Topic

how does a 3 season tent hold up in 0F conditions

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PostedJun 10, 2008 at 11:00 am

Hi newbie here,

so i wanna take a 3 season tent winter camping (a lowest of 15F), which is a pretty old topic. ive done a bit of a search and there's been a comment here and there but nothing in depth.. (perhaps i need to search harder)

I have a MSR single man Hubba. After looking carefully at the inner tent, its really just all mesh material.

I figure that the inner layer being so highly ventilated probably offers nothing in terms of warmth.

So my question is, could I just take the outer fly and get away with it? or would i need more clothing to offset the lack of an inner tent.

thanks!

PostedJun 10, 2008 at 11:22 am

There is too much information left out to hazard a response. Where do you plan to winter camp, what altitude, what type/tempature rating of your sleeping bag.

PostedJun 10, 2008 at 11:35 am

initially i'm planning to camp out at Thredbo Diggings in Australia. As to altitude im not sure.. but its at the foot of the mountain where i think the coldest is around -9C so around 15F

I have a Ultralamina 15F sleeping bag which is synthetic.

i guess i'm pushing the limits

Steven Nelson BPL Member
PostedJun 10, 2008 at 6:46 pm

I don't think temperature is the main concern; snow loading and winds are more important considerations for winter.

Most 4-season tents have stronger structures (e.g. more and/or thicker poles, multiple pole crossing points or a flexible tunnel design), and can be completely sealed against wind and spindrift (or dust, for that matter).

Double walls don't add that much insulation, and plenty of people use single-wall shelters in winter (whether Bibler-style tents or Hex/Megamid-style pyramids). For that matter, some people dig slit trenches or snow caves.

If you know for sure you don't be facing snow and strong winds, then your tent may be just fine. Hard to say without a bit more information about where you'll be camping.

Steven Evans BPL Member
PostedJun 10, 2008 at 8:08 pm

Hi Mario,
At the risk of sounding too non-chalant (sp?)…I think your tent will be fine. If your not going to encounter bad weather (ie. just low temperatures) then you don't need more then the hubba. Until the middle of last season, my winter tent was a Tarptent Double Rainbow…and many people use just a tarp and bivy in the "winter".

Edit:
I just reread your post and realized that I didn't really answer the question you were asking. So, do you need the inner tent? I would bring it. It won't offer much for warmth, but it may help in terms of dealing with condensation. The inner tent will help stop the any moisture dripping on you from the fly. If I remember correctly, the Hubba is tight quarters.
Extra clothes? Maybe, have you taken your bag to it's rated limit? Most bags are rated lower then they are actually comfortable to sleep in…but I have no experience with your bag so perhaps it's good. Go on a test run.

Mark Verber BPL Member
PostedJun 10, 2008 at 10:19 pm

While the mesh does not block air circulation in the same way as a solid fabric inner tent, it does have some minor effect. Could you use just the fly? Sure. Will you need additional clothing… maybe a few degrees. if you are looking at winter trips I would hope you would have more than a few degrees margin of safety… so it shouldn't make a big difference.

In the winter I have two concerns. First, in many locations the winds seem to be higher than during the summer… so I ask myself if this shelter up to the winds I expect to see. The second issue is snow. Will the shelter keep snow from accumulating around me in the shelter and if snow starts to pile up ontop of the shelter.

–mark

Roger Caffin BPL Member
PostedJun 10, 2008 at 10:35 pm

Hi Mario

The single-man Hubba relies on the inner tent for the floor. For snow conditions the Hubba really isn't good enough UNLESS you can be sure about the weather. At Thredbo Diggings you shouldn't get a lot of wind, and you would be lucky to even see much snow. Depends on the last few days normally. So the tent should be adequate but you should take the inner with the sewn-in floor, and some good tent pegs.

The fly has pretty poor ventilation, all things considered, so you are going to get some condensation on the inside of the tent during the night. Take an old sponge or washer to wipe the doorway down at least. You can't get to the rest very easily – tough.

Your sleeping bag – synthetic – hum … Make sure you have a good mat/foam under you, full length, and have a good fleece jacket or better as well. The cold air wafts down that valley rather badly.

Mind you, that's assuming we get much of a winter. I'm hoping…

Cheers
Roger Caffin
Sydney, Australia

Brad Rogers BPL Member
PostedJun 11, 2008 at 5:34 am

I have used my BA Seedhouse SL1 is 0* conditions a time or two and have been fine with my 0* bag. I don't know if I would use it all the time in those conditions, but it doesn't get that cold here often.

PostedJun 11, 2008 at 3:53 pm

I learned the hard way last winter how a 3 season tent is different from a 4 season tent in winter conditions. After setting up in a windy notch for a day of ice climbing, I came back to an inch of wind driven snow covering everthing inside the tent. Even with a snow wall, it had blown under the fly and through the mesh.

PostedJun 11, 2008 at 6:35 pm

Why is it that wind picks up in the winter? Is that really true? I've spent my fair share out in the Wasatch Mountains during the winter – not backpacking though – and it does get windy. But is it really any windier than any other season? Even if you are above treeline, isn't it just always windy? (Correct a non-winter backpacker here if I am wrong).

BTW – thanks for sharing that experience with the SL1. I'll know not to try that.

Steven Nelson BPL Member
PostedJun 12, 2008 at 11:27 am

The real issue with wind in winter is the spindrift, and to a lesser extent, snow loading from drifts. Use a mesh tent, or a single-wall shelter with gaps, and you can end up with a nice layer of powder all over everything inside. I'm sure there are locations where the same thing will happen with fine dust in the summer, but it's almost guaranteed with blowing snow.

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