call me crazy, but I like this old army ruck sack

What you need now is a waterproof pack cover to prevent it getting even heavier when you get a soaking. ;-)

If you don't yet have a backpack, then borrowing one seems sensible. If you like it, then fine.

My own experience with a large, heavy rucksack was that it was all too easy to fill it with 'just-in-case' and 'backup/spare' and 'luxury' items. The upshot was that it weighed a ton, and walking any distance , especially uphill or over rough terrain, was made much more difficult, and was significantly more tiring than carrying a lighter load.

Do you really need a 'huge' rucksack? If you look at the kit lists on this site, you'll see that you can get by with a vast reduction in the amount of gear you take. Granted, some of those reductions don't come cheap. Do you need a rucksack with a ton of pockets? Again, this might suggest that you are carrying lots of 'just-in-case' items. You also mention having the tent strapped on top of your bag – is it too big (and if it is, it's probably heavy) to fit inside the 'huge' rucksack? And does your rucksack really need to be ultra-tough?

You might eventually consider a pack like (for sample) the Golite Pinnacle. That compresses down to a small size when you want to stabilise the pack with smaller loads, but has 72L of capacity for bulky but light loads (e.g. winter). As a single rucksack for summer and winter conditions, I think it's a good compromise. I own one. Tough, light, versatile, and it even has a pocket :o) (3 if you count the side mesh pockets). It doesn't have bungee compression on the back, but with the available capacity that's not such a big deal.

For summer I use a Vaude Triset 35L Ultralight rucksack, and I'm pleased with that. It weighs the same as the Pinnacle, so certainly isn't the absolute lightest 35L bag available, but it has a good mix of features and an air-space back system that works well in the heat.

Having said all that, if you are just starting out on lightening your load, you might need that big heavy sack to comfortably carry a heavy load, until you've worked out how to get the load down to a level where a lighter rucksack is a comfortable option.

Good luck.

Cheers, Simon

I actually don't think I'm carrying to much stuff. The pockets are just nice though.

One of my problems is I'm packing my boys gear as well. From what I've seen, there are two main items that require space, tent and sleeping bag. Right now I have a large tent. I have to down grade, but I'm new and things are expensive. I got the tent for me and the boy to car camp a while back so its what I have. I'm also doing short hikes right now so I'm able to "brute force" my way through hikes.

Sleeping bags are the other large item. Right now I'm carring two, one for me and one for my boy. So a large compartment is needed. Actually, I'm just using a pad and sheet, but still, the pad takes up space. I'm wondering if I'm going to have to give up some on my end when I buy a "real" pack. With the ruck, I can put two sleeping bags side by side with no problems.

as far as the pockets, I don't think I'm carrying to much extra stuff, I just like everything in pockets instead of thrown in the sack. I have a pocket for the water filter, pocket for the cooking stuff, pocket for the candle latern, pocket for the GPS, etc.

Right now, I don't really think my list is to excessive, other than I do carry an axe, I just have heavy gear at the moment. My pack is about 30 pounds. My boy carries two pillows and the food for an overnighter. I think he weighed in at 8 pounds. So thats 38 pounds between us, with a heavy pack and tent. thats not to bad is it?

all that said, I just got to thinking and I really kind of like the ruck. I haven't priced them out, but I would think you could get army suprlus rucks for cheap. Just got to wondering and haven't really noticed anyone talking about them on here. But in the end, I'll probably buy a normal backpack.

Don't worry Rob, by the time you are done here, you'll be using the lad's pack and he'll be using a z packs zero. :-)

One comment on your kitlist. How about using inflatable pillows (AKA the bladders out of wine boxes) with a jacket on top. Then your lad could carry one of the sleeping bags and reduce your pack volume quite a bit, to make room for the tent inside. With a cheap and light frameless pack you could use the tent poles to stiffen the load.

I'm slowly getting him down. At his age, he still has a certain comfort necassities. Almost secerity blanket type stuff. PJ's for example. But this last hike, while we packed his PJ's, he just slept in his underwear like daddy. So next time thats something else we don't have to pack.

But one of the things we have to remember is I have a certain image I must keep. Where I'm from, its been dubbed "redneck reviera". I never knew what they were talking about until I moved off and saw how the rest of the world was.

So, in keeping up with my roots, can a man call himself a good southern redneck while packing with one of them fancy, high dollar Kelty or Northen Face packs? I mean, what would the neighbors say? Maybe I could get one, drive the truck over it a bit to rough it up, and make some duck tape patches on it. That way I could have a nice pack but save face as well :)

"One comment on your kitlist. How about using inflatable pillows (AKA the bladders out of wine boxes) with a jacket on top. Then your lad could carry one of the sleeping bags and reduce your pack volume quite a bit, to make room for the tent inside. With a cheap and light frameless pack you could use the tent poles to stiffen the load."

that is actually the next thing on my list for our next hike. Walmart sells them for $7 a piece. Each hike I'm trying to aquire a few more things. Spread the hurting out a bit. It will save a little bit of weight, but a tremendous amount of space. Them pillows are bulky

the other problem with using pillows is getting wet. It rained on us this last hike, but luckly we already had the tent up. So the pillows didn't get wet. But man, if they had, those light, but bulky pillows would have weighed a ton. I'm not going on another hike until I get those blow up pillows.

> can a man call himself a good southern redneck while packing with one of them fancy, high dollar Kelty or Northen Face packs?

