Adjustable backpack and other camping with a baby and toddler questions

I don’t know if you have read this article or if it has any useful information for you, but just in case Backpacking: Baby on Board

I don’t have children but here is some General info for you to look at on lowering weight.
Mike Clelland(NOLs instructor and author, his books are very good),he has some great free videos on lightening up be sure to watch(his clothing system,the entire contents of his pack,water treatment and part 1 and 2 on the dinky stuff for ideas),this is an article he wrote The fastest way to backpack weight loss ,this is pmags Lightweight Backpacking 101 and The Frugal Backpacker – The $300 Gear Challenge .These are some other articles and videos for you to check out

Backpacking for Cheap: Gear for the Gearless

Backpacking Checklist (Gear List): 3-Season, 3-Day

Lightweight Backpacking 101: An Introductory Manual for Lightening Your Load Today (1st Edition – August 2001)

Cheap Ultralight Gear List

Oregon Field Guide: Ultralight Hiking

Lightweight Testimony: Lighter, Farther, Faster
Jamie Shortt talks about his progression and shows his gear list for each stage, Lightweight Testimony: My Journey into Lightweight Backpacking
CleverHiker Light weight Basics
CleverHiker Trail Skills

Andrew Skurka has a very good website with trips and gear lists for you to check out, here is a talk he gave at google
Ultimate Hiking Gear & Skills Clinic
His book is worth checking out also
The Ultimate Hiker’s Gear Guide: Tools & Techniques to Hit the Trail
You can get little repackaging containers(like the ones you see in Mike Clelland uses in his videos) many places including your local stores and pharmacy but here are some examples
USPLASTICS
USPLASTICS
Ultralight Designs
GossamerGear
MountainLaurelDesigns
You could make toothpaste dots like Mike C. shows or there are Archtek Toothpaste Tablets so only bring exactly what you need in a snack size bag for any given trip instead of a whole tube and THESE are good for little thing like pills, toothpaste tablets ect. so you are not packing a whole bottle(you can also get them very cheap at most pharmacies) .

I've been backpacking with my son (now 6) for the past couple of years. I just bought a new pack, which needed to be able to carry fairly large loads. After trying on a bunch of large capacity packs, I settled on the Deuter ACT Light 75.10. I bought it primarily because it just fits me better than the comparable Gregory and Osprey packs I tried on, but it has the added benefit of being relatively lightweight and inexpensive. Plus, of course, it is adjustable for torso length. Might be a good option for y'all. I have not had the opportunity to try it out on the trail yet, but I think it is going to be a great pack for family outings.

Osprey has a few packs with adjustable torso lengths. The Volt, for example, has maybe 6 inches of range at most. That might be enough for you both. If you're willing to spend more, the Paradox Unaweep is both lighter than the Volt and carries much, much better. It would almost certainly fit you both (provided your wife's torso length is not unusually short). In either case, check to make sure you'd both be able to use the same belt size.

No help here on carrying two kids, though I'd be interested in answers.

As far as a pack that will adjust to fit two different torso ranges, I was also going to mention the Deuter ACT LIte 75+10. It has a lot of room and an easy to adjust torso fit with a range of 15-21 inch torsos. What that means is that the pack will likely fit dad better than mom, but at least mom can wear the thing and maybe get some of the pack weight on your hips. The pack itself is also on the lighter end for things in that volume range.

We also backpacked with our kids when they were young, but not as young as yours. What kind of distances are you trying to go? It sounds like your gear is really quite dialed in, aside from the heavy pack. Maybe you hike shorter distances for awhile so that one parent can make a return trip to a vehicle for more gear if you can't haul it all in in one trip. Or maybe consider hiking with goats or llamas to carry some gear and you carry the kids?

Your gear seems pretty well thought out, and good on you for getting out with your family!

