Final Shangri-La 3 Deliberations

You going to camp on the shore of a Scottish loch during the midge season?

Yes, Roger! Amongst my plans this year is a trip doing the West Highand way. Scotland is always a massive draw anyway so as a general rule bug netting is an important consideration in my shelters.

I recall making a bug net tent for my original Chouinard Climbers Mid in the 80's. Pretty much like all the ones now for any square Mid designs- nothing new then either…

Strikes me that all the insert bug mids now avial are heavy-more than the shelter!-

One with a sil floor and nanoseeum netting would be about 1-1.5lbs or so- half the weight of the ones from GoLite and BD and would fit any other the current mids out there OK…including the MLD ones.

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Spoiler…We plan on a net insert for the Duomid in March- and now I'm thinking what about a 3/4 size one for a full mid.
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Idea: A sil mid that is a 9 X 9 with a bug net insert that is smaller- 8 X 6.5- then it's a bug net for three with a vestibule in the font and the front door could be partially opened a bit for venting too maybe.

What do you all think of the Trio 3/4 idea Vs a full 8X8 bug net insert for a 9X9 mid? ( I'm guessing most folks don't usually pack 4 people into the mid but like the extra room)

Solo (we already plan on a Duo for the duo) insert for the duomid?

Duo size 8 X 4.5 bug net insert for the large mid?

Okay, Ron, NOW you've piqued my interest!!

I would seriously consider a DuoMid with a solo inner IF it weren't too narrow. I found the SMD Serenity NetTent so narrow I couldn't lay my arms by my side, which is why I gave up on the Gatewood Cape. It would be great to have a 3-season solo pyramid tent with decent headroom, the lightest inner fabrics available, and a symmetrical shape (easy setup) on the market.

Would you consider a 3/4 nest for the duo mid? Same benefits as the Mid concept but for solo + gear use. One idea might be to make the head end wider, say 3/4 width, tapered down to 1/2 width at the foot end (but parallel with the rear wall. I believe the shape is a 'right-angled trapezium'). That way the entry (foot end) would be protected from rain upon entry, but you'd still have room for a backpack and stretching one's arms out at the head end.

Lastly, would you consider sewing this into the tent itself, creating a shelter similar to a SMD Lunar Solo but with more headroom? Or does this get too complicated? I go back and forth on this, as it would also be nice to have a removable inner for warm afternoons. But since the DuoMid came out, I've thought it would make the ideal wind-resistant shape for solo use, but I like the feature set of the Lunar Solo. Seems like a market gap to me.

p.s. I love your new yellow silnylon color. Reminds me of my Hex 3, which is brilliantly warm inside, even on gloomy days. Makes a real psychological difference!

One last thought: design an inner nest for the GoLite Hex 3, but shaped like a baseball home plate (to keep the inner away from the entry), and you'd surely sell more than a few.

Hi Clifford.
Being a gear junkie, i have a few options for the Hex 3/Shangri la 3 floor! I only use the full nest during midge/bug season, and only then if i split the load with someone else, and only for 'base-camp' use. I wouldn't back-pack with it. Same with rhe dedicated Golite floor.
I mostly use one of Ron's Bug Bivvys if i'm travelling any distance during bug season, or a TiGoat bivvy if there isn't much chance of bugs.
If i use the full nest, i use seperate pegs for the pegging loops nearest the door. This enables me to pull back the groundsheet for cooking, entering and leaving etc, without dragging mud or rain into the nest. I then re-peg it when i'm inside. The nest definately makes things cosier, especially if there is any wind.

I've been seriously considering one of your Duo's for solo use Ron, and a nest would probably be a deal clincher for me, especially if it had a decent bath-tub groundsheet! :) 4 inches high would be nice!
I think i would probably like the full nest, just incase someone else came along. As long as it is possible to peg the floor seperately so that it can be pulled back for entry, exit etc. Would the nest clip into the loops already on the Duo for bug bivvys? A bit of shock-cord between them would increas headroom.
Optional mid-panel tie-outs on the outside, in case of strong winds, would probably make this my perfect shelter! :)

If there were a bug bivy for two (specifically, me and my dog–he needs a bug-free space, too) that, in combination with tarp and groundsheet, would be lighter than a 2-person tarptent (generic), I'd switch over to tarping. However, I haven't found such a thing yet. That's why I'm waiting for Gossamer Gear finally to start producing the Squall Classic again.

