Why hasn't the pacific crest trail been extended into Canada?

[Justin Baker]

I’m curious why the pacific crest trail has not been extended into western canada and into Alaska. Is the area too remote/not practical for through hiking?

[Bob Bankhead]

Canadians are smart – they don’t want entitlement hiker trash stinking up Canada any further north than Manning Park. Think of the forest fires they are preventing by doing so.

[Nick Gatel]

Canadians and Alaskans don’t need trails to go backpacking.

[Ken Thompson]

No continual crest in the Coastal Ranges? Would make more sense for the CDT to extend further north along the Rocky Mountain range.

[Miner]

“I’m curious why the pacific crest trail has not been extended into western canada and into Alaska. Is the area too remote/not practical for through hiking?”
The PCT is a US creation. Canada has shown no interest in doing something similar on their side of the border. That is pretty much the end of story.
But to dig a little deeper, to quote an old rap song, “It’s all about the Benjamin’s”. The US government can’t even properly fund maintaining the existing trails in this country, so they are certainly aren’t gong to pay to build trails in another country. The PCTA was created to be a bridge between the public and the USFS, so their mandate for existing is soley on US territory. They struggle with maintaining the existing trail while finding money to expand protection along the numerous private property sections the trail goes through, so they don’t have any resources to send north of the border. Which brings us back to my first point. Unless the Canadian people and government want it to happen and do it, you aren’t gong to see it. What is probably lacking the most is someone taking the task on to promote it in Canada. That is how support was slowly gained for the AT and PCT.

“No continual crest in the Coastal Ranges? Would make more sense for the CDT to extend further north along the Rocky Mountain range.” You mean like the GDT already does? Only it isn’t really an official trail as it was put together using existing trails, some of which don’t really exist anymore. But at least in this case, there are people promoting it on the Canadian side.

[Luke Schmidt]

It would be interesting but the PCT is already the practical limit of what most people have time/motivation to hike. I doubt it would get enough use to keep it from getting grown over.

 

 

[Justin Baker]

Of course the United States wouldn’t pay for a Canadian section of the PCT or CDT. Is there a reason why Canada wouldn’t want to designate a long distance hiking trail connected to the PCT or CDT? It would involve plotting a route through existing trails and slapping some trail markers on them. It could be maintained by volunteer crews. Or are these places too remote for proper maintenance?

I was thinking it would be cool to do the PCT and come back at a later time to continue further into Canada.

[Gary Dunckel]

Passport issues?

[Ken Thompson]

Well Gary there is the IAT.

[Paul Magnanti]

Most longer trails are going to be a collection of trails, x-country travel or jeep road walking. People will publish a guidebook and mapset and call it good going forward.

The AT,PCT, CDT and other national scenic trails came out of an era that is long gone I’m afraid. Unless there is an active volunteer base (Florida Trail, Arizona Trail) near a major metro area, a well-maintained and funded trail is highly unlikely int the US much less Canada.

There is the Great Divide Trail and the International Appalachian Trail  in Canada, but that is more like the scenario I said above. In other words, a collection of exiting routes compiled together to make one big route. Esp the GDT.

ps. Technically speaking, the PCT does extend 12km into Canada at Manning Park. :)

 

[James holden]

the climate and terrain get harder as you get into the coastal regions and northern BC … in the coastal areas the amount of trail maintenance would be quite high as things get overgrown in a year or two in our temperate rain forests

there are much fewer towns than the US and its more spread out … especially off the highway

rescue will likely be very problematic in certain areas …

we have more bears and they are more aggressive (predatory) … nor do we want a whole bunch of PHAT yankees tempting em

fire bans are a very MAJOR issue in canada … witness the recent fort mcmurray fire that leveled the town …

and youll need to cross several rugged mountain ranges and forests … unless you just want to follow the highway

its likely not something most folks can do in a poncho tarp and bivy  …

to put it simply for the most part youll be on your own …

besides who needs it … heres the provincial parks alone in BC …

http://www.env.gov.bc.ca/bcparks/recreation/hiking/

 

;)

[James holden]

the other point is that from the central BC border (manning park) to the alaska panhandle is ~600 miles as the crow flies … and unlike the trails down south you absolutely wont be able to keep a somewhat straight line (as seen below on the map) … so the actual distance will be MUCH greater ….

as a comparison washington and oregon from north to south as the crows fly is around 500 miles ….

also the amount of trees up here is insane …. many folks just dont understand how forested BC is …

heres the number of “stream crossings” youd need to get to the panhandle ….

you can measure the straight line distances here …

https://www.freemaptools.com/measure-distance.htm

;)

 

[Mark]

Never really understood the need for long distance trails.

If you want to walk somewhere then buy some maps and plan a route.

I guess in this day and age some people want to avoid that responsibility and walk what someone else’s idea of a good route instead.

