20 Degree Sleeping System Dilemma

[Michael Neal]

I have a dilemma and I could use any help that I can get. What I need is an inexpensive and effective sleeping system for an early spring weekend trip on the AT.

The problem is that I have a couple of friends that are interested in the trip but do not want to spend much money. In addition they will not be going backpacking very often so it would make no sense for them to purchase a down bag for example.

So far I have come up the with following idea for sleeping under a tarp. Each person would have the following:

1) SlumberJack Super Guide 30 Degree bag $60 2lbs 5 oz.
2) Adventure Medical Kits Two Person Bivy (As outer shell for potential colder or wet weather) $25 1 lb.

any thoughts?

[J R]

Probably not a bad set up for the money minded.

Im not sure Id go for the Bivy though… Might upgrade the bag to the Slumberjack Ultimate.

[mark henley]

I used the Adventure Medical Bivy with a Coleman 40degree bag in the Rockies last summer, in temps around freezing and was warm as toast.

My son, however, had a lot of condensation build up inside the Bivy and on top of the bag while I had none.

The 7 oz you would carry for a bivy would be better off being put into the bag if you ask me.

[mark henley]

You can use a trash bag over your sleeping bag and get almost the same benefit as the Adventure Medical Bivy …. because it’s acting mainly as a vapor barrier.

Another thought is to carry extra clothes instead of the bivy … and plan on wearing them to bed.

Long undies can make a big difference.

[kevin davidson]

By the way, a VB needs to be placed within the bag to trap body moisture from eventually wetting and collapsing the insulation. A second waterproof ( or better yet, W/B) bag could then be used on the outside of the bag to prevent condensation or rain/snow from wetting out the bag.
A waterproof layer used solely on the outside of the bag would be particularly bad news for a down insulated bag. Even fatal.

One final note on VB’s— temperatures need to be in low 20’s or colder for them to work comfortably for most people.

All that being said, for a single night or an emergency, a waterproof bag used over the sleeping bag will provide added warmth and is better than having a rain soaked sleeping system.

[Scott Peterson]

All the technical observations are kind of ignoring the obvious, bigger issue:

How to get a decent bag for one-time use??? Rent one from REI. Perhaps EMS offers this service too, but I am not familiar as I live on the West coast.

http://www.rei.com/stores/rentals.html?storeId=8000&originalTextQuery=rent&stat=7889&vcat=REI_SEARCH&langId=-1

I bet if you do not live close to one, they might even mail it to you if you offered to pay shipping.

If you have the energy, you can generally have good luck re-selling lightly used items on ebay obviously.

[Vick Hines]

I think Scott has the right idea. But if that doesn’t work, here is another to throw in the mix:

A simple, sewn-through down 45 – 50F liner will make a great summer bag and will extend the range of your current bag a solid 20 degrees at the cost of about a pound.

[Michael Neal]

thanks, yea I think rental is probably the best option

[Michael Freyman]

Ryan F. mentions a $25 bag in this thread –> (I have no experience with it.)
http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/xdpy/forum_thread/1679/index.html?skip_to_post=11798#11798

I have one of the Cabelas Bivy Tents $50 in green here –>
http://www.cabelas.com/cabelas/en/templates/links/link.jsp?id=0013075512726a&type=product&cmCat=search&returnString=hasJS=true&_D%3AhasJS=+&QueryText=bivy+tent&_DARGS=%2Fcabelas%2Fen%2Fcommon%2Fsearch%2Fsearch-box.jsp.22&Go.x=0&Go.y=0&N=4887&Ntk=Products&Ntx=mode+matchall&Nty=1&Ntt=bivy+tent&noImage=0&returnPage=search-results1.jsp
(nice for the cost. ignore the 3 lbs. 10 oz. stat on the Cabelas site. mine weighs 42.4 oz. with some extra kelty triptease I had lying around and trimming some tags and such; though I did add a few ti tent stakes instead of the supplied factory stakes.)

