Gear choices for the PCT

I would go with a 20* bag to be safe–you never know when you really might need it(better safe then sorry)….I am sure you are aware of the Bear Canisters you have to carry on the JMT–so a larger pack in this section would be helpful….I would recommend a Mosquito head net also…A umbrella is helpful in the dessert and for the afternoon thunderstorms…

-Jay

In terms of the bag, a 32 degree quilt is insufficient, but it might be possible to incorporate the Ultra 20 into a system that can work. I have the BPL version of the Nunatak Arc Ghost. I used it on the PCT in combination with a small "auxiliary quilt" that I sewed myself that I put inside the Nunatak quilt. Of course, that only works if there's enough girth in the quilt to still cover you with the additional insulation inside. A warm down jacket would likely accomplish the same thing. And it would be easy to send the extra insulation home or ahead in a bounce box when you know you're going to be having warm weather for a stretch.

In terms of clothing, I agree with what you've heard about the railriders shirts. I used a railriders adventure top on my PCT thru-hikes and it was comfortable all the time, whether used as a base layer in the cold, or as my only layer when it was hot. I didn't bring any sort of short-sleeve shirt. I did not have as much luck with the pants, though. I just felt too hot and sluggish wearing pants except in very cold weather. Other people feel fine in pants, though, so you'll have to experiment for yourself.

If you are wearing running shorts, why are you bothering with boxer-briefs? Don't the running shorts have a built-in brief?

The hat you will need for the PCT is also much different than what you need for the AT, as shade is pretty rare for most of the trail. I prefer those ugly desert style hats with the flaps hanging down like the OR Sun Runner cap. If you don't like that, you will need a hat with a large brim for sun protection, and a good anchoring system so it doesn't get taken away by the wind. Oh, and +1 on the bug headnet.

There's a chance I may be thru-hiking the PCT next year too. Maybe I'll see you out there.

Good points, Jay and Chris.

Thom Darrah pointed out his custom modified WM Apache quilt, so I'll look into that. Might be just right.

Bug netting… definitely. Forgot to mention that. I've got a headnet and DEET. I wonder if I treat my shirt and pants with Permethrin before the trip, will it last? REI's website says 6 weeks, which isn't that long when on a 4-6 month hike.

Running shorts/pants: whoops, I meant soccer shorts. No lining. I'm fond of my patagonia active boxer-briefs because they're very spandex-y, and they work very nicely for me. Haven't made the switch to commando yet.
-Chris, what do you use for pants instead, then? Zip-off convertibles? I've got a few pairs of those, but I can't seem to find a pair that I really like. They all have too many pockets and zippers for my liking.

Also, forgot about the sun hat rather than baseball cap. I like the wide brimmed things. I have a couple, but they're all too big since I chopped off my dreadlocks last summer. So many wonderful hats that don't fit… sad.

So Chris, once you get a gear list sorted out for the PCT, I may be interested in seeing it! I figure I'll go to the ADZPCTKO, despite the crowd, so maybe I'll see you there or elsewhere.

Get your permethrin in yard and garden insect spray from your local big box home improvement store instead of the sawyer stuff from REI, as in that form it comes in something like a 2.5% solution rather than the substantially lower concentration of the backpacking-specific stuff. Treat at a fairly high concentration (at full strength it should last 6+ months, and even at half strength may last nearly that long). Don't treat your socks. Avoid contact with your skin and inhaling any mist when treating. Once dry it's OK. As a bonus, it's substantially cheaper that way.

You're not likely to really need the bug stuff for the early and late part of your trip, but somewhere for a 2-3 week span in the May-July period it will be a godsend.

Another thing to consider with your pack is the need to carry a lot of water in some of the desert segments.

A number of people used the golite quilt this past year and did fine with it. I personally think I would have been cold a number of nights in April and early May as well as in the sierras. I used a marmot helium (15F) for the first half and switched to the golite ultra once I got past the high sierras.

I used a long sleeve cotton dress shirt in the desert rather than buying a rail rider's shirt. It worked just fine and was a lot cheaper.

You really don't need long pants in the desert although many people used them. Shorts and a little sunblock will work. It's the mosquitos that demand long pants. Some just used their rain pants for this. I used the cloudveil spinner soft shell convertible pants. Being able to ventilate with the leg zips partially open helped a lot. And they were water resistant enough that I didn't carry rain pants. Sierra trading post has these for sale.

