Any reason to repack medications?

The only reason to repackage stuff would be when it can save weight. A large tube of something packaged into a 10 day supply would save a lot, for example. Benadryl I do not. I just leave them on the card (or in clipped individual packages.)

But, I usually take daily meds for diabetes, etc. So, these are just dropped into the tiny craft baggies by the day. Generally, a vitamin goes in there too. These are all dropped in a larger baggie that also contains the benydryl, imodium, tums, etc… I may or may not want them on any one day. I think two 12 hour benydryl is all I take for a week out. 5 tums, 2 imodium, and so on. Basically one good dose. If I get sick in the woods, I need to get out. No harm done bailing early and a lot safer.

I agree, re-pack to save weight. How many you take is also a consideration of weight, take what you reasonably think you would need, and I stress "need." For example, will you need enough antihistamine to take a couple every day for a stuffy nose or only enough in case you have an allergic reaction to a bug bite?

Most advice on re-packing meds is to suggest not taking the entire pill bottle, which many people do. But most ULers remove any packaging. Realistically, will carrying 5 pills loose in a tiny zip bag save any measurable weight over carrying them in their blister pack? Not really, but sometimes it's about the UL philosophy — for example, I re-pack all of my meds loose into a tiny zip bag, and I don't expect that by itself to make a meaningful difference on the scale, but by being diligent I have found 100 other places in my kit where I also can cut an immeasurable amount of weight that all adds up to something measurable, true weight savings.

Antibiotic ointment I found a small half-ounce tube in a drugstore. Or, you could start with a bigger tube and squeeze out all but the amount you would need for the trip. Some people squirt what they'll need into cut segments of drinking straws and then melt the ends to have single-use applications.

One other tip: if you re-pack meds you can forget which pill is which, to alleviate that I make a list of each medication, what it looks like, dosage, and expiration date and then take a photo of that information. That way, if I need it I can look it up on my camera without the extra weight of a list on a piece of paper.

I agree with the others — blister packs are lightweight, no need to repack. It's also the best way to protect the meds, especially in humid environments.

The only modification I make to blister packs is to trim the sharp corners with scissors, rounding them — that way they don't poke through or snag anything.

HERE is the antibiotic ointment that I carry, no reason to repackage. I just use a small bags like THESE ,many places including my local stores and pharmacy carry them. I put several types of pills into 1 small bag and have a little slip of paper that tells what each pill is and the instructions on dosages.

the big box pharmacies for the most part don't do it (they may be able to order it that way), but my local pharmacist will repack a daily medication dosage into single serving blister packs. if there's medication that you have to take, make sure to always pack a couple of days extra in case you get *stuck.* also, having perscription information written down can be very helpful if you end up in an emergency room/not your doctor's medical office.

I have an injured knee and also have allergies, including seasonal and a food allergy to whoknowswhat (and my allergy doc can't figure out either), so my needs may be different than yours.

If you have an option to use blister packs, I'd just go with that. Any weight savings going with a ziplock would be negligible and I suspect the pills will hold up better in the blister pack. I carry most of my pills in small med sized ziplock bags as I didn't find any of them in blister packs when I was shopping. It really hasn't been a problem for me, but it's not my preference.

fever & pain relief (Ibuprofen 600mg)
I take enough so I have on hand 2400mg per day of regular Advil and another 400mg per day of Advil PM (which includes 38mg Diphenhydramine per pill/I take two). I can't find either of them in blister packs so I put them in a small med sized ziplock bag.

soporific (bratizolam 0.25mg) I don't take this but do take Advil PM as noted above. Since Advil PM has Diphenhydramine, and I have allergies, this knocks out two birds with one stone for me. Consult your Dr. on this one. If you decide to take Diphenhydramine as a soporific, I'd stick with one of the PM versions. There are non drowzy versions out there which will have you staring at the underside of your tarp, randomly cursing the universe, and playing the "If I fell asleep right now I'd get X hours of sleep" game. Guess how I know this.

antibiotic ointment (mupirocin 2%)
I take a ~ 2.5" slurpee straw which has been heat sealed on both ends full of triple antibiotic ointment. I think someone somewhere mentioned there are better options than triple antibiotic ointment but I haven't researched it any. I never use it so this is enough for me.

