Oct 20, 2009 at 9:53 pm #1240445
I'm probably going to pull the trigger on my first quilt in a month or so, and I certainly don't want to wait for spring to use it, so I come in search of feedback.
I'm thinking about going with a Jacks R Better High Sierra Sniveller, as it seems like a 25 degree quilt would have the most utility in the PNW, what with cold nights at altitude and all.
Firstly, anyone have a sense of how low you can take this sucker with insulated parka and pants?
Secondly, has anyone layered multiple quilts for winter use? I was thinking of either a JRB stealth used as a liner, or a summer-weight synthetic quilt used over the Sierra. I've read a lot about layering synthetics over down as a way of drawing moisture out of the down, and it is moist here. How did it work out if you have?
any feedback is appreciated.
oh yes, the devilish details: 1-3 nights, either in a snow cave or a shaped tarp (MSR twin sisters)with a gore-TeX bivy. Lows could range from mid twenties to zero. Sleeping on an MEC winter foamy and a thermarest prolite 3/4. I usually have a Patagonia DAS and micro-puff pants as well as some feathered friends booties that I can sleep in.
Discuss!Oct 20, 2009 at 10:45 pm #1538347
Tom CaldwellBPL Member
I think you might need to layer two of the JRB Sierra Shiverers to stay warm at 25F. I've tried mine three times now, and my experiences have ranged from chilly, in shirt, pants, fleece beanie, and wool socks, at 50F…to FREEZING at 30F with a baselayer, pants, wool socks, ID Hot Sox booties, beanie under a an insulated cap, T-shirt, Long-sleeve thick shirt, gloves, and fleece jacket. My Long weighs 25.9 oz with 1 oz "overstuff". It needs at least 4 oz more down to fill the chambers, IMO. You can't even fluff and pet the down enough to get it to spread all the way across the upper torso area chambers. YMMVOct 20, 2009 at 11:02 pm #1538349
"Secondly, has anyone layered multiple quilts for winter use? I was thinking of either a JRB stealth used as a liner, or a summer-weight synthetic quilt used over the Sierra. I've read a lot about layering synthetics over down as a way of drawing moisture out of the down, and it is moist here. How did it work out if you have?"
First, the outer quilt doesn't draw moisture out of the inner bag. At least, not exactly. What happens is that the frost line is established at the point where the inside temperature is around freezing. With two bags, that line may very well be in the outer bag, where with one bag it's guaranteed to be inside the bag's down. As long as the temperature gradient is above freezing the moist air will continue to pass through the bag.
I've used a down quilt inside a Big Agnes bag, and a synthetic quilt over a down mummy bag. The more insulation, the warmer you'll be.
As far as using insulated clothing inside a quilt or bag, I've worn the usual base layer and medium weight shirt plus BPL Pro 90 parka and pants, and I was able to extend the bag's rating from 30F down to 12F. A warmer down parka could be even more effective.Oct 20, 2009 at 11:05 pm #1538350
@lori999Locale: Central Valley
I think that the quilt in question is of the same loft as the Hudson River three season quilt, so it's puzzling to me that it was too cold. My quilts (both Hudson Rivers) are warm to 25F, though I certainly feels less warm at that temp than at 30F.
Draft through the head hole?
Also weird that I tend to be a cold sleeper and I was warm in midweight base layer and beanie at that low temp.Oct 20, 2009 at 11:18 pm #1538353
@rcaffinLocale: Wollemi & Kosciusko NPs, Europe
They have been several recent threads on double-bag and double quilt systems recently.
Basically, they work well.
CheersOct 21, 2009 at 6:50 am #1538399
I have a JRB No Sniveler and a Nest and I'm going to try these two out together for a ground sleep system. I used the Down to Earth Converter and Nest last year into December just fine until the last night on that trip when it went down to single digits. I froze my unmentionables off in the worst way. I spent the Spring sailing and have not yet tried to extend out my sleep system into the shoulder seasons. I don't think I'm going to try it in real Winter though. Anyone have any luck making something like this work?Oct 21, 2009 at 7:04 am #1538402
Troy AmmonsBPL Member
At 0dF I would want a regular footbox. A drawstring would be okay too if you have a draftstopper.
You may want to think about what I am doing.
Golite down ultra 20. I am going to add some down then build and over quilt to fit that quilt, IE it will be bigger. I already have the cloth and have built a tester so I am good to go.
For you, you could just have Tim Marshall build you a Climashield overquilt. A 3.7xp should take a 20dF quilt to 0dF. Should be around 3 yards of insul and 6 yards of material so maybe about 19-20 oz.Oct 21, 2009 at 7:14 am #1538403
@peter_panLocale: Co-Owner Jacks 'R' Better, LLC, VA
If you want to layer quilts or bags for that matter the outer quilt/bag needs a greater girth for the system to reach full loft of both items.
PanOct 21, 2009 at 8:28 am #1538416
Thomas BurnsBPL Member
@nerdboy52Locale: "Alas, poor Yogi.I knew him well."
Another alternative is to spend $10.00 on a Heatsheets Emergency bivy. They aren't made of mylar so they aren't as noisy. Also, they don't tear as easily (although they do stretch a little).
I've gotten at least 10 degrees extra out of my Nunatak Specialist that way. I'd probably get more but I haven't used it below 25 degrees F. The thing weighs only 3 oz, so I don't feel guilty about having it along if i don't need it.
Always looking for the cheap, low-mass alternative,
StargazerOct 21, 2009 at 3:24 pm #1538546
I have been using my JRB No Sniveller since spring of last year when I got it; I love It! Excellent craftsmanship and customer support from the Jack's, spot on temp rating IMO, made in the USA, super versitile quilt/poncho.
In the summer here in the cascades, I use my JRB No Sniveller, Ti Goat Ptarmigan bivy, BMW Torsolite, shorts, BPL beartooth hoody with great success. With lows that reach into the low 30's, this system is plenty warm for my blood.
As far as boosting the rating by adding insulation, my winter system will consist of a Montbell Alpine Light Jacket, JRB hood, BPL beartooth hoody, BPl merino tights, Montbell Thermawrap pants, and a pair of ID hot socks for the feet. I can push this into the teens and easily further;YMMV
With the double bag/quilt idea, you really have to make sure that the outer quilt is larger, so you don't compromise the loft. Maybe look into adding 1-2 oz's of over stuff to your quilt, or bumping up your insulation pieces=) To my crazy mind, the 2 bags/quilts seems super redundant; Not to mention it's not as verstile as a layering system that's been discussed. If you don't forget about the thread, let us know what you decided on and why.
I'd give the Jacks a call or shoot them an email to really dial in your system.
PeaceOct 22, 2009 at 10:21 am #1538744
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