Carbon fiber tent/tarp stakes

Carbon fiber is strong but brittle. Let us know how they work out in practice, but don't be surprised if they crack the first rock you hit, assuming they even survive getting pounded into the ground in the first place.

I've had Ruta Locura carbon fiber stakes for the last 500 miles of the PCT holding down the pull outs on my tarp. No breaks. I won't be surprised if they hold out for a long time, yet! Quite possibly I may die in my sleep, yet I don't bed down in a casket. Here is the place where I live: Be positive. Be mindful. Be kind. All is good. A little smile can spread inward. Take a spare tarp stake–it only weighs 6 gm.

Glad to hear that carbon fiber stakes hold up. Please let us know how your DIY ones work out.

"Please let us know how your DIY ones work out." I shall! ADDENDUM: When setting the rivet, I found that if I used the rivet tool to break off the pin, sometimes the pressure would fracture the tube. I suggest: use the rivet tool to secure the rivet, then use the hacksaw to cut off the pin.

Amazon has carbon arrow shafts. M.A.K® X6 Replaceable 30" 7.8mm Carbon Shaft Plastics Fletching W Aluminum Seat Arrows $17.99 + Free Shipping for half a dozen, Sold by LeHang

I can't think of any material we use that varies in quality so much as carbon fiber rods and tubes. Those in the business, such as Ruta Locura, have the know-how to source high quality. Many of the rest of us have to be very careful, and Cheryl is correct on that score.

Yeah, watch out for carbon tubing. The Arrow Shafts are a good idea. They are typically designed to resist impacts down the longitudinal direction. The splitting can be mitigated with a 1/4" wrap of fishing rod winding thread or plain old nylon upholstering thread. Use a 5 minute epoxy to coat them after you get a half dozen or so wrapped. I would also add some to the rivet as you add it, but I think you would need to use the long set epoxy for that.

I'd like to return this thread to the intended use of carbon fiber here. I've no intention of using these stakes as anchors to climb rock walls. :*) I'm no statistician and cannot speculate on the probability of one or two stakes failing. Nor do I have any instruments that can measure the lateral forces required to break these stakes. I'll just have to take them into the field and let'em loose! I know very little about carbon fiber arrow shafts, but I can observe that Ruta Locura's carbon stake shafts look identical to what I have, even if their shafts are structurally superior. Regardless, I'm having fun, and I would break into a big smile should one of these break in use! :*! Party on!

After another 430 miles of trail and 16 of 18 nights camped along the Oregon PCT, I didn't see sufficient wind to test the strength of the carbon shafts–I spent the windiest night in my hammock inside the cabin at the Big Lake Youth Camp near Santiam Pass. I did learn a few things about assembling these. 1. The sharp end needs to start with 1/4" aluminum rod which will not fit inside the arrow shaft without some filing first. It works well enough if press fit into the shaft, without any adhesive. One stake, with the end of a thinner aluminum tent stake epoxied into the shaft, ended with the sharp tip driven up into the shaft. 2. One rivet at the top of the stake came out with the stainless washer, when I tugged on it with the tie out line. I just used the stake anyway, pressing it into the ground at an angle that would keep the line from slipping off. I hadn't tested the rivet installation before leaving home. I've edited the original post to reflect my findings.

> I can't think of any material we use that varies in quality so much as carbon fiber > rods and tubes. AND HOW!!!! I bought a bunch of 'carbon fibre' arrows made by Carbon Express. They failed utterly. They were really CHEAP pultruded glass fibre, which splits when you look at it, with a dusting of carbon black over the outside. I was 'slightly upset', you might say. You need either fabric wrap or genuine 2D wrap for strength. But even so, if you hammer them into rocky soil, expect damage and breaks. Me, I go for Ti wires or, sometimes, long offcuts of Easton aluminium arrow shafting. Expect to pay over $40 for a dozen, or slightly more. Sorry, but $17 is a danger flag to me. That's pultruded fibreglass with a black paint cover, and never mind the advertising. The Victory brand (USA) should be OK. I note that they state 'Their no-glass carbon-fiber construction', which tells you something about the Chinese imports. Cheers

Real world experience counts. Thanks, Roger. In rocky places, my stakes will likely meet their Waterloo-but, I often just find big rocks to which I can attach tarp lines. The shafts I have are Gold Tip, Expedition Hunter. I don't recall the expense, but definitely much more than $17. The latest "innovation" for the top end of the stakes: drilling a 7/64" hole a quarter inch from the top and passing either a small zip tie or 6d galvanized nail through the hole. Quicker, less fussy than rivets. Also a gram lighter. Edit: Under 5.8 gm for a 9" stake, if you believe the scale (American Weigh Scale)

> The shafts I have are Gold Tip, Expedition Hunter. From memory, they should be OK. Cheers

My 8" carbon fiber stakes weigh ~5.5 gm each. Cost: $65 (Amazon's current price) for a dozen 32" Gold tip Expedition Hunter shafts, $6 (Home Depot) for 48" 1/4" aluminum rod, enough for 40+ stakes $5 (high estimate, bot mine when Columbus first sailed) for zip ties–enough for 48 stakes. ~$1.60 per stake and fun to make, knowing we're dropping ~10 gm per stake (standard 16 gm, 6" long aluminum stake).

