Platypus Clean Stream

David,

I am using a Sawyer inline filter, which uses the same hollow tube technology to filter the water.

As far as I know, neither the Sawyer or the Clean Stream do not use any active carbon.

So the water is going to taste as it is…if it is a concern, you could attach a heavy katadyn carbon filter accessory.

I have done that, but it does add a significant amount of weight.

Based on my experience with my Sawyer filter, the flow rate is good….I have even sat on my dirty water bag and speeded up the flow with no problems.

From memory, I think that my gravity filter (sawyer) can fill up my 1.8 L Hoser in something like 5 mins.

Not super speedy, but reality is that I am setting up camp while gravity is doing the work.

If you want to see a detailed explaination of of the setup I am using, see the reader review of the Sawyer Filter.

I have step by step instructions on how to build a gravity filter.

From what I can tell, what I have put together, using platypus bags, is lighter than the Clean Stream System.

I save weight by using my Hydration system as the clean water catch bag.

Hope this helps.

-Tony

Tony:

Curious — the Sawyer filter — does it require priming prior to use — when the core has dried out in-between trips?

The Sawyer purifier requires priming — which killed the deal for me. I wonder about the filter — maybe it's different?

david. i hear you with the aquamira frontier system. i'm not totally sold on it either. i have used a katadyn gravity filter for boundry waters trips when weight is not so much of an issue. i love it. when i saw that platypus had a similar system, got all excited, until i saw the weight and bulkiness. i called the company to see if they would be putting out a single hiker system. was told that you can purchase hose and filter to hook onto smaller platy bags. haven't decided yet if that's the way to go…..anyone tried this yet??

Ben,

I never have really thought about it, but the Sawyer filter does require priming before using.

In the field, after every use, I suck all of the water out of the filter before storing it in my back for two reasons:

1. to decrease the weight of the filter when carried
2. to prevent water leaking inside my pack while stored

This is done by using the output end of the filter as a straw and sucking all the remaining water out.

When the filter is dry and I am going to use it on the trail or as a gravity filter in camp, I simply prime the filter by sucking on the output end to pull a little water through the dry filter. Once this is done, the flow will continue on its own.

As a gravity filter, I remove the bite piece from my Platypus Hoser Hydration system and attach the tubing to the output end of the Sawyer filter and then suck on the end of the tubing that attaches to my Hoser…creating a syphon action to prime the filter.

I find that priming it is very quick and easy…never really thought of it as priming. It requires less suction than what is required for a thick milk shake.

Victoria,

Essentially, my gravity filter is a Clean Stream, except that my filter is a Sawyer…all the other parts are Platypus parts.

The only problem is that my setup requires the Platypus Filter Link, which has been discontinued by Playtpus.

No doubt, they discontinued making the Filter Link in anticipation of coming out with the Filter Link.

If you want to see how I setup mine, please see the detailed reader review that I wrote up on the Sawyer Filter. It has step by step instructions on how to build my setup and how to use it.

http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/reviews/display_reviews?forum_thread_id=5536&cat=Hydration%20-%20Water%20Treatment&cid=55

When the Clean stream came out, I was pretty excited that it might be a replacement for my setup, but found the Clean Stream heavy. You might be able to use the upper section of the Clean Stream and then use a Hydration System as a catch bag.

Hope that this helps.

-Tony

Thanks for the feedback, Tony.

Tony,

1. I thought of using the 4L water tank as my dirty bag, too, since I often take it on trips to ferry water to camp, but it leaks when you invert it upside down. So…I've been using a 3L Platy hydration reservoir–the new ones which have a hang loop on the bottom which is perfect for hanging. The nice thing about the New Platypus Clean Stream is that the included dirty bag is already "upside down"–the opening is at the top for easy filling–plus it has a control valve at the bottom to "pause" the flow to fill another container. I'm almost tempted to buy the system just for the dirty bag–although it isn't cheap at $80.

2. REI's website claims "1 liter / min" for the Saywer. Is this accurate? My problem with the Frontier Pro has largely been flow rate. I wonder if the carbon element included slows it down. Maybe your "priming" idea would help the Frontier Pro as well?

3. Are there any homemade solutions to the carbon element? I love good tasting water, which is why I keep using MSR Sweetwater filter, despite its 11 oz weight. The water from this filter is better than my tap water at home. Now the Frontier Pro has the carbon element, but waiting for chemicals to do their thing is not fun in a group situation. I want to filter my water and go, not sit around and wait.

I have access to plenty of carbon in my chem lab–I wonder if there's a way to stick some in the tubing so the water will pass through.

PS–Ben, are you still using the Frontier Pro gravity setup as your main filter? Has the flow rate been acceptable?

David,

I think that 1 L per minute is possible provided that the dirty bag is hung from a tree branch and that there is a long distance of tubing between the dirty bag and the clean bag.