Hi Clifford,

I have the combination of the Shangri-La 3 and the SMD Serenity Bugnet, and used it quite a lot last summer in the Spanish Pyrenees.
Congratulations on your decision, I can see it was a tough one by the posts I've read by you. Now the process is over, enjoy the gear.
I am 177cm and weigh 65 kilos, and don't find the bugnet too narrow, or confining, after all, I just lay down and sleep in it. There's plenty of room in the rest of the shelter to hang out and mosly I'm outside anyway unless it's raining.
The weight of the SMD option is something like 213g, easily carryable, and it packs small- the weight of the Golite bug insert is over 1 kilo. That's 800g difference.
If you really think you need the room (and there's a lot of it in the Shangri-La) then go for the Golite insert option. For me it would be crazy heavy to lug around on my own, maybe you can share the overall weight with a hiking partner. You might find the extra weight worth it. Also, if you are with hound, the bigger insert will be a bigger space for him/her to run around and get muddy.
The shelter isn't very warm for one person because of it's size, and a snugger net will keep you warmer than the full size net as it will trap the warm air your body is producing in a smaller space.
I find I can clip the SMD in various places, either to the hiking pole holding up the shelter, or to one of the clothes line loops that hang half way up the walls of the shelter- giving me even more room to move around and do things.
I'm not expecting the SMD net to last forever, as it is quite fragile netting- probably a couple of years, hopefully more. It does what it does well, better than anything else available now (I'm no seamstress). Who knows, in the future there may be a better option that weighs roughly the same, more tailored etc- I'll wait and see.
http://www.outdoorwarehouse.co.uk/index.cfm?action=shop.detail&product=shangri-la-3-nest-0&pid=534F4AB5-FF29-08BD-48651674807B5386&cid=F0590123-93E6-4369-8E1EF4936A670469&page=1&order=priceHigh
is a good price for the Golite option in the UK -90 squid. Charlie's a nice guy too.
I went with the Bamboo colour shelter, and find it gives me a better mood on dreary days- I did the same with my ID Rain jacket. As a solo hiker, it helps with the issue of safety, especially in the high Pyrenees, where I hike.
Anyway- good luck with your net quest, I hope this helps.
fred

Ron,

I'm with Mike. Have been pondering on a duo mid for a while and considered asking you to custom make a nest. The 4" bathtub Mike suggests would be perfect for the UK and being able to unclip/unstake the front to make a temporary vestibule and for getting in dry during heavy rain would be invaluable also.

Would consider 'a solo for the duo' – to give a permanent vestibule, if the weight differential was worthwhile. Think John's idea of 'a right angled trapezium' a good one.

Pleased to hear you're going for production in March – How about a separate bathtub without nest as well?

Yes, please keep us posted and put me on the waiting list!

Thanks everybody for your input – good food for thought. Also great to hear your plans Ron – would be even greater if there was a distributor in the U.K ;-)Anyway, I will keep my eyes peeled for the bug nests, I often visit the your site and salivate.

Mike – I hear what your saying. I'm usually solo on the trail and can understand dividing the weight. Now although Granite gear do packs for dogs I'm certainly not going to weigh a Jack Russell down with a 1050g nest which leaves Fred….

Thank you Fred! I read your posts and your extensive reply above and it seems i'm going to do a 180 degree turn and go with the SMD serenity. We are a similar size (I'm 176cm / 5"9 and 73Kg) which suggests that I will have ample room at my head or feet for my dog who, as Mary rightly states, needs bug protection as well. Also your comment about warmth is useful and certainly a consideration as mentioned in my original post. So to conclude, i'm off to order the serenity tent!

All your input has helped tremendously – thank you very much. Clifford.

>What do you all think of the Trio 3/4 idea Vs a full 8X8 bug net insert for a 9X9 mid?

Ron, awesome. I was going to email you sometime about a partial bug nest for a 9×9 mid, NOT sewn in. I'd prefer something half-sized, say 4.5'x8' with a vertical door panel. It would fit entirely behind the center pole. Big enough for a cozy couple, still leaving a huge front vestibule for gear, cooking and sitting.

The functional space:weight ratio would be great for a true 4-season shelter, and the nest would be removable for seasonal versatility.

Clifford,
Be interested to know how you get on with the Serenity – keep us posted.
Its an option I've thought of myself – either with a Hex or Gatewood Cape, but it does look narrow. I'm a side sleeper and stick my knees out. Guess my concern is I'd wreck the netting by pressing against the sides, but be interested to hear your experiences as well as others.

Hi Clifford,

Good luck with the combo- many happy trips!!

Question about side sleepers- I also sleep on my side, as well as front and back- and haven't had any problems in the Serenity Net. You can alter the height to give you more flexibility in the tension of the net, if you think this is a problem.

cheers,
fred

I moved this post to MYOG…