My wife and I have been hiking with our kids since they were a few months old. What we found to work best is to carry only what you need :-) We used short hikes with over nights to see what could be cut out of our kit, leaving the items in car only a few hours hike away if needed. So far, the only item I had to retrieve from the car is a tarp. Also, hiking to back country huts is a great way to reduce weight.

For gear we only spend money on gear which will be used for years. For kids cloths, carriers, etc we are always looking in second stores for good buys.

I will also recommend getting a Paradox Unaweep. I got one last year and it carries those big family loads with ease, yet still functions carrying small loads when its just us parents hiking. Dealing with tried kids is so much easier then your shoulders are pain free :-)

I'm a big advocate of *woven* wraps (not the knit jersey kind). They are the flat tarps of the baby carrying world — incredibly versatile, lots of different possibilities for how to carry/wrap them. Important detail for using as a front carry in combination w/a pack or a framed baby carrier is noninterference with those straps. You can spread the fabric over you shoulder so it doesn't bunch and lies relatively flat.

I should qualify this and say I never took babes backpacking. But I have done double-kid carries for active, outdoorsy things like apple picking. (Beco on the back, wrap in front)

There are tons of different choices of woven wraps, my personal favorite is the Vatanti strips series (Marayuma, Kipawa, and Tibet). Get a 5 meter one (aka "size 7" in some wrap-speak). They are the lightest, most breathable ones out there. I don't know if they're still made, but you might be able to find one used on thebabywearer.com.

Pack mule of a family of 6 here. :)

1. Take only what is essential.

2. Make sure the essentials are comfortable.

After that, cutting weight isn't very relevant compared to the short distances and required heavier weights.

I *almost* got a Unaweep, and I hope to get one in the future… but the advantage to the Deuter for your situation is that the torso length can be adjusted fully in under 60 seconds, which means that, if you wanted to, you could swap out with your wife at every break!

Not that I’m the guru of lightweight (far from it), but I went back and forth with a backpack baby carrier and finally abandoned the idea.

Yes, it gets the weight on your hips, but those danged baby backpacks are freaking heavy. Most of them weigh around 7 pounds empty. My Ergo Baby Sport is just over 1 lbs.

The other thing for me is that the baby backpacks have very little space for gear storage. With the Ergo Baby, I can just wear whatever backpack I like, small for summer, or big for winter:

I realize that you don’t have the gear space constraints because you have two adults along (my wife does NOT backpack!), baby carrier backpacks really are heavy.

The big “secret” technique I’ve worked out is sort of a 15/15 arrangement. If I carry my five year old (approaching 40 lbs now) for a long time, I just get exhausted, and I mean exhausted. What works for me is to carry her for 15 minutes, then have her walk for 15 minutes, then I carry her for 15 minutes. With that, I can stay a lot fresher, and she gets a lot of rest and can walk too. That said, I wouldn’t plan on doing more mileage than you otherwise would. Rather, this is a technique for when a child is unusually tired. Works for me anyway.

If it’s any help, I put my gear list up on my ever-so-exciting blog from my most recent hike with my daughter:
Backpacking with Children – A Gear List for Two

I’ve also got some subsequent posts showing how I’m progressively lightening my load.

HJ
Adventures In Stoving
Hikin’ Jim’s Blog

We bought the Deuter for my son when he was turning 14 for extended backpacking trips. he loved it from day one.

More important, on one trip up to the Sierra, he had a somewhat severe case of AMS and we had to hike out in a hurry.

I packed all of his gear and mine in his Deuter (Act Lite 65 + 10). With a quick torso adjustment the pack felt great. He carried my almost empty pack. We walked out with 50+ lbs on my back. Amazingly it rode like a dream and I barely felt any weight on my shoulders. We hiked 12+ miles over Cottonwood Pass out to our cars and drove downhill when he started to immediately feel better.

… I thought I replied to this, but it looks like my post got lost in the ether….