I don't know the science behind this, but the longer the tubing distance between the two bags, the faster the rate of flow has been.

As I am using whatever comes standard with the Platypus Hoser Hydration System (2.5 ft) and don't hang my dirty bag, I am getting probably 1/2 liter per minute.

Again, not a big issue to me as I am setting up camp while the gravity filter is doing its thing.

I definitely prime the gravity filter/sawyer to start the process….would not recommend relying puring on gravity. Why not prime when it takes no effort and speeds the process up.

Come to think of it, the one time that I am sure that I got 1 L filtration per minute was when I sat on the dirty bag to "force" the water through….the water was flying through the Sawyer filter then.

A friend of mine tried to build a carbon filter attachment using a auto gas filter with limited success.

The big issue for my friend, still, is finding some sort of screen that would allow good water flow through it and to prevent the carbon from escaping.

If you find a good solution for the dirty bag that seals well, please let me know.

My 4 L Platypus Water tank is the only part of my system that is annoying me as it is so hard to close.

Edit: When I am on the trail, I use the Sawyer filter with a disposable pint bottle to hold dirty water. I then use the Sawyer as a straw to suck the water through the filter. The flow is fast and covers all my water needs without chemicals; instant water!

-Tony

David:

Yes, I am using my Frontier Pro and yes, the flow rate is quite acceptable.

Tony:

The higher you are, the faster and more forceful you fall — same as with water — until you reach the maximum gravity force (G). Something like that.

Tony:

When you speak of using long tubing to improve flow rate, are you using the tubing between the dirty bag and the filter, or the filter and the clean bag? It has been my experience that placing a length of tubing (around 3') between the dirty bag and the filter improves flow rate significantly. Based on my rudimentary knowledge of physics, Pressure = Force / Area . . . thus by reducing the cross-sectional area of the water above the filter, you increase the pressure (i.e., pressure is inversely proportional to area). However, the problem with this is you end up with a very long system that requires you to hang it high from a tree and you have to carry around the extra weight of additional tubing. Even with the tubing between the dirty bag and the filter, when I used my Frontier Pro system once on an overnight trip above treeline this summer, it was excruciatingly slow–and I had to hold it above my head the whole time due to the lack of trees. On a subsequent 4-day trip, I gave up and took my MSR Sweetwater filter. This was in Colorado's Weminuche Wilderness and we were crossing streams about every mile, so I figured I would carry less water and filter more frequently. I suppose I can see how the Frontier Pro setup would work if you are filtering near a campsite, but for on-the-go water collection, it seems way too inconvenient. Now…I wonder if it would have helped if I "primed" it first since it would have been dry on that first night out. I guess I run some more tests here at home and see if that helps.

I'm still trying to figure out why the Frontier Pro would have a slower flow rate than that of the Sawyer or the new Platy Clean Stream, given the fact that the pores are 10x larger in the Frontier Pro (3 microns vs. 0.3). Again, is it the carbon?

Ben???

Now as for the Clean Stream vs. Sawyer, does anyone see any benefits to the Clean Stream aside from the nice "dirty" bag?

David:

I suspect carbon would slow down water flow rate. Indeed, while you can certainly increase the flow by rolling the dirty bag and "pushing" water through the filter and on to the clean bag — I bet that would actually affect filtration and adsorption adversely!

Looking at my notes, gravity mode came to about 2.5 minutes per liter. To me, not having a place to hang the dirty bag would be much more annoying than not having a faster flow rate. Just asking rhetorically… are you really in that much of a hurry when setting up camp and filtering water?

Moi, since I fliter water only for myself, I've moved away from the gravity method. When I need water, I just drink through the Frontier Pro filter. For times when I need half a cup or so, I simply remove the bite valve and let gravity pull through the required quantity. No big deal (to me).

But if I were to revert back to full gravity mode, I think I would rig up something so that I can simply rest the dirty bag on top of my tent — so the height / tube length will always stay constant — and no worries about the absence of trees and rocks. YMMV.

David,

Good questions.

In my case, my Sawyer filter's input is directly connected to a Platypus Filter link, when is then screwed onto the dirty bag.

As a result, all of the tubing that I have is on the clean side going to my clean bag/Platypus Hoser Hydration Bag.

Perhaps it would be faster as you described, but due to my setup, there is not much I could do to change it, as I need the filter link to be short for how I use my Sawyer Filter on the trail. (I am assuming you saw my review on the Sawyer Filter and how I use it on the trail).

The only appealing thing that I see about the Clean Stream is the Dirty bag portion of the system, but it looks heavier than what I am currently using.

