winter stove recommendation?

The Xtreme stove combined with the JetBoil GCS pot although not considered light, I have found to be have awesome performance in the cold. The Xtremes stove pot stand needs some modifications to take the JB GCS pot.

Powermax canisters have a Butane/Propane mix of 60/40 which is the highest Propane % mix of any canister gas which helps in the cold.

I also have been building up my stocks.

I probably should not post this but I have worked out how to refill the Powermax canisters.

Refilling Powermax or any canister should be done with extreme caution and I am not suggesting or advising that refilling canisters should be done by anyone else.

Tony

As long as the canister is stored in a cool, dry place, the limiting factor would be the life of the elastomer seal in the valve. I would probably want to use it within 10 years. Less if it is stored where it may be exposed to ozone.

Of your first 3 options, take the Coleman white gas stove. The jetboil won't work on that trip, the esbit barely functional for it. For a night or two, using what you already have probably makes the most sense.

If you're going to buy a new stove, consider how you'll typically use it. Regular winter use, you might consider the MSR Windpro remote canister or the Simmerlite–weight-wise they're nearly identical. The Windpro could be more fuel-efficient, but I'd use the Simmerlite if regularly expecting temps at 0*F or lower.

Brad, regarding your comments about the MSR stoves, why choose the Simmerlite for lower temps? What type of fuel does the Simmerlite use, white gas only?

Thanks.

Roger, you didn't mention the MSR Windpro remote canister stove in your options though it can be easily inverted and has a preheat tube. It is also inexpensive compared to some of the Coleman stoves. Is this stove an acceptable alternative?

The Windpro should be OK, just as the Primus Gravity EF. I used the Gravity this weekend in inverted mode with temperatures somewhere between 0 and 10°F and it worked perfect.

Hi Jonathon

I have used the WindPro with an inverted canister in the snow. It and many others are listed in Part 3 of the CO series (subscription needed).

Some brands of canisters seem to have a little white 'gunge' in them, which can collect at the valve. But it is easily cleaned out.

If my memory serves me correctly, this stove was designed to work with an inverted canister, but MSR never took it through the licensing stage as such. As discussed on another thread, these days MSR seem to have a few too many committees and lawyers.

Cheers

Hi Don

I *think* the seal is nitrile. In which case it should last a long time.

Cheers

> Refilling Powermax or any canister should be done with extreme caution and I am not
> suggesting or advising that refilling canisters should be done by anyone else.

BPL does not endorse or encourage this. In fact, BPL does not even take a position on this. *You*, not BPL, are responsible for what you do.

That said, I have seen at least one Japanese web site which sells the bits (valves, connectors, etc) needed to refill canisters. They seem to have a very liberal attitude over there! Darwin rules.

Cheers

We got a jetboil to work at 11,000 ft in Taos for snow melting in February with temps probably in the 20's. We dug a hole in the snow for wind protection.

Saw this interesting picture in a Japanese blog:

http://pds.exblog.jp/pds/1/200901/13/74/c0134174_1358419.jpg

Looks like they are using a windpro with what I'm guessing is a butane container. Butane containers seem to be fairly common and cheap. I'm wondering how feasible the setup is?

Can't read Japanese but I think it's being used at -5 deg C with the butane container inverted.

Damon, please don't try using the Brunton adaptor with an inverted canister as it comes from the factory. Without a preheat tube, you will indeed be feeding liquid gas to the stove jet, only you'll have no way to vaporize it beforehand. Thus, a nice big fireball from at the burner, me thinks a really BIG fireball!

Like Roger said, join the site and learn how this can be done SAFELY.

> I'm wondering how feasible the setup is?
> I think it's being used at -5 deg C with the butane container inverted.

Butane boils at -0.5 C, so the weather must be fairly mild, they must have warmed up the can first, and they must be getting some radiation from the stove onto the can. Possible, but butane/propane mix is MUCH better.

Cheers

If you guys would like, I could translate the article for you provided that you give me the original link.

Hi Roger,
interesting you mention that white gunge than can block the valve. When I used my Gravity stove saturday in inverted mode, I noticed after a while that closing and opening the valve had no effect anymore. The stove kept on burning at a constant pace. Only disconnecting the cannister from the valve did help (not surprisingly of course).
I used a Coleman canister. Temperatures where around -18°C (0°F).
I didn't look afterwards if something did collect at the valve so I can't say for sure what the reason was. That gunge is a posibilty. Could it also be that the low temperatures causes some elements of the valve to freeze? Well, I guess there would be a relationship between freezing and that white gunge settling at the valve, but I mean independant from that white gunge.

Hi Roger,

I'm not too familiar with these butane containers, but I thought from the picture that it was being used inverted with the butane in liquid form.

I'm sure a butane/propane mix is much better, but the straight butane is an interesting option from a supply perspective. I see these butane containers all over the place, and they are cheap.

Dan

Hi, Dave-
Yeah, the Simmerlite's white gas. If you're regularly in cold weather, you can still keep a white gas stove going down to around -20F, maybe a little lower. A multi-fuel stove burning gasoline can keep burning down to around -40F; I've only used the white gas down to about -20F. Straight propane will still burn down to around -40F, too, but in the inverted canister blend subzero performance might be lacking. Cheers-

Hi Tom

Several issues here. I don't think the white gunge was a factor in your case, not at all.

> When I used my Gravity stove saturday in inverted mode, I noticed after a while that
> closing and opening the valve had no effect anymore. The stove kept on burning at a constant pace.
Repeat the experiment in the snow. Fire it up at medium power, then turn it off at the canister. Nothing will happen! But wait at least 30 seconds and see. Then it will turn off.

This is normal for a stove which has a fuel line of any length. You may have turned the valve at the canister off, but the fuel line was still full of liquid fuel. This had to be used up first. It takes a while. Note: this also applies to white gas and kero stoves.

Cheers

Hi Daniel

> I'm sure a butane/propane mix is much better, but the straight butane is an interesting option from a supply perspective.
Correct, and quite OK for use outside winter. During sub-freezing winter weather the pressure in a pure butane canister can fall too far, so that vapour does not come out of the can. Under these conditions there is not enough pressure to push liquid butane out either.

Cheers