Heh, well I scored a high dollar North Face frameless pack off ebay for $10, so you could just attach the ebay reciept to it. ;-)

The main thing for comfortable sleeping is a warm but light mattress. How about a balloon bed each with a piece of thin closed cell foam on top?

http://www.balloonbed.com/

This post is great! Mostly because I have been using a heavy ruck for the last few months. I'm very happy to no longer be using it. Id move on asap, or if you appreciated the ruggedness, and want to keep it for those trips with the kids, at least get a new kidney belt. The one on mine felt like cardboard after about ten hikes.

Hi Rob,

From your avatar and description, your ruck looks like an old ALICE pack. The Army used packs of that style for a lot of years. I've seen old canvas ones from the pre-vietnam era. The Army loved them; the grunts who humped them hated them with a passion. The loads they carried were twice the weight of what you're hauling though, and people kept shooting at them as well, so that may have had something to do with their bad memories.

Several years ago, when I first got the urge to get my pack weight down to below the 45 pounds or so I was carrying, I decided to take my medium-sized ALICE on a trip. Normally this pack was used for hauling stuff on car camping trips. I had never taken it backpacking because it was too small to haul all my normal gear. By choosing to take it backpacking, I was forcing myself to pack smaller and lighter.

The result was that I took my first trip with a load that weighed less than 30 pounds. It was a revelation! The other guys I was with had their normal loads of 50-60 pounds and there I was, skipping along with a pack that weighed half that. I thought I was really on to something.

That was the beginning of my "journey toward the light". Shortly afterward I discovered that there was an emerging movement of crackpots who called themselves ultralighters and carried loads of 20 pounds or less! I started adopting some of their methods and gear choices. I made my first pop-can stove. I discovered silnylon and bought a tarp to replace the Visqueen sheet that had itself replaced my old tent. And so it went.

All these years later with a base pack-weight of 5 pounds, I am getting out and enjoying hiking more than ever before. And I am old enough to order off the senior's menu at Denny's! I owe it all to an old ALICE ruck that got me started on lightening up. I hope your ruck starts you off on a good adventure too.

Good luck!

Michael

yep, you are crazy. i had to carry that POS "professionally" and have never looked back.

in my assortment of packs i have a gregory palisade that will carry more than the army junk, probably weighs less, is infinitely more comfortable, and i only had to pay 100 bucks at the rei scratch and dent. no reason to carry that crap.

>"But one of the things we have to remember is I have a certain image I must keep. Where I'm from, its been dubbed "redneck reviera". I never knew what they were talking about until I moved off and saw how the rest of the world was.

So, in keeping up with my roots, can a man call himself a good southern redneck while packing with one of them fancy, high dollar Kelty or Northen Face packs? I mean, what would the neighbors say? Maybe I could get one, drive the truck over it a bit to rough it up, and make some duck tape patches on it. That way I could have a nice pack but save face as well :)<"

-Well, instead of North Face or Kelty, if you get a backpack from ULA, Gossamer Gear, Six Moon Designs, Mountain Laurel Designs, you're buying Made in the USA, at least. That counts for something, right?

"Well, instead of North Face or Kelty, if you get a backpack from ULA, Gossamer Gear, Six Moon Designs, Mountain Laurel Designs, you're buying Made in the USA, at least. That counts for something, right?"

Maybe…if you're an American…

>Maybe…if you're an American…

Granted, it's a specific subset of American's, (quite often the 'rednecks' of which Rob speaks) but do other countries have that same type of attitude "Buy new Zealand," or "Buy Australian" for example. I'm only 34, but that's still old enough to remember people taking sledgehammers to Japanese cars in protest (riceburners, in the parlance of the day) during the 80s when America was afraid Japan was going to buy the whole country. I have a friend who wasn't allowed to buy a CD player all through high school because it was pretty much impossible to get one made in America. Now it's Chinese made stuff people get all worked up about.

its not so much the buy american aspect as much as them fancy, high fluting, pretty boy sacks that will get the neighbors talking. you know, the "who does he think he is with all that fancy new trail walking gear". But like I said, run over the sack a couple of times with the truck, put some duct tape on it to look like I had to patch some holes, and I should be fine :)

on the buy american note, I remember by grandpa wouldn't buy foreign made automobiles. not so much buy american as much as because of the war.

My grandad always liked American cars. He seemed to be able to make Fords run on less parts than Ford could. There were always a few spares left over in the garage after he'd been tinkering with it.

"From your avatar and description, your ruck looks like an old ALICE pack. The Army used packs of that style for a lot of years."

The Army still uses these packs… they also still issue out 1950s vintage canvas shelter halves complete with brass snaps, aluminum stakes, and a steel pole set.

"So, in keeping up with my roots, can a man call himself a good southern redneck while packing with one of them fancy, high dollar Kelty or Northen Face packs? I mean, what would the neighbors say? Maybe I could get one, drive the truck over it a bit to rough it up, and make some duck tape patches on it. That way I could have a nice pack but save face as well :)<"

LOL. Well, you could always get a cuben fiber pack like the Zpack Blast and anyone you run into would think you done gone and melted your brain on some bad moonshine, walking around the woods with a bag made out of saran wrap and tissue paper . . . and definitely look into getting a beer can pot and pepsi-can stove. Not only superlight but the anti-yuppie factor is huge. I still get a kick out of the looks I get: "why is that crazy man setting his garbage on fire?"

"The Army still uses these packs… they also still issue out 1950s vintage canvas shelter halves complete with brass snaps, aluminum stakes, and a steel pole set."

they are moving to a new pack. My BIL just got out of hte Army. He let me borrow this pack I'm using now, it was his from the army. He also was showing me the new pack they have that he used while in also. I'm not for sure the full extent of use of hte new packs though