Scarp 1 High Wind Performance?

I put my new Scarp I up in the wilds of the Southern Nantahala Wilderness this weekend. No wind to speak of, but it sure was an improvement space-wise over my akto. It's so long that my dog could sleep at my feet comfortably.
Don

Thanks for the info Donald. I had heard of more space in the Scarp compared to the Akto, but it's great to hear it from someone who has personally made the switch. Did you ever have your Akto out in high winds?

Unfortunately I don't have any Scarp info for you, but Henry's tents have been discussed in length regarding their wind performance. The Double Rainbow, which I have, has been known to take exceptionally high winds for the type of shelter it is. When properly staked, pitched, and supported (henry added trekking pole grommets to support the arch and cross strut) that tent is very wind worthy. With the Scarp's corner struts and arch pole (like the DR), I would assume it would do equally as well. Add the cross poles, and I believe you'd be just fine in most circumstances. Here's a link to one of the discussions of the Double Rainbow in the wind. There's a video link somewhere on the page. Those pictures and video are the model BEFORE Henry added structural improvements such as trekking pole support at the arch. Again, I wish this was direct Scarp info, but hopefully it helps!

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=4307

Edit: Here's another link for the DR, some of it discusses wind. http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=17149

If you got the Scarp with solid wall interior and crossing poles, I doubt you'd find another tent for the weight and protection.

Hey Travis,

Thanks for the input. I had seen those pics before. I understand the DR is more wind-worthy now, but those pics definitely don't show a tent that I would find close to ideal for higher winds :)

I would only really be bringing the Scarp in windy areas, preferring to use something lighter during other situations. I would want it to excel at handling wind, as opposed to just being able to survive the night. I don't think I would get much sleep in that DR that night!

As you touched on before, I think that it would probably work out for me … but would still totally like to hear from some other users to get more of an idea of the limitations.

Thanks!

Yeah, hopefully you get some input from actual users. Have you tried to contact Henry directly? He's good at responding to emails. He'd be the person to start with!

Did you email Henry about this, or get any other info/evidence? Thanks.

Sam,

I have used mine in 70mph gusts, it did suffer some damage while pitching but once up was fine.

Cheers,

Stephen

Hiya
I have used mine numerous times in high winds (with and without heavy rain) above treeline in the Scottish Highlands and the English Lake district (no crossing poles). One night in Scotland I reckon was 40-50mph plus regular gusts for 12 hours – it was fun to pitch!
Another time, we were blown off our feet and winds were said to be over 100mph on the tops that day. We camped -and it was wild, though it was much lower down than the tops!

The scarp was fine in the wind. A great tent – really solid and much less flapping than comparable designs. I used the lifter tab (short bungee loop between it and guy) on the windward end with a trek pole and 2 guys – this helps prevent the roof bowing down onto the inner roof in strong winds and rain. Also the side guys are needed pretty much all of the time.

The line that Henry supplies with the Scarp* slips in the linelocs when wet and when buffeted by wind. After having to put overhand knots on the tails of my guys on the linelocs to stop slipping (on 3 separate cold dark rainy windy nights!), I changed all the guylines to 3mm braided polypropolene yellow line which is way more solid in the linelocs (and cheap).

*also the supplied guyline sleeve 'ruptures' easily – I found that the core protrudes in places after just a little use and also think that the supplied length is a little short plus no 'tail' past the stopper knot means that the ends are hard to retrieve when pulled into the lineloc – specially with gloves on. This niggle is easily rectified by changing the guys to suit your needs.

I think the Scarp 1 is a great tent – I have shared it with my wife a few times (me- 6' she – 5'10") – once even managing to cook for us both in a storm with all the doors shut!

With them being silnylon, if not careful, the outer zip covers easily snag in the zip – I think something stiffer/thicker might have been a better choice here.

I've never used the crossing poles -after my experiences I don't think it needs them unless in snow.

So… pitching it in more than a strong gale (Beaufort) risks damage, but it can withstand higher winds once up, assuming one has replaced the guylines?

Undoubtedly a good tent, but pity about the pitching. Would be nice if there were a way to safely pitch it in higher winds if necessary.

