Terra Nova Tents

[David Ure]

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[Martin Rye]

If “Kerlon 1200 has a hydrostatic head of 29kPa (ISO-811) for the outer and 3000mm. The floor is 49kPa and 5000mm”. That compares with Terra Nova with its minimum hydrostatic-head of 3000mm and average of 4000mm along with the bathtub floor being 5000mm and an average of 6000mm. Now seeing no advantages in the claims of Hilleberg as each has the same water resistance at the lowest point, I’m going to try and find out the tear strength of the Terra Nova SL fabric.

[Derek Goffin]

Martin,
Chris remarked on needing a big porch to cook in the tent with safety. You seemed to agree with him. I think the laser, as presented, has too small a porch for safety. How do you cook in the tent in your Laser?
Did you try folding the inner up in the groundsheet before dropping the fly yet?

[Roger Caffin]

Silicone coating inside and outside, at 50 gsm?
Sounds like ordinary silnylon to me, based on 1.1 oz parachute fabric. Well, identical specs anyhow.

Cheers

[Martin Rye]

Derek,
UK backpackers are wise to listen to advice from old pros like Chris. On the Laser porch yes I think its ok for my stove, rule of thumb pointed out by Chris is “What is a safe size for cooking depends on the stove you'll be using. I think there should be enough space around and above the stove that if it flares or falls over the flames will not reach the tent fabric” I think more space helps, yes an Akto offers 10cm more depth but don’t forget on height it rapidly curves in on the lower porch height. And for length again it cuts back to the end poles at a steep angle. I also think wind shields and stability help big time. I cooked in my old Akto in the rain and had a problem once which I mentioned somewhere. What matters was the door was open as the rain was not coming direct at the porch, so I removed the stove from the tent.

In bad weather I sometimes have to close the door fully and I think my stoves are OK for the Laser. It helps to give more space by undoing the inner gaining more space (see Pic) your right to have concerns on space but for wet cooking, but solo hiking I use the spare tent peg to great affect.

Enjoy the Challenge and do a trip report and if I meet you on it in the future I will buy you a drink.
Safe Hiking

[Martin Rye]

Roger,
Thanks for the clarity re: the flysheets as I have often heard it said that the Akto would be a more durable tent in use, yet the materials are the same spec as the Terra Nova. What matters is build quality and design. On build quality Hilleberg has the higher ground with its construction methods in stitching etc. The Laser officially needs a pole cover to prevent water ingress. Where the Akto has been made in a way that negates the need for a cover. But to be honest it’s splitting hairs over what are two very good tents.

[Derek Goffin]

Those pictures show it all. We use the Caldera cone or a jetboil and if driven totally inside with the door shut we get a similar effect to your spare tent peg with another loop sewn on the tension band about 9" further in so the toggle can be hooked in to get more room for cooking in the same way as your peg. With 2 sleeping this stops the second mat from being laid out until after cooking is over. I thought the layout shown in the top photo was a bit too close unless the door was open.
For others looking at the picture, notice how Martin has the pot handle facing down the long axis of the tent. If the Caldera cone ever overflames most of the flame comes out at the pot handle so it is safer to point this big slot toward the widest space.
I asked Terra Nova if they would experiment with a double ended zip so that you could open the top end, under the hood, to make a high vent for cooking and still conditions but they have not replied.

[Martin Rye]

Derek,
You right in the top pic is as probably as close for comfort as I would want with cooking in a porch. As for Terra Nova I wish they would listen to your point and also add guy points to the pole so we can chose to seam seal it and forgo the pole cover. I’m looking to have guy points attached and drop the cover soon any way. And a top of the tent vent would be great.

I’m in Scotland for a week soon and will try the method of folding the inner up as you suggested. I need to get out on the hills and off the PC.

[David Ure]

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[Chris Townsend]

The Akto and Terra Nova Laser flysheet fabrics are certainly very similar. I doubt there's much if any difference in tear strength. The point, I think, is that silicone nylon is much stronger than other tent fabrics, which is why it's the best material for lightweight tents. Hilleberg has been using silicone nylon since the late 1970s. I first used a Hilleberg silicone nylon tent in 1991. At that time the only other company I knew using the fabric were British tentmakers Robert Saunders.