-Tony

Tony:

How does the taste of the Sawyer compare to filters containing carbon, such as the MSR Sweetwater? If the Sawyer is really no different from the Clean Stream, then I see no benefit of paying the bucks. However, it seems like MSR would invest in a good filter. What I like about your system (and the Clean Stream) is the absence of waiting around for chemicals like in the Frontier Pro.

Ben:

I agree–in camp it's no problem to wait but I'm talking about on the trail. Since I do most of my hiking with my wife, we have to use the Frontier Pro in gravity mode. So again, I see it being useful for camp but waiting around for chemicals on the trail is highly inconvenient.

Do you use your Pro with a hydration system like the Platy Hoser, or just with a 2L Platy water bottle? Do you use the bite valve from the Pro or the Platy Hoser?

All:
I just retested the Frontier Pro in my kitchen. Again, the flow rate was REALLY slow without the extra length of tubing between the dirty bag and filter. And once again, with a 3' length of tubing in between, I got 2 L to filter in 3.5 minutes. At first it was sort of slow, but then I realized that there was trapped air inside the tube. By sucking on the clean end, I was able to remove this trapped air…immediately it became faster. I think that Tony's idea of "priming" makes all the difference and might explain my poor success whilst in the field this past summer.

David:

I use the Pro with my Platypus 1L bottles when on the trail (bottle –> tube –> Pro / Pro bite valve).

As for sucking to prime the Pro — might your wife find that disgusting? :) Maybe you can give gravity an initial assist by rolling the dirty bag to push water through for the first few seconds?

"As for sucking to prime the Pro — might your wife find that disgusting? :) "

The fun part is explaining the importance of swallowing, as spitting it out deprives her of important fluids.
Hydration is important. Convince her it's a survival skill.

David,

I have the MSR Mini Water works and I have a friend who has the MSR Sweetwater….I like how much faster/easier it is to use the Sweetwater vs. the Water Works.

Since most of my backpacking has been in the Sierras, the water taste great and appears very clean to me to the point that drinking it straight does not seem totally insane.

As such, I have not noticed any difference between the Sawyer and a MSR filter in terms of water taste. (It does not help that I have a poor sense of smell too.)

I have only used active carbon in conjunction once, which was just in Oct in Big Basin, CA.

The trail headed to the ocean and as such, the water in the creek was low and ranged from cloudy white to stagnate with rotting leaves.

I did not even attempt to use the filter without the active carbon attachment, which Ben Tang was nice enough to mail up to me for free!

The water tasted just okay withe the carbon, but still had some noticeable funny taste to it, I could only imagine how bad it would have tasted without it.

Anyway, my point is this…using the Sawyer filter is not going to anything to improve the taste of crappy water at all.

The 1st time I used my Sawyer filter was when my friend's MSR Sweetwater filter clogged and failed. He did not bring the cleaning kit for it, so it was unfiltered water or use the Sawyer filter.

The water was green and things were swimming in my dirty platypus bag….the filtered water coming out of the Sawyer was green. My wife, two friends, and I all drank more than 2 L each of this water will no ill effects.

At my local REI, a Sawyer sales rep was there and I told him about our experience and he explained that things dissolved in the water at the molecular level would pass through the filter, but bacterial and such bad stuff would not.

He even told that if I mixed Gatorade powder into the dirty water, it would pass through the Sawyer filter.

Sounded odd to me, but makes sense.

For me, if the water that I had looked bad and tasted bad after filtering, then I would dump in some GU20 powder that I normally carry to mask the flavor.

Back to you question, as I am rambling now, MSR does make good "heavy" filters, but they do have carbon built in.

Speaking of which, I think that there are some filter out there that can be used in a gravity filter that does have an active carbon component to them.

You might want to take a look at this:

http://www.ula-equipment.com/amigo.htm

I don't care for the open funnel dirty water catch at the top, but it is another option.

P.S. Christopher, you are a sick man, but I like your way of thinking. :)

-Tony

"MSR does make good "heavy" filters, but they do have carbon built in."

Which makes me wonder why the Clean Stream doesn't. At least it doesn't claim to. I'm going to call and ask them why they don't include carbon in this system.

So…given the acceptable flow rate of my Pro given the "priming" technique, it just boils down to waiting for the chemicals to work. Anyone know what's the minimum time for chlorine dioxide to kill the viruses and bacteria (let's say water is between 32-50 degrees F)?

Now Ben and Christopher, knock it off, guys, knock it off. You guys are just jealous.

Treatment times for bacteria and viruses are… hey I ain't jealous, no sir, I ain't! :(

David,

My guess is that neither the Sawyer or the Clean Stream have active carbon built in because then it would create an issue of developing a way to open up the filter to then replace the spent carbon.

The hole tubes for both filters never wear out or decay.

I have opened my filter up to take a look at the U shaped strands.

Given how easy it would be to accidentally damage them, I can see why they have not added a carbon element to the filter.

-Tony