antihistamine (loratadine 10mg)
The Advil PM does a decent job of keeping my allergies within tolerable limits, but I do bring extra in case I break out in hives unexpectedly. I've tried all the allergy medicines and Diphenhydramine is the only one I'll currently take, as the other ones make me feel too foggy. Since I'm only taking it PRN, I bring about a dozen but have never taken anything more than Advil PM backpacking. Also, I prefer brand name Benadryl.

diarrhea treatment (loperamide 2mg)
I take about a dozen and never had a reason to use them. If I get hit with something where a dozen anti diarrhea pills won't fix it, I'm leaving the trail. I crapped my pants enough for Uncle Sam, I figured that was enough, and I'm not crapping my pants while on R&R.

I typically repackage ointments into stirring straws. Drinking straws are too large, whereas stirring straws are better for one shot applications. For me it's really about saving a little here and there as it eventually adds up. The straws in the photos below are about 2" long.

I think that, technically, it's illegal to be carrying prescription drugs in other than the prescription bottle, at least for things like opiates (which I think one should have, in the event of serious injury). I don't worry about this, and don't think you should either, but you might want to be aware (these days, you never know …).

I'm not aware of any laws that prohibit the possession of prescription drugs, that were prescribed to you, carried outside their pharmacy-issued container. I know lots of physicians and a few pharmacists and none of ever raised any concern over this common practice. Consider how many people use a S-M-T-W-T-F-S container to lay out the week's dosages. But please post any CFRs or state statutes to contrary.

Now, SELLING them? Or in any way distributing them to people without a valid prescription / license to practice medicine? Sure, lots of laws against that.

For a road trip or backpacking trip wholly in the USA, I wouldn't worry about any of that. I only preserve/create enough labeling so I can remember what is what.

When crossing international borders, I leave prescription drugs in their original packaging. I have sometimes requested the smallest possible pill bottles from the pharmacy and they are happy to comply. OTC (over the counter) drugs, I still leave in a small vial, all mixed together. I can quickly prove what they are by just googling, for instance, "I-2 brown round pill finder" and ibuprofen, generic Advil, 200 mg, will pop right up.

Opiates. Well. I differ a bit on that. So does my wife, the MD. There are risks of opiates (depressed breathing, recreational use, theft for recreational use, theft for resale, legal issues if not the patient on the prescription) and not a lot of cases where you truly need opiates versus Advil and/or Tylenol (NSAIDs). People tend to discount the effectiveness of OTC NSAIDs because they are so easy to get and inflate the usefulness of opiates because they are hard to get. The only time we've had opiates along was on a 16-day GCNP raft trip (easy to think of trauma and dislocation scenarios without easy evac) AND we had two MDs along, so understanding its proper use and contraindications was guaranteed. I, personally, wouldn't bring opiates across an international border unless I was the one (say a patient with advanced cancer) who actively needed them.

I encounter similar thinking about sutures – sure, I sewed my Boy Scout first aid badge onto my uniform, but the advice I get from docs is to wash a wound well, let it bleed to flush foreign matter (if major blood loss isn't an issue), dress the wound with the cleanest material you have, and evacuate them for proper care. Tetanus and other anaerobic bacteria are more of a risk if you close up a wound that isn't perfectly clean.

Regarding topical antibiotic ointments: Ask your physician, especially a dermatologist, if they have any professional samples you could have. They are tiny, but labeled. I have several and I refill them from time to time.

The biggest benefit of antibiotic ointments often is not killing bacteria but simply keeping the wound moist, much as vaseline would. If the edges of the wound dry out, there is much slower healing and more of a scar. I successfully reattached a piece of my fingertip* in January on a NZ backpacking trip (no sutures, just bandaging) and it healed up fine (except I unknowingly flipped that chunk end for end and changed my fingerprint in the process.

*Victorinox "Little Vicky" Utility Knives are SHARP. Don't get distracted while preparing dinner and chatting up the locals.

>> But please post any CFRs or state statutes to contrary.

These people:

http://community.lawyers.com/forums/t/104451.aspx

… seem to think I'm right, but who knows if they're really lawyers, or just folks spouting off like I did above :-) Anyhow, I'd only maybe worry about it for international travel.

