Does Carbon fiber hiking pole conduct electricity?

Yes

Yes, very, very well.

Not as well as Aluminum poles. But the lightning has already bothered to jump across over a mile of air, the difference in connectivity of the last few feet will make little difference.

Additional insights here, towards the bottom of the article.

Josh,

Welcome back. I hope you'll create a thread describing your recent trip.

You should probably use copper tent stakes for grounding!

Hey Jason, Thats a good one. I actually used a stick during a recent lightning storm to set up my Gatewood Cape. Maybe I'm just being a wuss. Casey, I did a trip report last night if you want to check it out.
Thanks for all of your responses.
Josh

Josh,

I've laid awake many of evening as a thunderstorm rolled in, contemplating what I've done by using my trekking poles to support my tarp. I just can't get over the fact that the lightning rods on the barns and farmhouses where I grew up in the Midwest were the EXACT SAME SHAPE!!!

To make matters worse, I start contemplating what would happen if a bolt actually hit my poles, since the foam grips would make a pretty good insulator, or at least semi-conductor, as best I can figure. I think this means that I would have a firestorm as the current scattered to ground.

Come to think of it, this is probably what inspires me to carry that flask of Southern Comfort – it seems to make everything all better!

Jason:

CF poles can't be any worse than alum poles, right? Not that I really know, but I think in your case, if lightning were to strike your vertical tent pole, it would be conducted instantly to the ground and "dispersed" out (the ground presumably being a better conductor then your sleeping pad and bag).

For "regular" tent poles (e.g. dome tents), I think (hope) that the current will arc along the pole curves and be conducted to the ground as well — much like a person inside an automobile is actually quite safe (or so they say). Just don't be touching the pole(s). :)

Whatever the conductivity of your various tarp/tent components, I wouldn't take any comfort in the fact that they're a bit more conductive than you are and are a couple feet away. This isn't a 9V trying to complete a circuit – it's like a million-billion air-exploding earth-fusing volts. IF nothing else the shockwave (thunder) of a strike that close would be something akin to a concussion grenade going off right next to your head. I'd instead plan on taking care in camp site selection. :)

I remember from static electricity lessons that pointed things like lightening conductors can actually bring up such a density of charge from the earth that if there is enough opposite charge in the clouds above it can stream off the point as an electric wind of ionized particles. This given time neutralizes the charge in the clouds but often just forms an easy path of preionized particles for a lightning leader. I dont know any more but a pointy trekking pole might act in this way if earthed well. I am sure it is really complicated.

> if lightning were to strike your vertical tent pole, it would be conducted instantly to the ground

Actually, it is more likely that the tent pole with turn into a ball of plasma – Al or CF. There a few million amps involved.

I have seen trees which have been hit. The current heated the sap inside the tree and the tree just exploded. Matchwood.

I think the point here is more simple. Is lightning more likely to hit your pole because it's a pole as opposed to say the near by tree? And is CF more likely to be hit than an AL pole? Than a stick?

If your shelter gets hit, you're screwed. So, are you more likely to be hit with that pole up? And is it even a realistic option to not have your shelter up in a rainstorm? Or say you set up your shelter tied to a tree (like a tarp), are you now in greater danger because your ropes are tied to a tall object?

My guess is that a trekking pole is more likely to be hit than the tree that it's next to. That's not good. But you also don't really have an option of not using a shelter in most storms. And that having a shelter that uses a tree as a support isn't safer than having a freestanding shelter.

Theoretically, once lightning strikes your tent you are better off with a good conductor as a tent pole… this will allow more of the charge to go directly to the ground through the pole, and make it less likely to travel through you. OTOH, a metal pole may increase the risk of being struck in the first place.

The location of your campsite is the most important factor however. If you get hit by a big strike you are probably going to be fried no matter what. Better to choose your campsite wisely, or get out quick if you are in an exposed area when a lightning storm is threatening.

Interestingly, you can even get fried by lightning traveling sideways through the ground… so it's a bad idea to be lying down during a lightning storm. The charge can run along the ground and may end up taking a detour through your prone body.

Plenty of good advice here…

http://www.cimms.ou.edu/~doswell/tstm_camping_safety.html

"Or say you set up your shelter tied to a tree (like a tarp), are you now in greater danger because your ropes are tied to a tall object?"

