starting over

What about a Tarp Shelter (mld duomid) and bivy….seriously would cut down on weight, and it's the same as a tent, really.

If you go this route, you can also get a smaller pack (the Jam, for example) and save further weight.

ok I should have clarified a few things..I want a floor and mesh around me..don't want anything crawling in with me or rain coming in..and with the pack I want something that will carry good.I looked at the jam and lots of people rave about them I just want to be sure it will carry well with food for a thru and with gear and clothing.

With a Tarp shelter you will get NO rain spray. It is fully enclosed, to the ground. With a bivy, you will not get anything crawling on you, as it is mesh and sil-nylon. (And depending on which you get, it can be quite roomy). It's really exactly the same set-up as a double wall shelter except lighter. (You use your trekking pole, save weight there, and without a total floor (the bivy has a floor), you save even more weight.)

Just a thought–once you feel how light your pack is by ditching the tent, you may find that you even like it better. =)

But if you go the tent route, yah, the Jam is probably not up to the task.

Hi Don. What temp do you want to hit with your bag? I've had the versalite for a couple of years and it is a stellar bag, it is unbelievable how conservative it is rated.
Second, have you looked at any lighter options for a floored shelter? Maybe a lighter tarptent or GG the one? Just thinking out loud.

nate,what would be your suggestions? if the tarp was big enough for me and my sleep setup and keep my pack and gear dry.that would work. but I HATE bugs,flies,mosquitos,spiders…when I am in camp and I don't want to spend all my time stuck in a bivy just to keep flies off me.I would like to be able to lay on my bag and just chill.I have thought long and hard about a tarp.the openess I would love..but I do like my room even during rain..if I had a good sized tarp..with netting to the ground and some type ground cover I would be cool with that

hey steve..well with the bag I want it to run the spectrum ..I guess..I want it to be capable of being on all 3 major trails..that's kinda why I am leaning toward the ponderosa.it's conservative at 15* I would say with 27oz fill and can be opened as a quilt if it was warm.or closed up and clothing insulation added and get down pretty low I would think..the only thing I didnt like about the versalite was it don't open all the way up..thats it

Ah, you must have what my mother termed "sweet blood"–that is, bugs just won't leave you alone. I'm the opposite, so makes sense you want a secure shelter. You're probably best off getting a tarptent from henry shires, gossamer gear, or six moon designs.

Where are you thru-hiking, btw? Sorry to hear about your injury…that has to be frustrating, to say the least.

Hi Don, sorry about the shoulder. Know how you feel; I've had problems since high school with my left rotater cuff, though not nearly as severe as your injury. Lighter packs were a necessity for me because of shoulder pain. Anyway, on with gear.

First, IMO you should be very cautious about your pack selection considering your injury. I think a pack with a real frame is necessary; the frame will much more effectively transfer weight to your hips and support the load without placing too much weight on your shoulders and upper back. From your choices, I would choose the ULA over the GoLite just for the frame, and I would add the optional stay. You might also consider the Osprey Exos series that was just released, or the Granite Gear Vapor Trail. Or if you have the money and want to buy your last pack ever, you could get a McHale ;)

As for the bag, I would choose the Versalite over the Ponderosa, though both are too warm for summer. If you can sew, make yourself a light synthetic quilt for summer; it shouldn't weigh more than a pound or so. With this and the Versalite, you're ready for anything short of serious deep winter cold.

For the tent, I would choose the Scarp over the Hubba, but for summer the Scarp might be a bit warm in the Southeast. You can set the Scarp fly up without the inner; I would get a light bug shelter of some sort to use in hot weather. This would also allow the option of bug-free sleeping either out under the stars or in a tail shelter. It should also be much lighter than the inner tent, saving you weight in the summer.

With these changes, you could be around 5 lb. warm- weather/ 7 lb. cold weather weight for your "big three". That's a huge savings! Good luck with the rehab!

PS: Thinking about it, I really would seriously consider the McHale. Your probably talking $500-600 and 8-10 week wait, but really that's nothing if you love the trails and it allows you to hike pain-free.

yea,I was supposed to start the AT for the 3rd time. my date was/is march 4..I live on the gulf coast(mississippi)but I train here on some local trails(no significant hills)but heat,humidity,bugs,rain,storms..we got that covered.home of the legendary ""FIRE ANT"" if you don't got em your lucky!!!but I do some trails in louisiana,mississippi,alabama,florida…but my goal is to knock out the big 3..then do some routes andrew skurka does or has done..but gotta get the 1st 1 out the way..yea injuries suck..

hey scott thanks..do you have the website for this pack you are talking about? I think I have heard of them but never checked em out.so you think the versalite and a 1lb synthetic will fill the bill? for the shelter I would like the mesh option if it was dry out..but the hubba is pretty tight..that's why I liked the size of the scarp.but you cant have just the mesh option with it though

The packs can be found at http://www.mchalepacks.com/; they are pretty much considered the best packs in the world. They are completely custom-made to your specs, there are a ton of possible configurations and options, but you pay for it. As I said before though, if $500-600 let's you get out there, and keeps you pain-free, it's the cheapest medicine I've heard of when combined with some good wilderness!

