a canister stove at -40 C can be … difficult, but so is doing anything at -40 C. That's very specialised stuff.

Fact 5: (this one is contentious) Once you have used a remote canister stove in winter for a while, you will be very reluctant to go back … Been there, tried that!

Cheers

Roger,

Yeah I am liking the simplicity and ease of use of an inverted canister setup for my winter use. Doubt I will be doing any skiing trips at -40C the coldest I go out at usually is about -20F below that the wife isnt having much fun, therefore I am not either. :D

Yeah I have never seen (havent really looked hard though) for the fuel for the coleman xtremes so the fyrestorm or spyder seems to be the way to go for me. Do you think I would see a big difference in melting snow speed/efficiency when using a heat exchanger pot?? Being as I will be melting snow for everything I will be melting quite a fair amount of snow in a 7 day jaunt.

Thanks again for your expertise.

Roger, I think Luke's situation is a little out of the ordinary, due to the fly-in. It is unlikely that he can transport any gasoline or butane fuel at all in a bush plane. Therefore, he will be dependent on acquiring some fuel when he reaches a village near his destination. The likely forms of fuel available will be unleaded auto fuel or maybe some others, like diesel.

Ideally, he could find one stove solution that could work for either butane or liquid fuel, but as you've pointed out, that is unlikely. Then he has to go to Plan B, which is having one good liquid fuel stove for the fly-in, and having one good butane blend stove for things closer to home.

I'm old school, also. I've tried to depend on butane blend stoves for different situations, and I suddenly get surprised by unexpectedly high fuel usage. I can't explain it. Things seem much more predictable with white gas. I'm sorry.

–B.G.–

The Coleman Fyrestorm, Primus EtaPower MF or Primus OmniFuel are all multi-fuel stoves. I've used all three and they all work okay. The Fyrestorm has the advantage in the cold that the canister is held in an inverted position, which is essential in temperatures much below freezing. With the others the canister has to be propped upside down or some sort of stand constructed – and then the control valve is under the canister. However I've used the EtaPower on ski tours in Yellowstone and Wind Rivers over the last two winters and it has performed well with canisters. I've also found the EtaPower the most fuel efficient of the three stoves due to the heat exchanger pot and the rigid windscreen. The pot and windscreen are heavy though. For solo winter trips I take the Fyrestorm.

Bob,

The problem is not the bush flights out of the villages that won't allow canisters, white gas, or diesel, or unleaded they all will allow you to pack whatever fuel you want pretty much, heck some of the pilots up hear fly fuel into remote cabins with waterbed bladders filled with diesel or gas in their cockpits. YIKES!!! The problem is the commerical flights into these villages won't allow me to take any fuel checked baggage or not and canisters sometimes aren't an option in many villages. You can pretty much count on the coleman 1 gallon white gas being available as well as the 16 oz green propane bottles. I'm thinking I'll just keep my MSR whisperlite for my flight out stove when I am fuel restricted and get a remote canister for all my off highway winter time use.

Chris what do you think of running the Fyrestorm with a 2.1L Primus ETA exchanger pot?? Think this setup would melt some snow in a hurry?? I do like the fact that Coleman actually advertises the inverted can where as the Primus Spider doesn't thus the control being on the ground when the canister is inverted, however that spider is also half the cost of the Fyrestorm. The Omnifuel stove looks interesting and I think I read somewhere that there are two different jets you can run depending if you are running liquid or canister fuel. Not sure how much of a pain it is to swap jets, but it is an interesting concept. Oh decisions decisions.

Luke, I haven't tried the Fyrestorm with the Primus ETA pot (I must test that) but I doubt it would speed up snow melting very much. It would probably be more fuel efficient (I say probably because some of my tests show that some heat exchanger pot/stove combinations can be less fuel efficient than using the stove with a non heat exchanger pot! – much depends on the relationship between flame spread and heat exchanger width). Also, I find the best way to melt snow is slowly, with the flame turned down, as this is very fuel efficient. I haven't found a roaring flame melts snow much faster than a lower one but it does use up much more fuel.

The OmniFuel has three different jets plus a multitool for changing them. The jets are very small and fiddly to fit. I wouldn't like to do it with cold fingers. It would be my third choice after the Fyrestorm and EtaPower.

Hi Luke

As Bob G so rightly observed, your situation may not be 'normal'. Serious cold, serious snow melting, commercial aviation.

I am tempted to suggest phone-booking one of those 16 oz LPG bottles in advance, taking a Coleman stove designed for the little LPG cylinders, and just maybe the largest reasonably light heat exchanger pot you can conveniently find. The pot is definitely optional, as i agree with Chris T about its effectiveness.

No, this is not real UL, but it might be a very reliable combo for your situation. I know Will Rietveld uses one of those small green LPG cylinders in his igloo each winter. He reckons it works just great.

You would have to do some cunning kludge work to be able to couple an LPG cylinder into a Spider or similar. Adapters can be got from Japan, where the rules seem a bit different (or non-existent). I forget the web site. And it would need serious testing beforehand to make sure the stove was controllable.

An interesting thought: take a Coleman PowerPack 1 stove and hack off all the extra sheet metal stuff. Or do the same to a PerfectFlow 1 stove. Hum ….. possibilities …

Cheers

The Tumekae- Kun Japanese site . Current offerings on ebay
http://cgi.ebay.com/Gas-Refill-Adaptor-TUMEKAE-KUN-Butane-Gas-Cylinders-/370385643652?cmd=ViewItem&pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item563cb46884

This is something new from that site. Lots of future potential
http://cgi.ebay.com/Gas-canister-Adapter-MSR-Gasoline-Stove-DRAGONFLY-/370333545377?cmd=ViewItem&pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item56399973a1

Be VERY interesting to see if it would be possible to convert a remote canister stove over to take the 1 lb propane bottles. They'd work like a champ so long as its over -40C (or F ;) ). Not sure where to find the fittings, but it sure would be a neat little setup for sure.

Now ya got me thinking. Even if there was same way to convert both sides to standard NPT piping or flex hose or something it would be pretty cool. I see no reason why I couldn't the the average hose that screws on to your standard 1 lb coleman propane bottle and if I could find the canister stove fitting crimp one of those on there. I just need to find the fittings as I have all the tools to do something like that at work here. Then do some serious testing with the setup OUTSIDE!!! :D

And a way to convert probably any coleman white gas stove to propane.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=260618481926&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT