UL All Purpose Shelter

For the record, I never used a bivy with my Double Rainbow. I haven't had the Lunar Duo out just yet (still waiting for MN to warm up just a tiny bit more), but I don't plan on using one with it either.

We have had rain blowing in horizontally through the vents in our DR, and before we were upgraded to a zippered vestibule it would also blow open in strong winds. We've also found the floor is not 100% waterproof, and sometimes the condensation can be pretty bad resulting in a lot of moisture falling on our bags. This last issue has been a problem with all single walled tents we've tried, thus we always carry bivy bags. My newest creation in cuben bottom/0.8oz nylon top weighs a mere 85 grams, so it's not a big insurance policy!

Art…given the two person use of the Duomid perhaps being limited, do you feel the Duomid is just right for one as far as mix of condensation control and weather protection?

Johnathon-
The duomid is palacial for one, and for its weight it's a dream come true for me. Since I got it, it's been my shelter of choice for all of the backpacking trips I've gone on, which have all been either solo or otherwise just me in the duomid. The weather protection has not been problematic as the walls are steep enough not to drip condensation and the shelter is big enough that I don't find myself coming in contact with the walls accidentally.

Also, keep in mind that we're talking about this shelter being cramped for two people in a certain context. Chris is saying that when it's really humid out, two warm bodies inside the shelter cause too much condensation and in these conditions, you have to take special care not to touch your sleeping bag to the shelter walls. I'm talking about a lack of personal space… This is partly just my nature: liking to spread my gear out and not liking to be stuck so close to another smelly hiker for 8 hours at a time, I will bring my own shelter 99.9% of the time when on a camping trip with other people. Now if both people were fairly small (thin, shorter than 5'6") and didn't mind leaving much of their gear outside the shelter, it would be quite a different story.

Thanks for the reply. I've got one on order and am anxious to hear about how it is working for those who have already used it. I plan on going with it as a year-round solo shelter in the Southeast US. Now, if Ron could just get that mesh inner he talked about for the Duomid up for sale I'd be all over it!

I agree on the small space for two as well. I'd be tight unless you hung it from a tree using the overhead tieout.

Art-

If two folks were in the shelter, do you think there would be room to put your backpack or a stuff sack with all your unused gear at your head or feet, or is it necessary to put stuff outside the shelter?

Chris-

So part of the space squeeze is due to the pole in the middle?

Definitely. I wouldn't try to fit 2 6 foot men in it with or without the pole though. No pole and a couple would probably fit ok if you cuddle.

Jonathon-

When/where did Ron talk about inner mesh for the DuoMid?

Rough estimate with 16" height before touching at any end you have about 6'6" length and 4' width available without the pole. Pole would decrease that a small amount and I'd probably want more than 16" head/foot room personally but I like my space.

Depends on your backpack and your sleeping style. A frameless pack doesn't take up much space at all, if you're using your pack for insulation under your legs that also wouldn't be a problem, but two big internal/external frame packs would be a little more cumbersome. I think if you leaned the packs up against the shelter walls, it would all fit. Like I said, though, I've only taken this on solo trips so far, so I'm just going on my perception of the space and what kind of space I think each person would need… There might be more creative solutions that are more apparent to people used to sharing a shelter, perhaps like leaning the packs up against the center pole or using the packs as pillows.

But then again, it's not really that big of deal to just leave backpacks outside a shelter. Just put a rain cover on it if you're concerned about it getting wet.

So Art, given that you use the DuoMid as your go-to shelter for all of your trips, you must've had to deal with skeeters and other creepy crawlies. What is your solution with the duomid?

Hi OP,

There's no one size fits all- always a compromise.
My solution for my hiking above tree line in the Pyrenees (2000m +) is the Golite Shangri- La 3. I use a SMD Serentiy net if it is buggy, or my pncho tarp as a ground sheet if no bugs are out. Either way it all weighs less than one kilo and is bomber. I've been in some storms high up and come out fine. Plenty of room for two and gear, and you can pitch it in any direction, unlike tarptents which prefer wind orientation.

Lower altitude camping I use the Golite Poncho tarp. I like the heavier fabric- no need to baby it. YMMV.

I hope this helps.

cheers,
fred

For two, the shangri-hex has it for me and my lady. Room for two plus gear while cooking with the door open in the rain.
Condensation is rarely an issue because it's so roomy you can keep the door wide open while you sleep, even if it's raining. We made a 16oz bugtent for the hex which incorporates a tyvek groundcloth. A space blanket goes under if it's really wet on the ground.

For solo use, a gatewood cape is *just* big enough for me at 6' 8" I use a carbon fibre golf club shaft as the pole – 2.5oz.

>When/where did Ron talk about inner mesh for the DuoMid?

See this thread:

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=18386

I'm pretty excited about the inner because I think combined with the Duomid, it will make for a true 4 season Southeast US shelter as long as you respect the floor space limitations.