For the tent, I'm thinking something like a bug bivy or mesh shelter you could suspend inside the fly of the Scarp, when pitched without the inner tent. This gives you a lighter, better-ventilated option in warm weather, and the warmth and security of the inner tent on cold-weather trips.

hey, man!

Maybe you should research SUL!

cheers

I wouldn't try SUL packs with your shoulder injury Don. Even with 4-6 lb base weights, once loaded with 4-6 days food (or more) and with the long water carries(5L+) on the PCT and maybe CDT, this would work out to potential 30-40 total pack weights. With a frameless pack with no hipbelt or maybe just a thin webbing strap, all this weight hangs from your shoulders. Might as well be carrying that overloaded pack again.

Oh yeah, Scott!

so lets make him carry 80lbs. instead of perhaps 30lbs. w/ food and water!

C'mon! are you trying to hurt him or severly limit his chance of hiking his dreams!!!

Blasphemy, Scott!!!

And another thing, I did not say he HAD to use a frameless pack. If you really need one, 6-7 lbs. baseweight is not bad at all.

cheers

Hey Don, a lightweight synthetic quilt is one of the easiest MYOG projects ever! If you sew, it would only take you a couple hours. If you can't but want to learn, this is a great project that any sewing friend could help you with. Check out the MYOG forum for a ton of quilt threads for first time MYOG folks.

Depending on when you hit the mid-atlantic on the AT, a synthetic quilt would be invaluable. Something like the Versalite is too warm for AT summers between Shenandoah and New Hampshire. Have someone ship you the quilt and send your bag home; then get it sent back for New Hampshire and Maine. Saves wear and tear on your $$$$ Versalite, and probably saves a laundering since you won't be sweating out 60F-70F nights in it. Plus, the quilt can be made for less than $50. Tear it up, it's not a huge investment down the tube.

Don, if you want more comfort than SUL can give you:

http://www.adventurealan.com/lw_gear_list.htm

Full Comfort, at only 9lbs. baseweight!

-Evan

Evan, what I meant there was that a SUL frameless pack would create the same burden on his shoulder as his current overloaded pack. In fact, the SUL pack is probably worse, since heavier packs do typically have beefy suspensions and provide good weight transfer to the hips. If you read the entire thread, Don is possibly soon to undergo his fourth major shoulder surgery. IMO, he needs a pack that can transfer most of the weight to his hips. And I've been trained as a pack fitter for Osprey (by Mark), Dana (by Dana Gleason), Gregory (by Wayne), etc… so my my opinion has a bit of value.

Definitely get a framed pack with a good suspension to keep the weight on your hips. I would be looking at ULA (circuit, as you suggested) or Granite Gear (maybe even the Nimbus Ozone). Advantage of the Nimbus is that it has a very rigid frame, cushy hipbelt, and is adjustable in torso length to get the fit just right. Weighs more than the Circuit, but might be worth it since weight transfer, comfort and fit are priorities. Either way, make sure you get the torso size right and err on the side of a bit too long rather than too short.

hey thanks for all the info so far..keep it coming..I will check out both those web sites you 2 mentioned..I think I will do more searching and studying..looks like I will have plenty of time to do so..and perhaps this time I will actually NOT put on a pack and hike for the full 12 months..I can never just seem to do that part…lol.soon as I feel better..I push it.only waited 4 months last time.maybe I will try it their way..it's apparent mine ain't workin…thanks guys

1. Packs – I've tried on both the Circuit and Golite Pinnacle. The ULA packs have wider shoulder (and hip) straps that are traditionally padded. The Golite packs have narrow straps (more like a school backpack) that I feel might hurt your shoulders.

2. Shelter – I feel your pain about the creepy crawling critters… Check out the Tarptent Sublite (or GG The One if $ doesn't matter). It's probably the lightest full enclosed shelter around.

Why not go with a slightly heavier, sturdier pack that will be guaranteed to keep all the weight off your shoulders? I used a Gregory Z Pack (older model) on my long AT section a few years ago, and while it was heavy, the pack was incredibly comfortable, and I rarely had weight on my shoulders. The Gregory Z35 weighs about 3 pounds (and you could probably modify it to lose several ounces). I hear that Osprey packs ride very comfortably as well.

Dear Don-

I am sorry for your troubles and I wish you the speediest recovery!

Just one thought on the pack: you might want to consider the new ULA Ohm instead of the Circuit. It has the same suspension loop as the Circuit, but comes in at as little as 21 oz, or 24.5 with internal backpad and hip belt pockets (22.1 w/o the hipbelt pockets), a full 10.5 ounces less than the circuit. The Ohm is 300 ci smaller (3500 ci) and doesn't have the option for an aluminum stay. The smaller size probably wouldn't be an issue if you came down on the weight and volume of everything else.

In any event, good luck! I am also trying to configure my system to hike the big 3 (and everything in between!).

Evan, take a deep breath. Not all things come down to measuring fractions of ounces. A pack that weighs a pound more but offers significantly more support and comfort can ultimately make a pack feel lighter than it is. Please consider your comments before you post–sometimes the best solutions can differ on an individual basis.