>> Opiates. Well. I differ a bit on that. So does my wife, the MD.

I guess my primary-care doc disagrees with your wife, because he readily gave me a scrip for Percocet when I explained the situation; he backpacks too (with Scouts). I'm pretty clear on the dosing, and theft is the last thing I'm worried about.

Ouch, but nice repair and recovery. Wasn't Superglue initially developed as a suture replacement?

Regarding: "except I unknowingly flipped that chunk end for end and changed my fingerprint in the process"

Shall we now refer to you as Thomas David to comport with your flipped fingerprint?

"These people:

http://community.lawyers.com/forums/t/104451.aspx

… seem to think I'm right, "

I've read the 4 posts on that thread from lawyers. Three of which say it is not illegal to carry Rx meds in alternate containers and fourth discusses how producing the actual prescription would clear up any charges. I've skimmed the posts claiming it was illegal and they were all by consumers.

Docs do disagree with each other, for sure. There are physicians in my town that hand out opiates very readily in cases where others wouldn't or only under a pain contract with a plan to wean them off. My concern is not so much with the conscientious Scout leader trying to be uber-prepared (both in supplies AND knowledge) and it sounds like that is what you're doing. My concerns are (1) that some people think having the pills (like any gear) will help more than hurt in absence of significant training and knowledge and (2) "anything can happen" cuts both ways – sure a kid could dislocate a shoulder and something to ease pain and relax the muscles would be very helpful. But here's another "anything could happen" – teenage boys do risky things, perhaps on a dare. In 200 nights of camping with Scouts, I never saw an injury that required opiates. I did however, see some pretty stupid behavior and it later dawned on me that some may have started their drug habits as early teens.

If I carried drugs that had potential to be abused, I'd only tell other leaders who had the knowledge and temperament to use them cautiously. That would be a pretty small number, like 2 or 1 or zero other people. If the Scouts know, I would wonder why – what purpose does that serve, other than for the leader to brag about it? Certainly a Scout shouldn't be making the call to give opiates to another Scout.

And while we disagree on the legality of carrying Rx drugs outside of their original containers, we both agree only licensed medical professionals can legally prescribe / administer prescription drugs, right? So who are you going to give the Percocets to? Yourself – that's legal – you have a prescription for them in your name. But to another adult or to a minor child?!? Is that without prior parental permission? Or have the parents signed something saying, "The Scoutmaster, a knowledgable first-aider but non-MD, may give my child prescription drugs if, in his opinion, they would be helpful." Try running that permission slip (or anything like it) past your BSA council.

Edited to add: my own practice (and advice to FA students) has been to carry only OTC meds that I am throughly familiar with when adventuring with strangers (say, adults on a paid ski-touring trip) and basically offer them the choice, like I'm the shelves of a convenience store. "I have these non-prescription pain killers that I would take in your situation to ease the pain. Would you like the standard dose?" Among a group of adult friends who I know well, I can imagine offering an Rx drug, but man! there are a lot of contraindications to memorize (otherwise, it would be OTC).

I do see a loop hole that is getting bigger all the time – telecommunications. If you could reach the child's physician (or any helpful physician), explain the situation and they recommended a particular drug, you'd be on pretty solid ground (give or take state statues about practicing pharmacology without a license). I assume your existing permission slips covers getting medical care without further parental permission.

Yeah, good luck getting BSA to approve non-physicians prescribing. FWIW, the procedure our council summer camp follows for prescription meds:

1) Parent must sign special permission slip listing med, dosage, who is authorized to administer, prescribing physician
2) Meds must come to camp in their original container
3) Administered by camp doc (MD) or "under his supervision" (this tends to be pretty hands-off supervision)

We had some extensive discussion of this in a WFA class last year. The physician there suggested that in very limited circumstances leaders might practice "rock medicine" if an emergency struck far from help – the most obvious case being bee sting followed by shock in a boy who hadn't known he was severely allergic, when another boy happened to have an Epi-pen along. "I can't tell you to do anything with it, but there is an Epi-pen on that rock over there, and if you don't stab yourself in the leg with it, you might well die."

