bear bags

Mike, so you saw it with your own two eyes? And you can positively identify it as a black bear? Tell the truth. Ali

"That does sound like a tale, a friend of a friend???"

You're sounding more and more like Timothy Treadwell with every passing post, Ali; or maybe you do your long distance hiking at a petting zoo?. The "tale" is true which, I'll wager, is more than you can say about your "swatting a bear on the nose" BS. If you ever get down to SEKI or Yosemite NP's, check with any ranger station in the area. They'll have a whole list of Boogie Man stories to regale you with. Or maybe those master spinners of tall tales over at SIBBG. BTW, I'd love to see a picture of you swatting a bear. Meantime, I'll keep an eye out for your name when the winner of the 2009 Darwin Award is announced.

So tom, how do you get your food from one tree to the next, wont they just eat you when your hiking. I wonder how Andrew Skurka has hikes a bizillean miles with food in his pack and survived? Maybe he can help us. Anyways if you are going to respond to a thread you should read it first. A question was asked and and answer was given. Who are you to critisize how I spend my time in the backcountry. The only thing to fear is fear itself. Ali PS I still love you even if you hate me. :) Kisses Ali

I have a feeling that if tim treadwell had been infatuated with black as opposed to brown bears he would still be here. . .

To reply to the thread: I use a drysack I picked up at wall mart (i know i know) that has lasted 2 seasons so far along with 50 ft. of paracord and a minibiner. Weighs about 3 oz.

Enough is enough, Ali. I just choose my campsites carefully
and avoid areas frequented by a lot of people and, therefore, bears. I don't live in fear of them anymore than you do. I just have a lot more respect for them than you seem to. You get that way if you've had a serious run in with a bear(black), which I have. I read the thread, several times, and just got tired of the BS. Criticize the way you hike? I could care less, but if you put it out there expect some responses. As for hating you? I don't even know you. I just don't care much for BS, that's all.
A big hug and a kiss to you and let's just leave the whole thing lie, huh. Tom

…

I agree with you mike and more bears are killed every year by motorists than by being put down due to being a danger to the public so by your own words I must insist that you never drive again or you may be the cause of the death of a bear. Seriously you must never dive again or many innocent creatures will be at risk. You have been warned. Mike its time you lead us all by example. Ali

…

Mike, I believe that Ray Jardine recommends sleeping with your food. I haven't read his latest rendition of PCT Hikers Guide / Beyond Backpacking, but he seemed to think that if you stealth camped away from all the commotion, the bears wouldn't bug you.

As for me, I hike mostly in the Smokies. They have cable systems installed at all the campsites, but I still use an ursack because of the voracious rodents that have managed to steal my food from the high wires.

The mice have no fear. One night I had a mouse chew through my wrist strap on my trekking pole that I was using to hold up my tarptent. I am surprised this didn't wake me up because my head was inches from the trekking pole strap all night long….. The critter must have been after the salt in the strap.

(I don't know for sure if it was a mouse. I did not see it with my own eyes, nor did I get any pictures. It could have been a chipmunk I guess.)

Hiking & camping in known black & grizzly bear country here in the Alberta & BC Rocky Mountains: I keep all my food, toiletries, garbage, etc in either single or doubled-up ziploc bags packed in an Outdoor Research Hydroseal Dry Sack. Hung about 30' up a tree, in a camp-site food locker, or from a bear pole.

Mike says:
"I drive and camp responsibly. That's all I ask of anybody.

To the OP I will apologize for allowing myself to be drawn in on this discussion. I will however point out that of the posters on this thread that actually did stay on topic, only one recommends sleeping with your food. I've never actually heard anybody that recommends this technique but I will acknowledge it is another option."

I do not, and would not recommend sleeping with one's food. It's just what I do. If I camp where bears equate people with food I secure my food in a responsible manner. If I had to deal with Brown Bears I would be careful to exercise every caution, as one should.

The areas in which I choose to hike are those where the black bears, and other animals, are truly wild. More than once I have camped in areas where bear sign is evident and have heard bears growling, mostly in the early evening and at dawn. In those areas I have never had any bear in camp. I sleep well knowing that the Golden Mantled Ground Squirrels are the most likely predators to try for my food.

I have no doubt that a careful backpacker can get away with sleeping with his food next to his head or in his tent a vast majority of the time. I did it a few times some years ago in places where I was pretty confident a bear wouldn't show up. But then I got to thinking about the potential consequences of that one in a thousand, or whatever the odds might be, times when the bear does show up and went back to counter balancing(occasionally, an Ursack of late). I applied the same logic that led me not to run it out more than 15 feet or so when climbing(there were exceptions, obviously). Simply put in either case: If you take the riskier option, you'd better be right ALL the time. With the less risky option, you've only got to be right once. Consider the consequences and choose according to your appetite for risking them. My .02.