As for the backpack a 10lb baseweight in a frameless pack like the exodus is pushing things. One thing to keep in mind is how much food you will be carrying. When I started I needed about 1 lb of food per day. As the hunger kicked in I carried more and more. By the end it was more like 2.5 lbs. So with my 10lb base weight plus 15 lbs of food + 2L of water = 30 lbs, well over the comfortable capacity of the ohm. I switched to a granite gear vapor trail and was much happier.

My wife and I used a WM Megalite (30 degree) as a quilt on our thru-hike–only the last two weeks did I wish that I had carried some warmer clothes (all I had was a wind shirt and my rainshield plus my hiking shirt). 30* is absolutely fine, especially if you have a puffy jacket.

Unless you plan on hiking the high sierra without resupply (like skipping VVR) or Independence, etc, than you only need to be able to carry around 7 days of food. Load up your pack and see if that is feasible with the bear can.

I would ditch the rain mitts until northern WA, otherwise your current clothing list seems fine (though I would personally go with a warmer down jacket for the same weight as the thermawrap).

I've used one pair of Railriders Eco Mesh pants (original version) for the last half of the PCT, the CT, and the CDT. That's pretty incredible durability. For my shirt, I went to a thrift store and bought a $3 nylon long sleeve button up. Worked well.

Funny you should ask about what pants I used — they were convertible nylon pants from REI. They worked fine, but I think I can find a lighter set up for my next thru. I'm thinking of either just wearing my rain pants, or if that proves too uncomfortable, using some sort of light nylon over-pants to wear over shorts. I'd get the BPL thorofare pants for this, but I'd prefer not to have the pockets. I'll probably start a new thread about that sometime soon to try to track down pants like this — I want brushed or supplex nylon, not the stuff usually used in windbreaker pants.

I'm doing a thru-hike this upcoming year, but I'm not sure which trail yet. If it's the PCT I'll do my best to get to the Kick-off and look you up.

Zack, did you and your wife use a single Megalite as a shared quilt? If so, I would imagine that your shared body heat made that more workable than if it were used for a single person. I'm sure some people can get by doing the whole trail with a 30* quilt and nothing else, but I bet they're in the minority.

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I live in CA and am in the Sierra every chance I get. Dave (BIL) and I are piecing together the PCT and have done the JMT and/or sections of it many times.

I will agree that a 20 F bag is a good choice. I am using an Arc Alpinist now and had it up near Tahoe a few weeks ago where is worked great. (It only made it to 29 F and I was too warm.) It can drop below freezing any time during the summer. Mr. UL Dave has been surprised a few times to his chagrin. (He often packs too light.)

I am not UL and can’t advise as to the pack but keep in mind you need a bear canister for much of the Sierra portion of the PCT. As they are having bear problems right now around San Gorgonio that may be extended south by the time you start. (I think the Forest Service would love to see it state-wide.) That said, I have never had a problem with bears, and I have been hiking the Sierra since 1978.

Email me for a write-up I did about Permethrin, including link to cheap stuff. (By the way it won’t hurt you on socks any more than on shirts, pants or hats. It just has to be dry before you EVER let it touch your skin, as James pointed out.) And the commercial BUZZ-OFF fabric is soaked in something around 25% solution to give it the one-year life. (25 washings it said on my Ex Officio Baja shirt.)

rayestrella (AT) hotmail (DOT) com

My wife and I just unzipped the Megalite (24oz) to use as a doubles quilt. We've since abandoned that set-up as it was too drafty in between our heads/shoulders. It's just too hard to seal the top off, as opposed to using a single quilt and cinching it around your neck. She now uses a 20* Nunatak quilt (16oz) and I use the unfortunately discontinued WM Pod 30 (17oz). We justify the extra 4oz. per person with the added warmth.

I still stand by my statement that a 30* quilt is just fine for the PCT, assuming that a puffy jacket is thrown into the mix. I think that is much more versatile than going with just a 20* bag/quilt and no puffy jacket, and isn't as redundant as a 20* plus a puffy jacket. The CDT is all around colder than the PCT, and my 30* top bag was never insufficient.

This is just my opinion on the backpack, but long distance hikes I was more interested in flexibility than gram counting. I section hiked a few parts of the PCT using a larger framed pack that could deal with all the conditions I would throw at it, such as 10 days of food, a bear can, or 5 liters of water. I would not take a framless pack, but that is because I would rather carry the extra 20 oz in order to not have sore shoulders after a 25 mile day.