Most legal issues go back to personal freedoms. Whatever you decide is good for you is acceptable under law. That is, of course, you can *get* a supply of opiates, or other prescription drugs. Repackaging into another container does not ever violate that. Your pack is your personal space and cannot be searched without your permission. Just like in your house. We live daily, all of us, doing illegal things.

State to state, the laws differ according to who can legally posses and use marijuana, for example. (Forget about internationally. No one can agree.) Vicodin, percocet, etc are all good pain killers, but if you ever need something like that, you really need to leave the trail and/or seek professional help. If asked about anything you should be carrying, produce it, the ranger has no business searching for himself. You'll know what you are carrying, be it a bear cannister, stove, or drugs. Of course, you should always have a prescription for any regulated drug, even if it is at home.

Do you always carry a valid hunting license while hiking? Whatever for? If you are not driving do you need a driving license? Of course not. Who would bother to ever check? Do you need a marriage license at a motel?? You really are a bit sick if you carry it around with you, ha, ha… You should have ID of course, but is it on your person when you take a shower? What if someone swipes it? C'mon…there has to be a certain reasonablity to all laws. If you hike with meds, you do not need anything except a small baggie, or straw to keep them. Asking for your prescription is going one step too far since he should never be aware of them, they are personal. Who cares about a little salve on a cut? Confiscating them could be dangerous to your health.

Dispensing to anyone else, or prescribing, is probably illegal unless you are trained. You may not suggest, you cannot offer to share from your supply, you cannot say for what use or other information about some drug. You can always set the package down, explain what it is, and let the user take it himself. Even this has some grey area. Who cares about an asperin or an advil?

Skip it…I get all fired up about that stuff.

Controlled medications not in their original container and you not with the prescription at hand can get you arrested.

Tell me, how would they know it was there without doing an illegal search? It doesn't even make sense from the git'go.

Chances are if an officer really wanted to search your bag that badly, they'd find some justification to, and if they were really after you that badly, they'd find any reason, such as medication outside of its original packaging, to nail you for. That said, how many people have actually seen a police offer, and then given him provocation to speak to you, while out on the trail? If this is really that much of a concern for you, some pharmacies will do custom packaging.

Personally, I get a bunch of those tiny pill bags (CVS sells them for a few dollars) and put each kind of pill in its own baggie, writing what it is on the exterior.

Wow, I sure did start something here …

Not sure how this degenerated into a discussion about giving drugs to Scouts and other children (maybe I mentioned my doctor is a Scout leader), but it is not an issue for me. I have not thought about these issues, because I don't ever hike with kids (this is confirming why I'd rather not do that) only hike with one other person, ever, and that is my girlfriend and one other close friend. Yeah, I'd give them a Percocet, or two, if they broke their arm. So sue me – but I try not to associate with the kind of douche-bag who would do that.

David, I'm bemused by your comment "The only time we've had opiates along was on a 16-day GCNP raft trip (easy to think of trauma and dislocation scenarios without easy evac) ". Because that's one situation where I'd think they'd be less needed; IOW, if you have a serious injury on a GC rafting trip, odds are you're going to be lying in a bed at Flagstaff Medical Center within an hour, two tops. I'm more concerned with being somewhere along the Tonto trail between South Bass and Boucher.

As far as the legality thing, yeah, that link I gave was sketchy. Here's one a little more solid, I think, though it's only for one state:

http://edfolsomlaw.com/2013/01/illegal-possession-of-your-own-prescription-drugs/

I believe if you do further searches, you will find similar links for other states.

As far as James' asking how an officer could find it without doing an illegal search, all I can say is, you have GOT to be kidding me. This is America. An officer can do anything they please. Certainly, "probable cause" is a joke, and any serious journalist who knows anything about police work (e.g. David Simon, David Milch though not a journalist) will tell you that. Of course, the place I'd be most concerned about this issue is TSA (at the airport) and of course they have carte blanche to search all your possessions.

After all this, let me reiterate that I do not worry about this. I just wanted to point it out.

Frankly, I don't care. The rangers are offices of the law, in NYS…same as the "Storm Troopers"…err…state troopers. They are also far more reasonable…

Hiking, well that IS the same as "in use," ehh?