Tom,
I understand where you're coming from. It's a commonly sought place, especially these days. But… If you're looking for security you'd best have it between your ears, cause it doesn't exist anywhere else in this world.

That doesn't mean that you should disregard the knowledge and experience of the experts, does it?
You're young, you'll live forever, you rarely see bears, and you've hiked a few years so you know best. Right? Until you meet a bear that either has more experience than you or just doesn't give a ****. Right?

Okay, I've tried to follow this post, but I guess bulletin board ADD set in somewhere half through.

So if I put my food in small freezer bags and all the small freezer bags in a large freezer bag and put all of that in any old drysack, should that okay? Of course, my bag would be cabled or roped up a tree.

Particularly I'm concerned about hiking the North Carolina section of the AT.

John,

I'm sure a bear cannister or ursack would be the best, but I'm comfortable with basically double bagging any food or smelly stuff and then putting it in the dry-sack. That includes my bowl, cup and spoon, as well as toiletries, sunscreen and bug dope. I cook well away (100-200') from the tents, and for bed, I change into a different shirt than the one I cooked with. Maybe sounds paranoid, but better than nothing.
Or using your food as a pillow. Sorry to be blunt, but that's one of the stupidest things I've heard in a while. Almost as good as the guy that said "I don't need a first aid kit, because I don't plan on getting injured".

"Tom,
I understand where you're coming from. It's a commonly sought place, especially these days. But… If you're looking for security you'd best have it between your ears, cause it doesn't exist anywhere else in this world."

Denis,
Sorry if I conveyed the impression that I am some sort of latter day Linus wandering the mountains in search of his security blanket. Chalk it up to my poor communication skills. So, let me try to clarify. Both solo backpacking off trail and alpine climbing are inherently risky activities, more or less so depending on the route in question. I have done quite a bit of both down through the years and my approach has evolved to eliminate those risks that can easily be eliminated, knowing that there are plenty of other risks, objective hazards if you will, that cannot be eliminated if I am to pursue my chosen activities. I am prepared to deal with them, for better or worse or I wouldn't make the attempt in the first place. Why get nailed by something that could easily have been prevented and risk the whole enterprise? No glory there. I mean, if I'm going to written up in "Accidents in North American Mountaineering", I'd prefer it to be because I took a leader fall, not because some bear confused my head with the food I was using as a pillow. Sleeping with my food vs hanging it, treating my water, checking the weather reports and monitoring it constantly enroute, not running it way out, even on easy terrain, all fall into that prophylactic category, IMO. If you still think I am some wimp looking for a blanket to huddle under, I can live with that. I just wanted you to understand where I am coming from. As the saying goes: "There old climbers and there are bold climbers, but there are no old, bold climbers." Worth contemplating, don't you think?
BTW, the way the world is today the last place I'd look for security is between my ears."
Cheers,
Tom

in california, i'm not worried about the bear getting me

i am a little worried about the food, because if the bear gets the food, that could ruin the trip

my main concern is with the bear – if the bear gets my food, i've failed the bear, who is now one big step closer to being killed as a problem bear (which is why it is a federal offense in the national parks if the bear gets your food, no matter how you stored it)

Because the areas that I hike the most require canisters I use a Bearikade or Bear Vault. But in areas they are not required (and in the good old days before “smart” bears) I just use whatever silnylon stuff sack fits the trips food load and carry about 70 ft of accessory cord to hang it from.

But to be truthful the only thing it has protected my food from is rodents and coyotes. I have never had a problem with black bears. I have been hiking the Sierra (east side mostly) since the late 70s and have only seen bears “on the trail” on one May trip. I like to joke that they are imaginary creatures made up to sell bear cans.

Now I have seen lots of them in campgrounds and parking lots. Anyplace with Igloo coolers and dumpsters…

I guess it all boils down to where you camp. I use a Bear Vault….always, works for bears, rodents, etc.
I just worry that that folks who bp in areas where bears aren't a problem will use the same protocol when bp'ing in bear areas.
I worry about the bpers AND the bears who might suffer from careless practices.

Tom,
Thank you for your reply. I'm sorry that my post was so abrupt and judgmental. I am an INFP, after all.

Denis,
No problem here. All part of the give and take of forum repartee. What the heck is an INFP, anyway? Sounds pretty cool. Can I be one, too?

Introverted iNtuitive Feeling Perceiving

Translation: gets a lot of chicks after they watch The Notebook or Marley and Me…

"Translation: gets a lot of chicks after they watch The Notebook or Marley and Me…"

Now you've really got me interested. How do I get to be one?? ;-)

INFP. You've got it, or you don't.

Susan and I just got out of Marley and Me. Now it's off for Margagaritas and…