I would be leary of any specific sleeping bag temperature rating suggestions. Instead, look at the temperatures you expect to encounter and plan accordingly. I saw frost quite a bit. For me, I would want a set up that is good right to 30 degrees. If you need a 0 or a 40 degree bag, then so be it. You can research various journals to see what temps others encountered based on the time of year. Yes, you can hit storms that drop the temps colder than you would expect. I would leave my clothing out of the equation to provide an extra margin of safety to cover those events, but you can push it and live if you can handle being a bit cold for a few nights.

One suggestion is a bivy or a bug net of sorts, especially if you quilt in socal. The desert has all sorts of bugs. I found a small scorpion under my clear groundcloth one morning. It wasn't a problem, but it did scare me the next time I cowboy camped! Speaking of which, if you like to cowboy camp, you'll very rarely set up your shelter, especially in socal.

Your clothing list looks very good. That is a versatile assortment that will get you through the conditions you'll encounter in an average hiking window. I brought convertible pants rather than shorts, but I don't like to expose my legs to sun or bugs. Then again, I never used sunblock or DEET out there. Ever. I did use sungloves and sunglasses instead. I always covered up and I was well protected. Shorts will work fine though.

As for the shirt, I used a Mountain Hardware Canyon shirt. Lots of mesh, soft rubber buttons, tall sun collar, and lots of pockets. A rail riders shirt would be very similar and probably better ventilated.

Great advice so far. Thanks, and keep it coming! Except that talk of state-wide bear canisters. That would be a pain, huh?

I'll be able to switch gear out at various points by mailing things. I already figure I'll be leaving the rain shells out for the desert section, for instance. I also wonder about leaving the rain pants out altogether– I never wore rain pants on the AT, despite the rain, but since then I've used them quite often, especially over shorts. I don't think they'd be too comfortable over another pair of pants. I might need to check that out.

So I've got the sleeping bag figured out. I'm going to find something in my house that has similar dimensions to a bearvault to see if I can simulate the weight and bulk that I might be carrying.

I can always use more ideas for clothing options. I like the permethrin idea… hopefully I'll be able to find some. Now if only I could find a place nearby to test out railriders (looks like the closest is Boston) or thorofare clothing.

Anybody have any thoughts on bounce boxes?

I missed the rain pants and gloves. I would leave those out until OR or WA. I never used either in Socal or the Sierra. They both saved my bacon many times in Washington during the normal hiking season.

I'd consider carrying rain gear for SoCal. Around Idyllwild we got rain and snow for 2 days and those that didn't have much of a shelter or rain gear because we were in the desert had to rely on those who did. We also got 2 days of rain around Warner Springs that was COLD. Just sayin'…

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First off, good luck on your upcoming thru hike!

My 2c on gear:

Sleeping bag: I used a 32 degree down bag+ clothing and that was just fine 95% of the time. Most people used 20+ bags however. I would just get a high quality down bag 20-30 degree and adjust clothing/bag liners as needed.

Clothing: I heard lots of good things about the railraiders shirts and saw a lot of people wearing them, I tried one out before my hike and did'nt like the way the fabric felt against my skin, I prefer a light weight 1/4 zip base layer.
Pants really aren't necessary for the desert, I wore shorts and only needed sunscreen for the first week.
You really should carry a rain jacket, or at least a good wind shirt for the desert, rain pants are unnecessary (side note- I highly recommend the ULA rain wrap as a lighter alternative to rain pants when it does start to get wet)
I would also recommend picking up some gaiters to help keep SOME of the sand/debris/cactus barbs out of your shoes.

You wont need bug protection to start with but when you get to the Sierras you cant have enough.

I will second the other recommendations about your pack. There may be some sections where a frameless pack would work, but most of the time you'll need a light frame pack.
You can cut your base weight all you want, but 6 liters of water is still going to weigh 13.2lb and after a month your food consumption will skyrocket. 31lbs in a 2lb pack feels much better than 30lbs in a 1lb pack.

lastly, try not to get too worked up over the gear decisions, gather as much info as you can, make informed choices, then don't worry about it. Plenty of people have successful hikes using cheap, heavy or otherwise less than perfect gear, and you can always upgrade along the way.

