Denier on SD tents

I don't like less than 30D for a floor, but I'm okay with a 20D canopy.

You are probably asking in the wrong place. Nobody here would consider 70 necessary. I have a tent with 30 D floor and 20 D everywhere else and feel good about the durability.

70 D nylon:
Dinosaur overkill – for a skilled user. 30 D lasts for years.
Inadequate for a novice.

Cheers

For comparison, the Nemo Go Go Elite is made with 10d PU fly and 20d PU floor. That might just be a little too thin though.

Thanks for the opinions. Is there more to being a "skilled user" than just taking care of the gear, being careful where the tent is pitched, watching for sharp objects, etc? Other things to consider? Thanks!

"Is there more to being a "skilled user" than just taking care of the gear, being careful where the tent is pitched, watching for sharp objects, etc?"

Nope… basically if you are not a pin head you can figure out how to take care of your tent. If you don't… you can still use it, just don't pitch it in a pool of water.

There is no such thing as waterproof anything. It will all eventually leak. Camp site selection is more important than shelter design and that is where the experience comes in. Don't put up a tent in a place where water will pool and don't expect a tent to be the only thing protecting you from the elements. Your brain is the first line of defense.

So.. skilled user is someone who has already done all the dumb things and lived to tell about it.

Sure, site selection is a skill, but for someone like me that's an ex-infantryman, being a "skilled user" basically means being thoughtful about everything I do, and putting the gear first a lot of the time.
I expect to get a good long life and lots of use from my LW and UL gear. That won't happen due to the gear itself being "durable"(a very relative term), but from being mindful of the fact that it isn't.

> a good long life and lots of use from my LW and UL gear
I should add, just in case, that few of us would expect to get as long a life from 20D as from 70D – although given that 20D is likely to be a silnylon while 70D is likely to be PU-coated, maybe that's not so certain.

Of course, you miss the REAL point. How else do you justify buying a replacement from the very latest gear if what you have lasts for ever????

Cheers

Ha, ha….Yup. Roger's correct. I usually buy good gear, ie, stuff that will last a while. I ended up with a couple or three outfits after giving away half of it. I gave up keeping up with the Joneses…9-11 pounds is comfortable. I don't really care about going lighter.

Jeff,
you are not comparing apples with apples.
The 75 denier fly is polyester, the 20 and 30 denier versions are in ripstop nylon.

(I told you I would show my ignorance.) Why is the distinction between poly and sil nylon important?

There are advantages and disadvantages with both.
My point is that they are not the same.
I will let someone else come up with the differences given that the brand I am with only uses one of the two.

I don't think you can have a discussion on tent fabric denier without also discussing hydrostatic head especially with floor fabrics.

My backpacking buddy Patman does a good review on a Big Agnes tent with a 20 denier floor which he's returned to Big Agnes several times for replacement. See his review here—
http://www.trailspace.com/gear/big-agnes/fly-creek-ul2/#review24531

And then there's the hydrostatic head of thin denier floors which is commonly around 1,200mm for 30 denier—too low in my opinion.

Ground water, sheeting ground water and ground "lake effect" pooling are common during deluges in the Southeast mountains where I backpack. So, I require a floor with at least 7,000 to 10,000mm head.

Do this test with a thin denier tent floor—
** Make a pool of water with the hose in the backyard in the grass.
** Place tent floor on top of pool and sit on it for 5 minutes.
** No water should sponge up thru the floor. If so the floor is too thin and not waterproof.

This is important during rain deluges and when camping atop saturated ground or ground with slushy snow.