1) Don't know, but get something that can carry loads comfortably… try it on before you buy (or get something with a good return policy)

2) Your gear doesn't look too bad. Maybe a quilt would shave some weight… otherwise scrutinize your clothing or other items you are bringing

3) I am a fan of the frame carriers. I could go a lot farther with them than the soft carriers even though they weigh more. They are a lot more comfortable because they a) transfer weight to your hips and b) they get your bodies apart so they are much cooler. If you live in So. Cal. I've got two used ones (that I don't use anymore) that I will let you have for cheap.

Well, I only have one kid (plus a dog) so I'll never be as bad*ss as you guys, but I think you're on the right track.

What kind of kid carrier is really a YMMV issue. I have an Osprey and never use it anymore. The waistbelt manages to bruise both my hips and my ribs, because I apparently have a small torso. Even my partner, who's 5'11" does not find it comfortable. We now exclusively use wraps and soft structured carriers (like the ergo), depending on the type of trip. It's what we use at home anyway. (Although LO loooves the Osprey–I keep it hidden in a closet but if he sees it he begs to go up.) I think if you're needing to tandem the two kids it makes a lot more sense to bring two soft carriers; put the 1 year old in the more supportive one, and keep the lighter nylon one as back up when you need to carry the 3 year old at the same time.

If you think the frame carrier is more comfortable, then switch back, but maybe see if there's a babywearing group near you and go to a meet-up, troubleshoot the Ergo, try on some different carriers, etc. I wouldn't give up on frameless just because the Ergo isn't working for you. There's a lot more options for soft kid carriers. Like Katharina said, woven wraps are fantastic, supportive, breathable carriers that fit anyone and are very comfortable if you're willing to put in some practice time. (And yes, Vatanais are still available. Granola Babies is the only US retailer I know of, but you can find used ones too.)

At first, my partner and I talked about having a system where we could easily trade off who carries what, but ultimately dialling in a system that was *comfortable* ended up being more important to us. My partner is carrying a SMD Fusion 65. It's a little funky in terms of some of its features, but overall it fits him well and is comfortable with heavy loads. And the harness is adjustable, so it might work for you guys.

Before the SMD, he tried an Osprey for a few months (I forget the model name, but ~65L) and found it underwhelming, not very comfortable. If we'd been trying to find a pack that worked for me too, well, we'd still be looking! (Since he's not totally sold on the Fusion's design, we may have a ULA Catalyst and/or an Elemental Horizons Aquilo OTW soon…)

Thanks to everyone for all the suggestions. We tried the wraps when our older son was small, and found them all too hot. But, we didn't try any of the really breathable ones. Maybe it's worth trying that again. We'll keep looking for carriers.

We've gotten some driducks for us to reduce the weight of our raingear and are still cutting elsewhere.

As for packs – what do people think about the Exped lightning 60? I'm not sure it will be big enough, but it looks like quite an interesting pack. The six moon designs fusion 65 looks similar in some ways. We're looking to try the dueter and osprey packs soon. The unaweep pack looks amazing.

One more question: Any suggestions on food. Our biggest constraint is that the 1 year old has to be able to feed it to himself. We did ramen+protein+veggies this last trip, and it was a huge mess. Lunch is easy (pb&j, cheese and crackers, etc.). We're planning to bring a small tablecloth for him, which will help with giving him several tries to get it down. However, it seems that most easily heated food is in small chunks, which is hard.

We've had good luck with instant mashed potatoes–easy to mix veggies and proteins in, and easy to spoon for those still figuring out silverware. My LO also likes the dehydrated refried beans and split peas from Fantastic Foods; they mix nicely with instant mashed and give a little variety.

Yogurt is another good one: Nido milk powder + yogurt starter + water; mix in a ziploc and let it sit in your pack and do its thing.

Honestly I think anything a one-year-old eats is going to be messy! What's even worse is when they decide to get picky and won't eat anything you've packed. When all else fails, I can usually get my guy to eat cheese and wraps. He thinks cheese is a food group.

When it's warm enough, I let my guy eat without a shirt on–much easier to wipe his skin down than wash/dry the shirt.