I think it will be a palatial solo shelter, just right for a close-quarters couple, or perfect for a solo hiker and dog.

This thread shows what I did for a DuoMid Bugnet.

It will be interesting to see what Ron comes up with.

Wouldn't it be simpler and provide more room just to sew a floor in it and have a mesh door? I would think the weight would be comparable to a mesh insert?

Any condensation would run down the walls, and gather on the floor Bill. You need the seperation.

I was thinking that a full mesh door along with the upper vent would inhibit the condensation. I have a George Tarp that I use occasionally and with the mesh door I get very little condensation. Of course it does not have a floor. I guess an alternative is to have mesh along the perimiter of the floor and use a groundcloth.

Why not just put the SMD Serenity net in there- ready made and already lightweight.

That's what I do in my Shangri-La 3- works great.

I've got a Duomid on order. I like the fact there is no netting or floor. It gives me lots of choice for the inner. I'll just use a TiGoat bivvy, and the MLD bug-bivvy during bug season.
I'll get the MLD inner when Ron puts it up on the site. I think the Duomid and inner nest will be my ultimate shelter outwith winter.

I have used my SMD Lunar Solo and have needed no additional bug or weather protection. I made a SylNyl footprint with skinny bungee cords to tie it to the tent's stakes.

YMMV but…works for me.

>So Art, given that you use the DuoMid as your go-to shelter for all of your trips, you must've had to deal with skeeters and other creepy crawlies. What is your solution with the duomid?

I haven't had it during mosquito season..I think they just came out last November? if I'm not mistaken. My solution for mosquitoes is threefold, however. 1- homemade bug bivy to seal up my sleeping body. 2- not being very allergic to mosquito bites. 3- not backpacking in places where mosquitoes really swarm during mosquito season.

OK, #2 is a little bit personal. It's just a fortunate coincidence for me that I don't get itchy red swellings when bitten by mosquitoes, and most of the times I'm bitten I honestly don't even notice it. For #3, the most mosquitoes I've ever seen was camping in Wisconsin and those suckers could drain a human body of blood in a matter of hours. I do most of my backpacking in the lower midwest or the west and I've never seen anything like Wisconsin mosquitoes in those kinds of places, so I count myself lucky in this regard.

Of course, on trips during the spring, fall and winter, no "mosquito solution" is needed. I just got back from a trip and slept on the ground with no insect "protection" whatsoever.

"I do most of my backpacking in the lower midwest or the west and I've never seen anything like Wisconsin mosquitoes in those kinds of places"

I once canoe camped on the southern coast of Florida in May. I was on the Gulf of Mexico in Everglades National Park. Stunningly beautiful pristine wild sand beaches. Coconut palms leaning over the Azure Gulf waters. not a sole to be seen.

Once the sun went down, and I mean within 5 minutes, the mosquitoes were so intense that there was NO way one could be out side a tent. DEET mad no practical difference. If it drove off 90% of the mosquitoes, there were still too many to stay out. It was brutal! Their buzzing on the tent's netting was not subtle. Once the sun came up, they all went to wherever mosquitoes go in the everglades for the day.
And to think, De Soto walked across the Everglades.

Hi,

We should have the DuoMid Bug Net insert out in about 4-6 weeks- just in time for bug season! I want to build up a small stock so it can ship fast.

It will be about 4.3' X 7.4' and have a short bathtub wall. Plan is for a Yellow Silnylon for the floor and black .7 Nanoseeum for the walls.

For solo use, and to create a dry entry vestibule area in the Mid, it will have clips on the short side ends to let you clip the 2 person size over to a 1 person size and then the center pole is outside the netting – Just some extra versatility if needed.

Overall- pretty much the same as lots and lots of other mid / shelter bug net inserts…Sorta like the one I made for my Old Chouinard (pre BlackDiamond) 8 X 8 Mid in 1987 before any one made them commercially- of course that changed!

It should weight about 10-11 oz.

Price TBA around 120-140 – need to figure out production cost a bit closer.

-Will fit any DuoMid and maybe lots of other Mids and various shelters and tarps.

As some posters have noted, the DuoMid is large enough for 2 but I do know about +80% of users go solo and dig the extra space.

Some new pics are up today of the DuoMid and shows the new extra perimeter tiesouts and the new one mid panel tiesout per EACH side.

Note the pics showing inside of two full length pads and the amount of room around them.

When used for two people, head to foot orientation gives a bit more room too.

So, it will be a DuoMid 4 Season modular system for about 25oz total in Silnylon and when used solo a great full protection palace that sets up fast and handles very harsh weather.

—-
We are running right at 8 weeks for existing orders right now but have more shop help now and hope to start cutting down that time a bit each week. New craftsmen can's learn everything all at once, so some items will start moving much faster than others for a while but the bug net insert will be one of the faster items.