Down only for winter?

Carry down UL-20 quilt year round. I have only been rained on twice in CA. Once in winter at night and once a deluge of rain and hail in the afternoon. Also, if you're hiking in Sierras, it will get down in 30's at higher elevations year round so the warm vs. weight is still there in summer as well.

Down wins. You've pretty much got to take a swim in a creek or lay in a puddle to completely soak a down bag. Days of rain can lead to a loss of loft, and an sad situation, but that's usually manageable.

I am in Michigan; most of my travels are in the UP or Minnesota. I do a lot of (UL, of course) canoe tripping. I only use down bags, carried in a dry sack. Temps from 60*F to -30*F, only down. Never been a problem, even after 8 hours of paddling in rain and waves. Keep it in the dry sack until you're ready for bed on the wet/humid days, don't let yourself sweat too much, and air the bag out on sunny days.

Edit: I had a wet bag once, first time winter camping, under a tarp, only a narrow foam pad under me. I got soaked. I got hypothermic. It was generally miserable. I was in a synthetic bag.

That was over 20 years ago, and I've never had a soaked bag since. I learned that the most important thing I can do is keep my insulation dry. 4 or 5 days of continuous rain can affect the loft, but you just let the sun beat down and chill a little in camp to let all your gear dry a bit. No worries!

Greg, I think that you having been rained on only twice in CA doesn't indicate that it's a dry state. Merely that you haven't spent all that much time outside… CA can be VERY rainy! In my experience it's a total myth that "it doesn't rain at night in the Sierra during the summer." It's raining right now!

Though when I walked the length of the state, I had only about two weeks of rain in 3.5 months.

California is a rather large state, and it has a number of different micro-climates. You shouldn't lump it all together with a single generalization about weather. I've been in the desert, the valleys, the mountains, and the North Coast. You can find places where down works great 99% of the time, but you can also find places where you'll wish you had synthetic insulation. I've spent a night in a 25-pound wet sponge that had previously been a down bag, and it sure isn't any fun.

Nevertheless, long-time down users know how to take care of their down and how to keep it dry. For cool summer nights with the temperature to freezing, thin down layers work great. For winter, thick down layers work great.
–B.G.–

"Greg, I think that you having been rained on only twice in CA doesn't indicate that it's a dry state. Merely that you haven't spent all that much time outside…"

I think you're being a little harsh, Jack. A lot depends on where you are and what time of year. I can count on the fingers of one hand the number of times I have been rained on in the Sierra in 36 years. However, I do a majority of my backpacking from mid August thru early October, in the southern Sierra. IME, farther north experiences more rain in general, as does the coastal region, and there are definitely seasonal variations. Maybe Greg could've expressed himself more clearly, but that doesn't mean he hasn't spent much time outside.

I have never bought or made a synthetic bag or quilt. ALL ours are down.

Cheers
PS: Sydney, Australia: humidity and rain are a fact of life.

You're being way too worried about getting your bag wet, especially in CA. Using either a dry sack, like you've done, or a pack liner will keep your bag dry in your pack, and unless you manage to set up camp in a dry wash and have an unexpected rainstorm come through you should be OK in camp.

FWIW, the latter situation is the only time I've gotten a down bag wet in nearly 40 years of hiking and camping in CA. Stooopid scoutmasters telling a bunch of thirteen year-olds to set up their tents in a really bad spot.

I live, and do most of my hiking in CA, and much of that in the Sierra. I only have down. I have never got my bag of jacket/sweater/parka wet enough to be a problem, even the time I fell off a log into Roaring River. (Moonstone Lucid got a little wet, nothing soaked in. I on the other hand…)

It can rain here. I have spent much of the past three months in the rain every chance we had to go hiking. Two straight days a couple weekends ago. Three straight days two weeks prior to that.

The Sierra can get afternoon thunderstorms often. All-nighters are not common but when they happen it is a pounder with light show. But I sleep in a tent so am protected.

I am heading out tomorrow morning into a snow storm with a new tent to try out (a 3-season, not a winter tent) with my down everything. Bag, jacket, bala, mukluks. Yippee!

I will be (hopefully) at Tamarack Valley (SJSP) if you want to join me…

Ah, you are up north. Read too fast.

Hey Raymond! I love the Sierra, I do a total of around 250 miles a year out here. Thanks for the invite, but work has me pinned up for the next week or better. You are right the past few weeks (maybe a month) has been all about wet (or snowy)hikes. I will look up Tamarack Valley. I am always looking for new places to go. Give me a trail report and some logistics when you get back.

moweryaviation at yahoo

Good morning Andrew,

Yeah I edited the post after realizing that you are up north. I am going to San Jacinto State Park, my favorite local mountains as I live in Huntington Beach. It is 4:45 am right now and I am waiting for the coffee to kick in and then I am out of here.

I am with you though. The Sierra Nevada is my favorite place on Earth, and I like the east-side best. I will shoot you an email, maybe we can meet up on a Sierra hike sometime.

Have a good weekend all.

Yes, I could have been a bit more clear. I was talking the Sierra vs. Ca in general. And I do about a trip a month, year round so I have quite a few data points. Point about down working fine year round in CA still is valid, in my opinion as always.

Thanks for the input Greg. The couple years of being out here has shown me the advantages of a drier climate. Even if it does rain, and I do get soaked (or fall off of a log…..guilty) I found that I tend to dry very quickly. You are absolutly right about the moisture diffrences of the Sierra and other places (north Coast) in Ca. Could not agree more.

I carry a Mont Bell down bag in the height of summer and take advantage of the super light weight. If it's raining and dewy/humid/soggy, it's synthetic all the way– clothing and sleeping bag. I think down comes into it's own in below freezing, dry winter weather.

I live in Washington and it's always apparent to me, as the east side of the Cascades are cold and dry while the west side is wet and warm. IMHO, hiking on the Pacific beaches and Olympics is a disaster area for down. At 45-50F and 90% humidity with regular precip, trying to dry out down gear is a terror.

I hike in arguably on of the wettest places in the world:

Always carry down, never had a problem, but you gotta know how to look after your down.

>>I hike in arguably on of the wettest places in the world:

Somehow, "Annual Rainfall (Fathoms)" expresses that better than inches or meters…

"Somehow, "Annual Rainfall (Fathoms)" expresses that better than inches or meters…"

I never really could relate to fathoms…or leagues. Keep in mind the above are annual averages. A few years ago one small town on the west coast (aka 'wet' coast) received 17.6 metres, or around 690 inches (???fathoms???). I don't know that a synthetic bag would have kept you any drier than a down one under those conditions. There are other places on earth that get as much rainfall, but they tend to be in the tropics where the need for a sleeping bag is questionable!

I agree with the pro-down comments above.

Here in the UK use of down is pretty much the norm for backpacking and it's reputed to be pretty wet here too!

Then again, for that reason, and that the vast majority of wild camping is above the treeline, most folk use tents rather than tarps.

As long as it's not going to get directly rained on, down is great! The weight to warmth and longevity kick the ass of any synthetic but, as Lynn says, you learn how to keep it dry.

I've hiked for days in rain or snow and I've never had a problem with a soaked down bag. I keep it stored in a trash compactor bag that doubles as a pack liner in bad weather and its always stayed dry. People hike for months on the big long trails (AT, CDT, PCT, etc) without any problem using a down bag.

Just ask yourself, has your synthetic bag ever got soaked? If not, then a down bag wouldn't have either.