If there aren't many trees around, then yes, you are definitely in greater danger. If there are plenty of trees, choose one of the shortest ones!

let's just say that lightening sucks!

Thanks everyone, Its one thing to talk about and its another to be in it. I liked the site you posted Ashley. It sounded like the hiking pole used to set up my shelter wouldn't matter much but I still think that I would rather use a stick if I had the time.
Josh

It's my understanding that people get hit regularly by indirect strikes that travel through the ground. These are more survivable than a direct hit. Hence the importance of being in lightning position on a foam pad.

I was camped high once when an approaching thunderstorm had my poles actually humming.

I vacated the tent and crouched next to a boulder under my poly undersheet on my foam mat.

Needless to say, the tent didn't get hit and I got very wet. These days I'm more sanguine about these things. I'm just not scared of dying anymore.

If lightning struck your pole, you would have other things to worry about than a firestorm. As Roger said, there are millions of volts involved, so you would most definitely get shocked from stray sparks. That would mean electrical burns over most of your body. Then you would have to deal with the ludicrous amounts of ozone the bolts give off. You might even suffocate, if you weren't already dead. Most likely you would also be blind. Grounding would do little to prevent this.

So I guess I was wrong. You really would have nothing else to worry about, what with the being dead and all.

On a more serious note, the conductivity of a particular pole versus another is not as important as its height relative to objects around it. Trees are barely conductive and still get targeted fairly often, just because of height. I wouldn't worry about anything too much, if you are going to get hit, there's little you can do to prevent it. The only exception is if you hear metal starting to ring, obviously. (I don't know if CF rings, does anyone else know?)

Most people struck by lightning do not die.

I would have to disagree on this point. People which are actually *struck* by lightning generally die, assuming that most of the time there are metallic objects in contact with the skin (think zipper, pant buttons, chains, rings, etc…). A person entirely naked or with no metal in contact with the skin and with a high enough skin resistance may cause the current to flash around the (lucky) person. I guess it pays to be in the buff. :)

More often, people are struck by discharges branching off of a main bolt and generally get severe burns. The article Greg linked to backs this up, adding that limb placement plays an important role in the amount of damage incurred. The wider apart the body is, the higher the charge differential, which in turn makes it much more deadly.

Taking all of this into account would mean that the best place to be is inside of a ditch in the foetal position. However saying that "most people struck by lightning do not die" is either a gross generalization of what "struck by lightning" is or is just wrong. Around 10% of people involved in lightning incidents (not necessarily direct strikes) die as a result.

More information here: http://www.lightningsafety.noaa.gov/resources/Ltg%20Safety-Facts.pdf
And here: http://www.uic.edu/labs/lightninginjury/pubs.html

I have followed this thread with interest, since there has been similar discussion among hammock campers. Is it safer to be on the ground or in a hammock?

Since in it's basic form, lightning is 'the sudden massive flow of electrical current neutralizing the charge separation between the clouds and the ground', the practical question for us is how to minimize becoming part of a 'step leader' for the conductive path.

Close contact with metal poles (i.e. golf clubs) in exposed areas seems to be problematic. It is not illogical to think that using other conductive materials in our shelters is potentially an issue.

It would seem that being off the ground may have some advantage, in that the conductive path is from the ground to the cloud.

That being said, if a tree gets struck directly, I don't know that it would matter if my hammock was connected to it or my tent was at it's base, I'm pretty much screwed.

I think Devin is right in that site selection is likely more important than using wood, metal or carbon fiber poles, and Rog has the right philosophy on outcome.

As much as I don't want to get killed by lightning, (and I REALLY don't want to get struck by lightning) I'd rather get killed while backpacking in the wilderness than die of heart failure in a cubicle. Come to think of it, it would be even more cool to be killed by a grizzly.

When lightning hits the ground, and megaAmps, there is a huge 'ground-bounce' or current/voltage surge locally. This can kill you up to 40 m away from the point of impact if you have several points of contact with the ground. This is why 'they' recommend the 'fetal crouch' with feet very close together.

I really don't think what your tent pole is made of matters a hoot in hell.