Got it in the mail!!

[Sven Klingemann]

Yeah – I am holding my Refuge X in my hot little hands … how exciting!! Will try it out in Michigan starting on Thursday … :-)
Will keep you updated on its performance!
S.

[Andrew Richardson]

Awesome Sven!! I'm excited to hear your report and see some pics!

Have fun!

[mark cole]

Got mine today also. I also got the sil nylon version just in case the wife couldn't handle the semi-transparentness on the cuben. (she was fine with it).
First let me say this is completely cool. 441 grams w/ lines and stuff sack!
A simple yet brilliant design. No seams in the main canopy, i just put some tape on the guy out points for total waterproofness. I don't see how a "bathtub" floor would make any difference. The cuben is strong and NO stretch. Once you have your pitch (which takes about 2 min.) , you're set. It is NOT noisy in the wind. It is so spacious inside I started laughing out loud the first time I got in. Perfect for me cause we sit up and meditate in the morning-TONS of headroom. (that's why I went tent vs. tarp. So nice to not be bothered by bugs).
Time will tell how it holds up, but personally, I think it will last and last.
Lastly ,I give a HUGE thumbs up to Ron for having the balls to jump in and build this for us out of cuben, a product that scares a lot of people (which I feel in unwarranted). I sincerely hope he reaps his just rewards.

If you have any inclination to own this tent I say go for it.

[Dustin F]

Can you guys report back on condensation? I'm planning on bulding a combined version of his Lunar Solo and Serenity net tent using cuben with a sil bathtub floor but Im concerned the Cuben will have huge condensation issues.

[mark cole]

From my experience with cuben and when i talked to Ron Bell he mentioned it also, the cuben seems to promote condensation LESS than silnylon. I think it has to do with the fact that the fabric (for lack of a better word) doesn't insulate as well as the nylons and so you don't get a temp differential between inside and outside the fabric. More like there was nothing there at all.
Maybe some of the science guys could speculate/ elaborate.

[Charles Mason]

I'd imagine if not folded much and compressed in a large ziplock bag it would be the size of a magazine. Any photos showing how low the volume compresses adjacent to a regular use object for scale would be much appreciated.

[Ross Bleakney]

I took a a picture of the Refuge X, inside the stuff sack. It fits inside the sack easily, so I also pushed down on the top, twisted it, and then took another picture. The dimensions are (roughly):

Uncompressed: 12" high, 19" circumference — http://www.flickr.com/photos/rossbl/2481280472

Compressed: 9" high, 19" circumference —
http://www.flickr.com/photos/rossbl/2481281368

I could probably compress it even more, but that should give you a rough idea.

[Charles Mason]

Thanks, probably compresses more with a purge valved sack.

[mark cole]

Mine's a 4"x13" cylinder w/ loads of extra space in the stuff sack.

[Jim Sweeney]

I don't doubt your experience with Cuben creating less condensation than silnylon, but I wonder if it can be due to the difference in their insulating properties. If the Cuben is a poorer insulator, then its interior surface should be colder (i.e, more like the outside and less like the inside) than for the silnylon. This should promote more condensation, all other things being equal, as condensation occurs when moisture laden air comes in contact with a surface cold enough to cause the air layer next to it to become super-saturated.

But there may be something going on with the micro-geometry of the two fabric surfaces which makes heat transfer between the cuben and the air less effective. It feels slicker, somehow, and smoother, IMHO. Perhaps the silnylon, if looked at under a microscope, would have more hills and valleys?

[Lynn Tramper]

I had the worst condensation of my life in the Refuge-X. I put it down to all the ground level perimeter mesh. If you camp on damp ground, this mesh allows a heap of moisture to enter the tent where it then gets trapped by the cuben. Obviously this would not be a problem on dry ground…if this is the cause of the condensation I experienced, then I would expect the same to happen with the silnylon version. Any feedback on the silnylon Refuge???

Anyhow, I am pretty happy with my modified Refuge-X version 1. With an extended bathtub floor in place (which does seem to control condensation better on damp ground), and a cuben poncho as a rain porch, this little tent packs a punch for the weight that is unexcelled IMHO. It's a palace to hang out in!

[Diplomatic Mike]

Hi Allison,
On the subject of condensation, you gave the Warmlite 2R a thumbsdown regarding condensation. You mentioned the ground level perimeter mesh as being a factor in this.
I've just got my 2R and have only used it once. Some condensation, but the ground was saturated, and it was a still night just below freezing. I had two folk in the tent. I would have expected some condensation in any tent under those conditions.
I don't have this ground level mesh around the perimeter. Maybe they have changed the design?
Sorry to take the thread off topic briefly.

[Lynn Tramper]

>I don't have this ground level mesh around the perimeter. Maybe they have changed the design?

I should probably change that review, as I was referring to the vent that runs across the front of the vestibule. It does not sit ON the ground, but ithas allowed moisture (from the ground I presume) and spindrift to enter. In severe winds we have had this panel flapping on the ground, splashing moisture into the tent.

Anyway, definitely off topic, but good to discuss sources of moisture/condensation in different designs. In our Double Rainbow and Nallo, the vestibule(s) often attract the most condensation when the ground is sodden, so this problem is not unique to the Refuge or Warmlite!

[Diplomatic Mike]

Cheers Allison.
I think the only way to totally avoid condensation is to be in a VB suit in a sealed tent, and breathe through a tube to the outside! :)

Back on topic.

[Sara C]

I can't comment on the Refuge X. Don't own one yet! I can only comment on my 3 Tarptents (Virga, Cloudburst and Double Rainbow) that have the mesh along the bottom sides. I live in the midwest and condensation in my Tarptents can be a problem. Sometimes a fair amount of moisture is on the interior walls of the tent; sometimes not. Often all of the environmental conditions can be similar on different nights, but it's like the flip of the coin. Sometimes wet, sometimes dry. Often I can feel the moisture after setting up the (dry) tent and check it a couple hours later and feel the moisture on the interior.

Having said all of that, I feel the H20 is not really enough to bother me. My usual plan of action is pack the tent up wet first thing and hit the trail. I'll stop about noon usually and dry it out somewhere quickly.

Hope to hear more about the Refuge X. Exciting.

Jon

[Greg Mihalik]

"I think the only way to totally avoid condensation is to be in a VB suit in a sealed tent, and breathe through a tube to the outside!"

Or don't set it up in Allison's backyard….

[Lynn Tramper]

Haha Greg!

The night of bad condensation was not that night, but a very cold, "dry" and frosty night when I was actually IN the tent. Although the condensation was bad by morning, it got worse during the day after I vacated the tent. I think this was just the frozen ground thawing out (it was a sunny day and I left the tent pitched to 'dry') and the heat from the sun causing evaporation under the mesh floor. The tent was dripping on the inside by the end of the day!!

So in that particular case, a VB suit and breathing tube would not have helped.

[Author]

Posts