So how did you make the points? On a lathe? I have done similar, but I used hard plastic (UHMWPE) instead of aluminium. That came out even lighter, as the plastic is about half the density. OK, OK, maybe there was 1 g difference per stake. :-) I also used the plastic to make cap-plugs for the top end. I made the top of the plugs significantly wider than the tube, so the damage to my hand was much less when I pushed it into the ground. But the use of cable ties there is neat. Some times I carry 4 off 7" to 8" tubes for the two ends of my tunnel tent, and Ti wires for all the other guys. The holding power really starts to climb once the stake gets above 5' in length. 8" is really robust. cheers

**So how did you make the points? On a lathe? ** I use a flat file secured to my Black/Decker Workmate. As is, I can listen to the radio or read a book/magazine/newpaper while filing the points. I'd get a grinding wheel for my drill if I thought I'd make another fifty any time soon. FWIW, I already have tools I've used once and forgotten about. :*) ** hard plastic (UHMWPE) instead of aluminium. That came out even lighter, as the plastic is about half the density. OK, OK, maybe there was 1 g difference per stake. :-) ** Great idea, using UHMW polyethylene. I'd be on the UHMW-PE wagon once I've used the remaining 30" of 1/4" aluminum rod. I use .5" for each stake, press-fitted into the end. **cap-plugs for the top end. I made the top of the plugs significantly wider than the tube, so the damage to my hand was much less when I pushed it into the ground. But the use of cable ties there is neat.** I like the zip ties: reduced bulk, but did I really have to drill holes for the zip ties? I've also used the top 1/2" of a galvanized finishing nail in the same holes as I'd passed the zip ties. Of a certainty, water would find its way into a "sealed" stake, so I just left the tops open to facilitate ejecting the water. I do need a glove or rock to buffer my palm from the top end of the stake when pushing into firmer ground. Hammock camping pushes my base up by some 20 oz. If I don't find large roots, rocks and branches for my shelter lines, I need really light stakes. Weight for those 16 gm stakes add up quickly.

Have you run in to any problems pulling your stakes out of the ground? Have you considered putting small loops of cord thru the holes instead of zip-ties?

>> $65 (Amazon's current price) for a dozen 32" Gold tip Expedition Hunter shafts, From what I'm seeing, they are $86 now but that link doesn't show up on camelcamelcamel.com (price tracking site) which makes me think they removed the old listing and created a new one rather than raise the price Do you still see them for around $65 somewhere?

Rene, Good questions. ***Have you run in to any problems pulling your stakes out of the ground? I pulled out a rivet on one stake. I've made the last batch with the zip ties after I got off trail but will have opportunity to test later this fall, I hope. +++Have you considered putting small loops of cord thru the holes instead of zip-ties? They never crossed my mind. Loops of cord may not have sufficient bulk to keep a tarp line from slipping off. A zip tie has just enough bulk to do that. I've used the top 1/2" of a galvanized nail as a loop holder on one tie–unbreakable in normal use and its weight only slightly exceeds a zip tie's.

Jordo You wrote: ####>> $65 (Amazon's current price) for a dozen 32" Gold tip Expedition Hunter shafts, ####Do you still see them for around $65 somewhere? camelcamelcamel.com?? I used the search field on amazon.com entering: gold tip expedition hunter shafts… …which led to this link for $65: http://www.amazon.com/Gold-Tip-Expedition-Hunter-Shafts/dp/B0097VRX5S/ref=sr_1_1?ie=UTF8&qid=1445665646&sr=8-1&keywords=gold+tip+expedition+hunter+shafts Maybe they change the price when they know YOU're shopping. :*)

Re. shaft sources: Google Shopping turns up: 6 / $33: http://www.colgardsports.com/product/gold-tip-expedition-hunter-arrow-shafts-13463.htm?variations=72627 1 / $5: http://www.eaglearchery.com/Gold-Tip-Expedition-Hunter-Shafts/?gclid=CIiw5r_w28gCFVKDfgodjGMPXQ Re. cord loops on the end of the stake: Keep a small loop tied on the end of your guy line. Thread the guy line through the loop on the stake. Then put the stake through the loop on the guy line. Pull it taut and you've got the 2 loops tied in a lark's head knot. But upon further thought, the zip ties might be adequate to pull straight out against if you use a constricting knot like a larks's head around the shaft.

"Keep a small loop tied on the end of your guy line. " Rene, You're way ahead of me. Of course, I need to put line-locs or clam cleats on the tarp end of my lines to begin catching up w/you. I may try loops for new stakes even before I run out of zip ties. :*)

I had pretty much exactly the same thoughts as James on doing a wrap around the top. Regardless of the rivet splitting issues it could help with, the top of the peg sits out of the ground and takes more strain. EDIT: realised that you've come up with an alternate solution with the zip ties anyway. Much less work! Most soils for me I struggle to get more than 4-5 inches in the ground, so a 5 or 5.5 inch stake is pretty much plenty. Any estimates on weight for that length? Great innovation :-)

I like the Sky Shark P4x wrapped spar shown here for $3.50 each: here They have other wrapped options also.

https://www.goldtip.com/productdetail.aspx?ptid=5 (There are 15.5 grains per gram.) Gold Tip Expedition Hunter shaft weight ranges from .48 – .66 grams per inch, pending specific product. 2.5" weighs 1.2g – 1.65g, which gives you about a 4g stake. Don't let them float away…