A lot of "expedition" tents, when get damaged, do so during set up, same reason why you are more likely to damage a sail when hoisting than when fully set up and taut.

Franco

Maybe Stephen will jump in with more detail but the way he explained it to me was that "a crazy wind blew the tent a couple of hundred yards" while he was initially staking it. A couple of his pole sections bend during the tumble and there was some abrasion to the pole sleeve. He also stated "I must say I was impressed with the Scarp that night, it survived 60mph gusts and was steady as a rock."

FWIW, it it were me in crazy winds I would stake the Scarp 1 perimeter corners to keep the fabric at ground level, then insert the pole into the sleeve, then quickly adjust tensions. Not sure how Stephen did it.

-H

Hi Henry,

Hope all so well mate?

On that evening I had the tent pegged out at at the perimeter and had put the hoop pole, I was in the process of putting the guy lines in place when all the pegs where ripped out and blew the tent down the mountain. I had pegged out the tent as much as possible fist but the guyslines cannot got on place until the hoop pole is erected.

When I retreived the tent I used two MSR Blizzard stakes to hold the upwind corners while I got the tent pitched (using 6 guy lines and cross poles. I had an anemometer with me and from what I recall it measured the constant wind at over 60mph and the gusts where much stronger.

My buddies tent got taken out by a crazy gust so both slept under the fly of my Scarp, we did cannabilse his tent for extra pegs and guyslines, in the morning I counted something like 12 guyslines on the Scarp and we used 20 or so pegs.

Cheers,

Stephen

Henry, thanks for your input. That sounds like a much better rigging sequence for high winds than the sequence shown in the video on the website at http://www.tarptent.com/scarp1.html#videos

I guess you must get a great deal of feedback on how your tents perform in various conditions. What is the highest wind you know of a Scarp 1 being pitched in without damage, and the highest wind it has survived after pitching, again without damage?

(Also, at the risk of hijacking this thread slightly, which, if any, of your other tents equal or outperform the Scarp 1 in these regards?)

Sam,

I would say the Scarp is definitely the strongest tent if you take snow in to the equation, but I think my Stratosphire with Black Diamons Expedition flick lock poles is stronger in high winds as its far less likely to suffer pile failure.

Thanks Stephen. Useful to know the Scarp 1 and the Stratospire are likely the most wind-resistant of the TarpTents.

However – and sorry if this is a bit of a "noob" question – what does pile failure mean in this context, and why is it more likely to happen to the Scarp than to the Stratospire?

I think he means pole failure ;)

Cheers Robert it was indeed pole failure I meant to say :-)

I've said it before, Stephen – you've got to get that spolchika sorted out on the iPad :-) Or maybe it's the voice recognition software – Siri gives up on my mid-Atlantic rendition of Queen's English.

I was up close to the Continental Divide with Stephen on a windy night in June. We chose the most sheltered spot we could, but there were some pretty strong gusts that blew through all night long. His StratoSpire 1 was pretty much rock solid, but my MLD SoloMid (chosen for its low profile) collapsed repeatedly during the night as the windward guylines wouldn't hold. I was so impressed with Stephen's SS1 that I picked up a SS2 on gear swap a few weeks ago. I wouldn't put it to the test in sustained 70mph winds, but the (guesstimated) 40mph gusts we experienced that night were no real problem. The Scarp with its cross pole (pile?) setup would do even better, but obviously it's somewhat heavier.

Hiya Stuart,

The iPad spellchecker is definitely a bit ropey, but not as ropey as a six pack of blue moon ;-)

That's because you're drinking Coors :-) Stick with me, and I'll ejumacate you on the real Colorado beers.

Pile failure is a thing (a thing civil engineers concern them with – not that I'm a civil engineer, mind); I just failed to see how it applied to tents.

Thanks for sorting that out :)

I've seen pile failure here in CO but never while drinking a 90 Shilling, Fat Tire, or one of the finest produced by Golden City Brewery (the second largest brewer in Golden).

Sam
Setting up tents…
The way Henry does it on the TT site is the standard way in fair weather.
In adverse conditions , depending on the shelter design, the easy/fast way may not be the best way.
Same for the use of extra guylines and stakes.
Franco