The curious case of Scout vs. Duplex

Considered buying it a couple years ago when it was released. Initial reviews here at BPL were less than favorable. Haven't seen a long term review so hope you stick it out to give the down and dirty.

The end entry disqualifies the Scout for me, even before the vestibule and screen considerations (which are biggies, too).

I actually love the front entry because it totally reminds me of my parents 70s tents.

"I actually love the front entry because it totally reminds me of my parents 70s tents."

They probably weren't 6'5", I bet (turning around in a tent is not something I do easily). It does have that retro look, though.

"As a photographer, my photos started looking wilted and people and friends looked at them a lot less. Thus, I decided to switch to the second best thing, silnylon."

Silliest thing I've read today.

If you need a certain tent to make a good photograph, you're doing it wrong. How does a photo look "wilted" based on what material the tent in it is made of? In one of the recent duplex threads there are some objectively good pictures. If you need inspiration, look up Chris Burkhard. He has some ridiculously good photos of cheap REI tents and heavy backpacking gear. Here are some 'good' pictures of silnylon and cuben shelters:

That being said, it's surprising that the Scout 2 is only a few oz heavier than the duplex for a similar amount of livable space.

"That being said, it's surprising that the Scout 2 is only a few oz heavier than the duplex for a similar amount of livable space."

Yeah, well…"Them's fightin' words" on this site…ha, ha…

But, I have found similar. I use a Heximid Solo (cuben) at about 18oz including guylines and stakes. I use my solo tarp (silnylon)at 18oz (including guylines and stakes.) The tarp has more coverage and more versatility for all except bug season.

Theoreticallllly, a dome has the most internal volume(space) for the least amount of surface (weight.) But, you waste a lot with odd shaped edges. And you waste a lot of extra weight supporting a curved area. Domes just don't work well.

The pup-tent style is near the other end of the spectrum. It takes more fabric to cover the floor space, but all the floor space is usable. Holding it up is easily accomplished with a couple poles, giving you low structure weights with excellent water resistance. (Water resistance is something all domes and tunnel tents suffer from…that horizontal or near horizontal expanse of fabric on top.)

The single pole designs of the Hexamid Solo, for example, leaves a large open doorway to the weather. This requires a largish beak to keep things weather tight (it starts to look like an actual pyramid.) The two pole design of the Scout (pup-tent) leaves a much smaller doorway. Easy to close up for weather resistance. There is no turning around IN the tent, though. You only need to crawl in, sit up and zip up the doors, and lay down again. No need to flip end for end, kneeing you partner in the face…

Anyway, silnylon and cuben can come close in weights depending on the design. If you need 10sqyd of fabric, that is only 13oz in sil. An equivalent in cuben would weigh about 7.1oz. But you still need guylines and stakes. I need 8 for the Solo, but only 6 for the sil tarp. guy lines are about equivalent bringing the total to 15.5oz for the sil and 9.0 for the cuben. But, the cuben packs larger, about 2liters as opposed to 1liter for sil. Cuben has poor abrasion resistance, so you need another half ounce for a bag. The extra volume also means carrying a larger, heavier pack, too. Adding in about 1oz for the extra liter, when all is said and done, they are within about 5oz for a complete tent. Not even the weight of one meal (maybe a light breakfast.)

In another thread, somebody looking for a pack meeting certain criteria found one that ticked all the boxes — volume, comfort, load-carrying capacity, ventilation, price, etc — but ruled it out because it was "ugly".

I do not understand this kind of thinking.

When looking for my first UL tent I also considered the Scout. As noted, the lack of a mesh door and vestibule were negatives, but also the need for 12 stakes to pitch it.

Having recently ridden out the first really serious thunderstorms I've experienced yet with the Duplex, I wonder if the Scout would have done as well with the vertical sides and ends.

I actually love the look of my green cuben duomid in photos:

"my photos started looking wilted"

This is the reason I stopped eating spinach. I'd put some in a saute pan, and suddenly it looked all wilted. A shame, really, because I really like spinach.

>>I actually love the look of my green cuben duomid in photos:

HELLZYEAH!

Cuben always looks like plastic wrap to me. Kind of feels like it too.

Silnylon perfectly taught looks amazing.

Thank you, family guy!! My point exactly.

