650 Fill Down

[Ted DeWeese]

I've been looking for a good deal on down fill…

Here are some pillows that (alternately) list the down fill as "650+" or 700, Siberian Down.

http://www.overstock.com/Home-Garden/Milano-800-Thread-Count-Siberian-White-Down-Pillow/3370035/product.html?cid=123620&fp=F&ci_src=14110944&ci_sku=11457823-000-002

The King Size pillow is filled with 36 ounces of down, for just 67 bucks?

Tell me… is this a good deal, or is the rating on the down for such things usually way way off?

If correct, this would be a great way to fill an underquilt for my hammock. :D

Any input would be appreciated!

[Curt Peterson]

I'm looking at pillows for the exact same reason – to build an underquilt. Thanks for asking the question – I'm eager to see if anyone has gone this route and how the quality of down measure up.

Certainly some DIY'er has gone this route???

[Ted DeWeese]

Since posting, I've been looking at quilts, too.

Seems like you can get some REALLY good deals on 700 or 700+ fill down items right now…

Many ads actually list the weight of the fill, as well. For most, (if the fill weight is accurate) the cost of the down would come to around $1.75 to $2.50 per ounce!!! I still have some doubts whether the listed weights are really the fill weights, or if they're for the entire item, which would make quite a difference.

Ultralight folks seem to prefer the 800 to 900 fill power for obvious reasons, but for the cost difference I'm not sure I'd mind an extra ounce or two!

[Nicholas Miller]

This has been discussed here before, but I couldn't find anything with the search. If my memory is correct the problem comes from the down-to-feathers ratio, down being much better at insulating due to its puffy three-dimensional structure. Feathers are needed in a pillow to provide firmness because a pure down pillow would compress too much to be much comfort to your head. A quick google search pulls up pillows as low as 5% down with the highest I found at 50% down. I think there's some sort of regulation as to what minimum percentage of down must be included before a pillow can be labeled as a "down" pillow(perhaps internally enforced within the down industry or through gov't. regulations, I don't know), but I couldn't find any info on that.

The point being, that maybe the down that is in the pillow is 650-700 fill or whatever is advertised, but the down/feather mix will have much lower fill power, much less ability to insulate (for a given weight), and essentially impossible to separate the two without driving yourself mad. I would guess that "fill weight" when used indiscriminantly refers to total weight of down/feathers. However, I'm not sure how the down/feather ratio is calculated (by weight, volume, etc?). Volume would hardly be fair because then a 50/50 ratio would have a very miniscule amount of down. Weight would be my guess. Maybe someone with some knowledge of the down industry can chime in?

disclaimer: I looked at this before buying down from the various sellers, but never actually cut open a pillow to find out! A 50/50 ratio wouldn't cut the fill power in half, because the feathers do have some volume but I would guess that fill power would no longer be a meaningful way to evaluate insulation. Even if feathers provide X amount of volume per ounce, their structure doesn't seem like it would provide similar convection, radiation, etc. insulation properties.

[Ted DeWeese]

Those rascally sneaks! ;)

Thanks for the thorough explanation. So… It's back to the 3-ounce-per-bag specialty shops!

I found the listing for "down" under the wiki, but can't find a listing of down suppliers here. So far, a search brings sup one supplier.

Do you happen to know of a supplier listing for such things?? Preferably the list that has 800+ down for $2 per ounce. :D

Thanks so much! You've saved me from a fair bit of difficulty.

[Nicholas Miller]

I've used Thru-hiker, Speer Hammocks and Seven Wonders, each for different projects. Thru-hiker and Speer are involved with the outdoor, MYOG communities, so it's nice to support them. On the other hand, Seven Wonders sells by the ounce with reasonable shipping which is good for smaller projects (though last I looked they were out of the 800 fill power). And sadly, none of them are $2 per ounce!

[James Mudler]

Speer hammock (900) or Thru-hiker (800) are your popular choices. Ed at Speer is one was awesome to work up a group buy and I will buy from him again.

I do not know the weight, but these prices are worth a call. Several people on the hammock forum have used them.

http://www.feathertex.com/bulk_feather_pricing.htm

Again Ed did 3.1oz 900 for $25.50 and I find it hard to believe feathertex would be "so much cheaper or a like product" or others would buy from them.

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