The North Face sucks

Isn't Mountain Hardwear owned by Columbia now?

Arc'teryx seems to be all the fashion craze where I'm at. I wouldn't be surprised to see Arcteryx go downhill pretty fast now that the founder has left and they've been sold (to Salomon??). Lately it seems like innovation has dried up at Arcteryx and they're just rolling in money from selling $800 jackets to soccer moms.

Where I live MH is used about town considerably more often than TNF- but every brand is "commercial" and one cannot blame the company if it becomes the brand worn by non-outdoorsman. ULers are being elitist if they look down on non-backpackers wearing "technical" clothing in the mall- they have every right to buy & use as they wish. In fact their purchases are vital to the support of much of the industry. It certainly is common that producers change their emphasis overtime, especially after the founder is no longer involved- heck it even happen to KFC after the Colonel sold out (he criticized extra crispy as a "ball of dough on a stick"). As for prominent logos- they are way too frequent in all product lines. Please leave critics like Naomi Klein out of it- she knows little about economics & less about backpacking.

Hey guys, I think you just got trolled.

This is a two year old thread, started by someone whose only posts were about how crappy TNF is. It was resurrected by a guy whose only posts are to dis TNF, and there's some guy named Spanky Sox posting about how crappy TNF is. Ta DA, we have a winner.

So lets all get a bit serious and go back to discussing how disgusting Budweiser is. There's a real crime against humanity!!!

The only place Bud should be tried is in The Hague.

Dirk

"Hey guys, I think you just got trolled.

This is a two year old thread, started by someone whose only posts were about how crappy TNF is. It was resurrected by a guy whose only posts are to dis TNF,"

And who went to the trouble of doing an avatar defacing NF's logo.

"So lets all get a bit serious and go back to discussing how disgusting Budweiser is. There's a real crime against humanity!!!"

There are worse beer than Bud — Miller, for instance.

"The only place Bud should be tried is in The Hague."

It's already been tried in the Hague; It's called Stella Artois over there. ;}

This thread led me to the Wikipedia entry for The North Face, which in turn led me to the web site of a parody started by a 16-year-old: The South Butt. The young entrepreneur is being sued by The North Face for trademark infringement. More info at thesouthbutt.com.

The North Face v. The South Butt… too funny

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"i'm sorry, but ALL beer is good beer when you are backpacking, canoe camping, etc."

Welllll, almost all beer. I can think of a couple of sure fire exceptions…. :)

I would rather drink warm water on a hot day than iced cold Miller Lite. Really.

More craft breweries need to get canning machines like Ska did. Hiking with glass bottles is such a PITA. I can only drink Miller High Life from the big three.

But for beer drinking and lightweight you have to go with Steel Reserve 211 XXX export that comes in 22oz cans for like $1.19 at 9.8%. Tastes even worse that regular 211 Steel Reserve.

For the harder stuff you can always buy a half pint of Everclear for a few bucks and cut the hell out of it with water or something else to get by.

One April a bunch of us were heading out on a weeklong X-C ski tour in California (South Lake, Bishop Pass, LeConte Canyon, the Muir Hut, Evolution, Lamarck Col, North Lake). We were each loaded pretty heavy, but Jim's pack was much bigger than the rest. We got to the first night's snow camp, and during dinner Jim pulled out one of the big cans of Guinness. Well, that got some attention as he drank it. It seemed like a heavy thing to bring along, but that was OK for just the first night. We got to the second night's snow camp, and he pulled out another big one of Guinness. Geez! We got to the Muir Hut, and he had a tiny can of Guinness. Now we are getting curious. Next night, a tiny can. Next night in snow camp, nothing (it was very cold). Last night out, and he had his last big can of it. Amazing! That had to be the least weight-efficient load.
–B.G.–

Man don't get me started.. If ever there was an invention that needed to be made to lighten my load.

Anything from Oskar Blues is a good choice, all great, the classic top micros in a can.. Gordon's of course, the higher gravity go-to.

Everclear is great if you use an alcohol stove, as a fuel backup, and intoxicant, but that crap is brutal even if you dilute if heavily. Generally though, I just bring tequila in a 500ml up-cycled water bottle.

The most space effective beer was Molson Canadian cold shots(smaller redbull can and 6%) for canoeing. But then again drinking Molson is like licking an Esbit tab. Some Canadian Beer sucks, most is amazing. Cheap "Clear Creek" is 6.2% and $5 for a six pack…

I think Tom Caldwell hit the nail on the head. When the companies are just starting out there is an incentive to keep the quality high to garner the loyalty and support of customers. Once the product becomes a brand and that name is sold, then it's all about the bottom line.

I recently bought a RAB top-o-the-line jacket and was suprised to see it was made in China. I used to have a great deal of respect for RAB and and other companies because they made their products with pride instead of out-sourcing them to increase their bottom line. It's a slippery slope when you start to focus on the bottom line instead of the quality and bang for buck of the product. Call me sentimental but I would rather pay a little extra and have something that was not massed produced in the same factory that makes ADDIDAS sweaters using child labor.

Paul.

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@ Paul Stupkin:

Pretty unfortunate that you have essentially painted an entire country as one big child labor sweatshop!

China is a big country — and while much less advanced or wealthy overall — China's factories do run the gamut from truly high quality to the truly awful.

That RAB (and many other top companies) would outsource their "top of the line" products is a solid testament that some Chinese factories are quite up to standard.

yup.
so i got a mountain light jacket for xmas. it's elite, but how xxx can you design a jacket built strictly for mountaineering and winter travel and not put alpine pockets on it? i mean, how can you have a $300 jacket with pockets that are useless when wearing a pack? it makes me sad.

Benjamin, I am not lashing out by any means. Maybe that is how the companies make their products more affordable, but more than likely it's about increasing the bottom line. When that becomes the focus where does it stop? Many companies have gone down that road like TNF has, and their products have suffered for it.

I understand that quality control varies due to the sheer number of factories, but it also means that there is less chance of catching faulty products as items are often shipped straight from the factory to warehouses and then shelves. Yes, top of the line products are produced in China and there are many who still maintain high QC, but, there are a great number of brands that have face planted when trying to cut costs.

Child labor is prevelant in China so I feel that my concerns are very valid. It's hardly an issue that companies will want to advertise so I feel that while things are produced in countries that do not openly oppose and combat it, it will remain an area of consideration when I purchase my items and the tag says "made in China".

I just got back from a five day trip with my eight and ten year old. It was the first one I've done with just the three of us, but my wife had to work.

They weren't sure how I was going to fit the four 1/2 litre cans of Heineken, but I explained to them that if I carried them, I wouldn't need a first aid kit. Once I'd demonstrated to them on the first night how to splint a broken arm with an empty Heineken can, they were perfectly satisfied.

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I think every major company has had decline in quality. TNF being popular decided to throw their logo on crappy stuff to make a quick buck. They still have some decent stuff, but cashing in on your fame is the American way. The best companies that still make good stuff would be Arcteryx, MH and Patagonia thought they could go downhill as well. I've been selective about my North Face purchases. As always buyer beware!

Just another reason to support cottage manufacturers whenever possible.