I don't know if the Akto is stronger or more durable than the Laser or Laser Competition as I've never used the former and haven't used the latter for enough nights to assess this. I do know that the Akto is very tough, having used one for many hundred nights without any sign of deterioration.

Martin, using a tent peg to hold back the inner of the Laser is a good idea. I must admit I would be wary about using a Caldera Cone as close to the flysheet and tent as it is in your first picture. I have had flames coming out a fair way from the upper vents of the Caldera Cone.

[Martin Rye]

Chris,
Thanks for the warning on the Caldera Cone and on cooking in a tent. I’m intrigued about the materials used and all in know is Terra Nova are tested to British standards, I don’t know about ISO standards and wonder what is the next big step forward in lowering tent weight in regards to outer fabric and inner? I must admit I was puzzled by the claim some people made that the Akto fabric was tougher as I have owned each make of tent and could not see how the fabrics differed.

The Akto was a solid bit of kit and like I said I had a lot of good times in the hills staying in one. I just like the laser as I’m tall and I need the space, the weight saved is a bonus.

Any one looking for a top one man tent is spoilt for choice these days and I forgot about Robert Saunders (good tents).

[David Ure]

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[Martin Rye]

David,
Good point and I must admit I made an unproven comparison on tear strength. I would expect the Laser flysheet to match the Akto in a test but don’t have the data to back it up. So I emailed Terra Nova asking them some questions. If I get the answers I will put them on this site. Be good to now the limitations on the fabric etc.

[Martin Rye]

To be honest I’m disappointed with Terra Nova not publishing the results of tear strength data. In response to a few questions I asked them like:

Q1.What would the Laser flysheet and ground sheet test on the Independent ISO-139 in testing its tear strength?
Q2. What is the Laser flysheet tear strength on the British standards test?
Q3. What would the hydrostatic head of on the ISO-811standed be?

They replied,
“Concerning the tear strengths of our fabrics. Although we test our fabrics extensively, in both the lab, and more importantly in actual environmental conditions, we tend not publish our results”

Poor answer in my view and leaves me with out a full comparison vs the Akto. Any way maybe some gear tester will get the info off a Terra Nova boffin at some trade show some time. Until then we can only wonder

[David Ure]

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[Diplomatic Mike]

TN are a well respected company. IMHO they wouldn't sell crap as their reputation would suffer. My Laserlite has been fine for years. Word of mouth means more to me than a spreadsheet.
Thanks for the 'heads-up' on the ID All e-Vent bivvy on PB David. :)

[Martin Rye]

I’ve no doubt there a great company Mike, to date I have owned a Voyager, Solar and now a Laser. All have been great and the Laser is fantastic. The Voyager lasted years and I’m planning to get the new Superlite. What is annoying to me is a lack of openness with the Data compared to say Hilleberg. I’ll recommend them to anyone and don’t forget many of their tents are still UK home made.

[David Ure]

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[Robert Taylor]

I own an akto, i have recently done a review of my feelings. Yes its a tent that makes you feel secure at a relatively light weight in all weathers. I do find it small and so dont use it as often as i should, the extra space on the Laser has interested me. I'm not about to fork out £100's without understanding a little more though. Everyone seems to agree the guying on the akto works best, why dont the guys that make the Laser agree and put them on that way to start with? Its extra £ to change it about afterall. Second silly question, I'm sure the laser was classed as 3 season whereas akto is classed as 4 or even above the tree line.. why? third and final silly question, why if the materials used are so similiar does the Laser fly soak up 0 amount of water whereas the akto feels much heavier implying it has?

[Kyle Rosenberger]

Terra Nova available at ProLite Gear

http://www.prolitegear.com/Terra%20Nova.htm

[Stuart Gregory]

We have started to use a trekking pole and a guyline (or spare lace!) to hold the door open on the Laserlite & Comp. The zip doesn't go quite as high on the Comp, so you don't get such good access, but it would probably work well on the Laser and perhaps the Akto.

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