Lots of solid advice here! All the advice would have been helpful for my hike this year.

While I didn't find pants absolutely necessary, I would wear them again (and I had never hiked in pants before this trip)in the desert section. Between blocking the sun on my oh-so-white legs I felt it kept my legs from being beaten up by all the thorny plants that inhabit the desert. The trail is overgrown in sections and I found pants useful. But many people wore shorts, I kept the pants the whole way.)

On sleeping bags, wow, it is tough to make the definitive recommendation because of a lot of factors go into sleeping bag choices. I agree that for a lot of time a 15 or 20 degree bag is overkill. However, we had legit 9-10 degree weather in the North Cascades in October, and I was glad to have a warm bag. I wore dry clothes every night with my jacket. Of course, I was slooooow on the trail, getting to Canada on October 14th. I think the 20 degree bag recommendation is generally a good ballpark figure.

I am with Dave on the raingear issue. I'd personally be weary about not carrying rain gear in Southern California. You are in the mountains quite a bit. While you could skip pants conceivably but I wouldn't want to be without at least a rain shell. I suspect one of these other PCTers could correct my facts, but it was two or three years ago when a group of thru-hikers sent rain gear ahead (and shelters, as well) and got hit by a snow/rain storm near Mt. Baden Powell.

I agree on the points regarding pack choices. I believe having a pack that can carry a load comfortably trumps all else. I actually increased my base weight as the hike progressed, especially in Oregon and Washington when I carried extra clothing. I was grateful for the stays in the ULA Catalyst when the pack was fully loaded with eight days worth of food….

Have fun!

Dirk

I'm going to load up my Exodus with a good 30 pounds of weight today, along with a waste-basket I found that's about the same size as the bearvault. So if that doesn't work, I've got two options: go with my old Nimbus Ozone or get a new pack (preferably cheap). I don't really like the Nimbus Ozone… maybe I'll try selling it.

As for relatively light-weight frame packs that I could buy if I needed to… REI Flash 50 or 65? I'd rather not spend too much on new gear, and that one seems to be pretty good for weight and cost. The Catalyst weighs the same as the Nimbus Ozone (but is probably better in general), so I don't think I want to go with that. Then there's Osprey. We'll see.

edit, later this morning: I'm currently wearing the exodus with a bunch of clothes wrapped around the wastebasket with 25 lbs of rocks in it (total weight on bathroom scale is 33 lbs). Surprisingly very comfortable! Maybe I'll take it on a dayhike once there's some snow to test it out some more. Obviously, wearing it around the house is not the same as on the trail.

If swapping/adjusting gear for the Sierras anyway, I figured I'd swap out my bag and found that worked well. I used a 20 degree bag for the first ~1000 miles, swapped for a 32 degree bag when I finished the Sierras (mailing home bear can anyway …). I'd go with that same approach again; it was nice having a somewhat smaller and lighter bag from Sonora pass on.

(JMT August)

Dr. Shade "Universal Shade" fits over any baseball style hat and can be removed when you do not need it.

Dirty Girl Gaiters. They actually work very well with low cut footwear.

Golite Reed Pant. Raingear, but used as a long pant for warmth and was glad to have them during a hail storm, and wind and rain.

Railrider eco mesh long sleeved shirt. Wore every day. It's warm at night when it dries out.

Golite wisp wind shirt. Good wind, vapor barrier. Easily fits in a pocket.

Bivy big enough to fit the sleeping pad as well as the bag.

Mitten shells help keep the hands dry and warm.

As it empties, the bear canister becomes a good place to stow gear and keep the pack balanced.

What are you using for shelter? SMD Wild Oasis worked well for me.

Dr Shade… those are some pretty snazzy hats and hoods. I'll look into that. And thanks for reminding me– I need to fix my last pair of Dirty Girl Gaiters, or grab a new pair.

I use a rectangular 7.5' x 9.5' silnylon tarp, and I'm very happy with it. No bivy, which I know might be stupid on the PCT, but I trust my tarp skills enough to have weathered many a torrential downpour under it.

And for that pack… Thinking about it more, I'll keep my Nimbus Ozone boxed up and ready to switch out with the Exodus. I guess that makes more sense– My unpleasant memories of the Nimbus Ozone at the end of my AT thru-hike were because I had it nearly empty all the time, and it didn't carry as well that way. I guess that won't be the case this time around. Like they say… gotta stay flexible.