[William Green]

Rental would be most cost effective, but consider the safety factor in any system.

I failed at an early spring trek on the AT because I tried to go too light. The weather for the week prior to departure had lows in the mid-30s, but the day I took off it plummetted to the teens. My 30 degree bag, bivy and tarp system left me hypothermic, and I was fortunate to find a way off the mountain.

My point – take the early spring weather fluctuations serious. I’ve gone to a slightly heavier Wiggy’s bag with some of the best nights sleep I’ve ever had. The bag packs small, and drapes close to the body.

And with 10+ years experience as a former professional whitewater, MTB and backcountry guide, I can only say I wished I had a Wiggy’s much earlier in my career.

[Wanda Hodge]

The bag Ryan F mentioned:
http://www.majorsurplusnsurvival.com/Merchant2/merchant.mv?Screen=PROD&Product_Code=027117&Category_Code=35

Academy Sports (www.academy.com) also lists an Igloo Tracker, 2-lb. 7-oz. 33-in. x 85-in. Mummy Sleeping Bag. It’s about $37. I don’t know if they have it in their stores, but you could check. I almost ordered it but decided I needed a 20 degree bag instead of a +30 degree, and I ordered a Sierra Designs Wild Bill (it seemed the best compromise of price / weight / degrees for my needs).

[Ryan Faulkner]

on the major surplus n survival site, it says the $25 bag is good to 15 degrees, but it is more a 30 degree bag, other than the inaccurate temp rating, I have heard good things from my dad and sister, who both use it. I use a nunatak arc ghost. but that is $300 more :-)

[Vick Hines]

Ryan,
Don’t trust retailers’ temperature ratings. Loft is main the determining factor with wind resistance of the shell playing a small contributing role.

[Michael Neal]

I would suggest those $25 bags if I wanted to kill my friends on the trail but I don’t so I guess I will have to look at another option :) Probably something from a reputable manufacturer like the others mentioned here or just renting from REI.

But I am tempted to purchase the $25 bag and sleep in my back yard with it to test it out. Maybe adding a fleece liner would put it in at the 20 degree range that I am looking for.

[Dale Wambaugh]

Wellllll,
If I took two ladies with me, I’d just take a big quilt :)

“No, really, we always snuggle up under one blanket this way– tttttttttrust me.”

Kidding aside, I’d rather be poor and warm. Perhaps some good used bags, rentals, etc, but be responsible. Your buddies won’t want to go again if they freeze their hind parts. One man’s discomfort is another’s torture. You could live on in infamy — “Remember when so-and-so took us camping….?”

[Glenn Roberts]

You might try Campmor. They carry Slumberjack bags, plus their own house brand (which includes some 20-degree down bags for $110.) I just looked, and found a Kelty 20-degree Mistral sleeping bag for $40 – they may not be exactly ultralight, but they might just fit the bill for the entry level bag you’re seeking. And, if the friends like the trip, these bags would probably work fine for their first set of gear.

[Michael Neal]

I just bought a Coleman 25 degree bag at the Thrift Store, for $17. It’s brand new in the package.

The drawbacks are that it weighs 5lbs and is a rectangular style bag but it should do for at least one of my friends.I will suggest they buy a cheap bag liner or space blanket to go along with it. And also maybe a balaclava or scarf and hat and they should be good to go

[Mark W Heninger]

5 lbs? Ouch.

But you gotta love thrift stores.

[Dane Fliedner]

Have you checked ebay and/or backcountry outlet or backpackgearswap? You can frequently find some pretty great deals on many items.

[Ken Bennett]

I’ve seen pretty good reviews of the Campmor brand down bags over on the AT listserv. The 0-F bag in particular seems like a good deal for an early spring AT hike at $139 and 3 pounds 5 ounces. Western Mountaineering it ain’t, but your friends could use the bag and then eBay it if they don’t want to continue the hiking thing. (But if you do your job right, they’ll love it and keep coming back for more <g>.)

Ken

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