I recently posted about the colors of cuben because yes, style matters to me. To pretend that people do not value style is naive. However, especially in the world of backpacking light, a high functioning product is at least as valuable, if not more. Design people value aesthetics. No surprise there either. When things hit on all cylinders, we have a true winner.

I grew up reading the Ray Jardine PCT book as a twenty year old thru-hiking the AT. Honestly, I haven't touched the book in close to twenty years now but the values he espoused didn't place emphasis on gear's beauty but rather their weight and functionality.

I will say that from a photographer's standpoint, a beautifully designed tent will "blend in" with nature so much better than a poor design. Professional photographers earn their living from capturing striking/beautiful images. It's only fair to honor and respect these values irregardless of our own.

I spend a fair amount of time on Instagram and I've seen some pretty remarkable photos of cuben shelters but I have a preference for silnylon aesthetics. I don't have to carry this preference on my back so it's easy to reconcile. At the end of the day it boils down to, again, hike your own hike.

Edit: to stay more on topic, the Scout has been fairly beaten up by reviews where the Duplex is heralded as a wonderfully light and well designed shelter. I don't put a lot of heed into reviews except that consensus amounts to a lot. No one really seems to care about the Duplex look as it weighs a hair over a pound, which may be described as revolutionary.

I'm glad people care about colors. It's not vain. I think it has more to do with comfort and blending into nature. If you don't think colors matter, look at MLD. Ron's creamy yellow silnylon is now on a thirteen month wait. Jotaro of Locus Gear also said yellow is very popular.

I hope as cuben becomes a bit more mainstream it results in more colors and wider choices in fabric texture. Warm yellows, deep forest greens, ochres and soft brown tones of 0.5 and 0.74 cuben would be very welcome and pleasant to live in. Matte finishes as well. I have no idea why they are not around already.

I'm an owner of a design studio in Boston and fully subscribe to form is function motto. However, a truly well designed product is also pleasant to look at AND it makes you feel good. Both of these are quite subjective, of course. As an example, I would suspect many of you have fond memories of 70s A-frame tents. Kids draw them when they learn to draw. There is a comforting, good vibe about them and I believe that same vibe translates into photography and experience. Visual comfort is not silly, and it's not super important, but like all things design, it's better if it's there.

It seems that the original premise has shifted from cuben = 'wilted' to colors = good,and I'd agree with the latter. It is 100% subjective, but many prefer the look of cuben to silnylon or polyesther. I think it has to do with appreciating the qualities of a material vs pure aesthetic value. If you consider high end exotic cars, many of them feature bare, unpainted carbon fiber accents or entire body panels, not just because it looks 'good', but because people see it and think, "wow, that's carbon fiber – expensive, super light, and rare." I think it's the same with cuben fiber – it's more attractive if you're looking for it.

I have to disagree with the notion that making a tent "blend in" in a photograph makes it better. The first photo I posted in this thread, of the Nemo tent, all BUT blends in, yet that photo is hugely popular and described as "amazing" and "beautiful". I don't think you ever want [part of] the subject of a photo to blend in to it, unless that's a specific sub genre or technique you're going for.

Agreed on cuben standing for something new and thus, the appreciation. Nice example on supercars. The "super" qualities of cuben are exposed with its look. Personally, I don't like that look in the bright sunlight. It looks like a solar battery garbage bag frankenstein. However, I like how cuben looks in the sunset or sunrise, with its transparency highlighted against the skies. Due to the transparency, around those times it takes on the color of the environment. I think that's the best time to photograph landscapes with cuben tents. Also happens to be a great time to photograph in general.

What I meant about blending is not dissapearing. Quite the opposite. meant working with the environment. Think frank Lloyd Wright's Falling Water home. It's striking, but totally blends in. All those tents are pictured with light coming through it. I modified my LED to a warmer Cree lamp so that gray cuben would look a tad warmer when lit from the inside. It works to an extent, but really shines on the silnylon orange/ochre Scout.

>"lack of a mesh door and vestibule"

The Scout Plus UL2 has a small vestibule and mesh on the door, but looks more like a Flycreek and so loses that 70s A-frame aesthetic (also not really any lighter than the Flycreek). That said, a big reason I went for the Duplex, was that the Flycreek vestibule was almost pointless when in actual rain. You can't fit much gear in it and still get in and out of the tent easily. Needed something more functional when with the wife and in rain, it being much lighter was just a fantastic bonus. The regular Scout having no vestibule, makes it not really an option I'd consider very long.