Thoughts on Shangri La 3

Martin, John's two pole lashup looks stronger. If you use two on the trail, you'd be wise to use 'em both for the pole I reckon. If Easton and Golite specced 19mm and even those have been known to bend, a single 14mm pole section is pushing your luck IMO.

I don't know Rog. I use a DuoMid with a single trekking pole and it's fine in the wind. How much more stress can the SL3 put on a pole? I would like to hear Bob from BPL.Uk give some feedback on the pole extender used with the SL3. The space that shelter has is superb for the weight. Intriguing discussion and lets here from others about their experiences with different pole setups.

Martin,
It depends on what you mean by a pole extender.

If you mean a section of tubing that slips over the tip of the pole, then there are subtle issues, especially in high load situations.

I found that because the tube isn't a perfect fit to the pole tip, the two will sit at an angle, and that adds a bit of bending moment to the whole setup. Not a problem most of the time, but when it is really blowing, and a CF tube is already flexing laterally, that 5° or 10° angle just compounds the issue, at the shoulder of the tip (a stress riser), right at the thinnest part of the pole.

I tell 'ya, we gotta do some testing.

The pole extender in the link joins two poles together (check the link and the video). I have one and wanted to try it with my DuoMid All I have done in the filed so far is use my supplied 6 in tube from MLD to extend the pole. Which is OK but not ideal. Bob's design would join two poles solidly together. Be good if you had one to compare in your testing.

'Why not use a pole extender ?'

Good question, Martin.

My answer, why buy/ carry something extra that is a single purpose item, when I can use the two poles I carry anyway?

Everybody is different, the pole extender looks good, but I don't need it with this set up.

I've pushed my body weight down on the knot and two pole configuration I use, without flexing the poles and without the poles sliding down.

cheers,
fred

Funny, Rog mentioned earlier that seam sealing wasn't needed due to their hrydrophilic thread. I guess you were lucky.

I sealed mine without any testing first, but a friend used his without sealing in a good storm and got completely soaked from the seams leaking…

I kinda wished I had a SL3 now. It's so cool and pyramidy. I would dye it earthy-brown and feel olden. I would be discussing how I'd use a bamboo pole to make it feel even more natural and how it's light weight as well but no, unfortunately I have a Double Rainbow.

Your 2d photo made things quite clear, Fred. Thanks for taking the time. While the UK pole extender looks interesting, it IS one more item to carry. I'll play around with your technique today–I think that might be the answer to all this.

Has anybody found the chance to tie the tent's apex loop to an overhead tree branch? I expect that it would be hard to find a perfect place to do this, with a strong branch positioned precisely above a flat tent site. But it sure would give you a lot of interior space. I'm wondering how that setup would work in high winds, with the tree branch swaying. It seems like the loop's stitching would be the weak link here. I expect that the loop-to-branch vector needs to be as vertical as possible, right? I suppose one could also run a long cord between two trees, and then connect the tent loop to that. That would allow some slippage of the tent cord along the other, horizontal cord, taking some stress off the tent's loop. That would take a lot of cord though.

What a fun tent this Shangri La 3 is turning out to be!

Edit: My SL 3 fly ('09 version) has taped seams. Also, I just tried Fred's pole-lashing trick. It works perfectly! Another also: I tossed some paracord over a big branch in my yard, and that seems to work to support the fly. However, the nest that is clipped to the fly at the apex now seems to sag a couple inches. Not a biggie, but it does reduce the living space a wee bit.

I see we're talking about two different pole types –

Large diameter aluminum – Leki and Black Diamond
Small diameter carbon fiber – Ti Goat AGPs and Gossamer Gear LT4s

I have no doubts concerning the aluminum poles. Carbon Fiber needs a little more scrutiny for use with large, tall shelters.

I use a Hex 3 and a Duomid, and i've experimented with a few different set-ups. I've tried using my TiGoat poles, but the the bend in them when the shelter was pitched tight, was too much for my liking. I wouldn't be able to sleep for worrying in a strong wind. I prefer to use my alum BD poles with pyramids, simply for peace of mind.
I use the BD pole connecter to join two poles together, and there is no movement at all. It is similar to Johns method.

I saw in Rog's picture of his net tent it was all behind the pole. I wanted to get one of these but my fiancee wants us to get a 2 person quilt and I did not know if 2 could sleep side by side without the pole separating us. The Golite 'floor plan' showed a person on either side and a pole impaling the middle person?

"I have no doubts concerning the aluminum poles. Carbon Fiber needs a little more scrutiny for use with large, tall shelters.

I tell 'ya, we gotta do some testing."

I agree. I have just scored 9 cf golf club shafts off the 'bay at a keen price, so I'll see just how much they'll take. I know what you were saying about a near linear stress/deflection curve on cf earlier, but once the deflection goes beyond a limit, additional weight will rapidly overcome the elastic capability of the shaft. I'm thinking that epoxying some thin steel bands on the female shaft ends will reduce the chance of a catastrophic split starting at the end edge, and epoxying some 2mm wall alloy bands on the male fitting ends at the position where full contact is made in the joint will prevent a wedge effect split developing.

For trekking poles, leaving the locking parts reasonably loose so a gust of wind drives the poles shorter will be preferable to having a catastrophic failure due to bending.

"I sealed mine without any testing first, but a friend used his without sealing in a good storm and got completely soaked from the seams leaking…"

I wonder if this has anything to do with the shift to sil/PU coating. My older hex3 has been watertight from new with unsealed seams.

Nathaniel, you can angle the pole over a bit to accommodate two people to one side.

Very interesting thread! I just ordered my evergreen SL3 with a "free gift" floor. It was a great deal, since I plan to velcro-in my own bug net skirt and door. I like the idea of a PU-coated floor for increased water resistance, durability (my kids will sometimes sleep in this), and less middle-of-the-night sliding than silnylon.

A line thrown over a sturdy branch would probably be the best pole-less solution. But, when suspending the top from a line of nylon paracord strung taut between two trees, I'm concerned about these factors:

1. Nylon on nylon friction in high winds and frequent gusts.

2. A moving attachment to the line to avoid this friction, such as a carabiner, would allow for too much movement.

3. A prussik knot using polyester-sheathed spectra cord might work, but setup would have to be done just right to keep enough lateral force on the prussik to prevent it from sliding. Also, it might slide unexpectedly in a wind gust.

4. A carabiner attached to a loop in the taut line seems like a good solution, but proper placement might be a little tricky and take some practice. To me, this seems like the best option.

Suspending is OK for calm nights but in a wind I'd be putting the pole in there anyway.

Looks like I am a little late to the conversation… I just asked a similar question regarding poles here.

Someone on that thread mentioned using aluminum poles from quest outfitters. I also was wondering if some sort of configuration could be made by shortening CF avalanche probes? I don’t own one, but that might be interesting too.