Maybe it’s a European thing though as i certainly would never hike in any area that needed me to buy or apply for a permit either.

One of the main points of hiking for me is the freedom to select which route i feel is best then change it if it doesn’t meet my expectations.

So if someone wanted to walk up through Canada why on earth would they want or need a official trail to do it????

[Paul Magnanti]

Never really understood the need for long distance trails.

If you want to walk somewhere then buy some maps and plan a route.

I’ve been thinking about this on and off for the past few years myself.

I think people enjoy the idea of a ready made and designated trail for a few reasons:

• Logistic planning is easier. Sometimes it is nice to walk in a beautiful area and leave it that. Grab the map set, any guidebook, website resources etc. I tend to enjoy plotting out my own routes, but there are some obscure routes or trails that are alluring to me as well. Esp if I was to have some free time at the last minute. (Allegheny Trail in the autumn lets say). For heavily wooded areas, a designated trail makes sense versus a 100 mile route in the Winds such as what I have planned for next month.

Having said that..the biggest reasons I see for some:

• There is a bit of a cachet to doing the “lettered routes” for many.  It used to be the wild places were celebrated as part of doing the trails, but the trails themselves and the lifestyle around them are alluring to many people.    I often call it HIKING vs “hiking” :)  You can almost hear people say “Are you going HIKING this year?”    “Are there any HIKERS in town?”   “What HIKE should I do this year?”
• We are a goal oriented culture. Running 26.2 miles in the woods is running. Running 26.2 miles with aid stations, official t-shirts, a marked course and a completion medal is a TRAIL MARATHON.  Same concept with the lettered routes and trails I think.
• Not everyone is inclined to plan out their own route for whatever reason..usually lack of comfort level, time available, skill set and/or experience.
• And, I’ll mention it again more explicitly: People really do like the lifestyle around it.  If you spent 100 or 200 miles hiking a lettered route, even a route someone took it upon themselves to make and call it that, you are in a club of some sort.  Hike 100 or 200 miles in the Canadian Rockies for a couple of weeks? Well, that’s just hiking. Not HIKING. ;)

I’ve enjoyed my time on the lettered routes. But life would be limited if that was my only outdoor experience..at least for me.  (What I call Alphabet Soup Hiking when I am feeling a bit more flippant)

Just my opinion.  My .05 worth.  YMMV. Void where prohibited.  Etc.

 

 

 

 

[Mark]

Good post Paul.

The amount of bushwacking/exploring opportunities these days is limited to most of us not living next to vast wilderness areas like say Alaska, so i guess the vast vast majority of us are herded onto known trails for most of our hiking.

Still i take great pleasure in choosing which of these routes i take, sometimes unplanned route changes turn out to be the best bits.

For the challenge bit.

I do a bit of trail running and have built up to just over 20km on local mountains, some of my mates keep on at me to enter a marathon, they just can’t seem to understand the fact that i run cause i enjoy the freedom to run where and when i want and often without passing another person the entire run.

Racing with other runners sounds like an absolute nightmare.

Maybe it’s a age thing, but at 47 I’ve nothing to prove to anyone, including myself….

So the idea of folks that are looking for a wilderness experience being herded together onto trails for months on end, after running the gauntlet of permits rules and regulations seems a bit odd to me.

 

[jscott]

Hiking in BC is a different thing than hiking in the states, for all of the reasons Eric pointed out. Trails aren’t maintained to the same degree–or at least this was true when I used to live near BC. And trails get overgrown or blocked by treefall quickly. And the river crossings…even the North Coast trail on Vancouver Island is rough going in spots and that’s a popular trail. Off trail hiking through acres of vegetation and downed trees isn’t fun. So ‘established’ trails in Canada may be the best way to go.

[James holden]

Hike 100 or 200 miles in the Canadian Rockies for a couple of weeks? Well, that’s just hiking. Not HIKING.

thats just called delivery service for all the hungry bears ….

on a side note the berry crop has been exceptional this summer around glacier park (canada) and canmore … and bears luuuv berries …

can you imagine having force thru hikers to hike in groups of 4 or more, carry bear spray (so heavy) or even close trails because of bears ???

there would be many posts on the forums complaining about it !!!

;)

[Paul Magnanti]

Eric, not sure..but you seem to have missed my sarcastic intent.

I was poking fun at the long distance hiking mentality that it is only HIKING if it is a designated route with a catchy acronym…or Alphabet Soup Hiking.

To “merely” hike 100 miles without a catchy acronym is just “hiking” as opposed to HIKING.

Having spent some time in that community, I find the trend is more pronounced than even five years ago.

So it goes….

To bring it back to the original discussion, an intrepid hiker could extend the PCT. Hike a few hundred miles. Make a map set. Call it a catchy acronym. (Canadian Costal Trail?  BC Coastal Range Trail?  BCCRT) . Have a website about it. Find a person to thru-hike your new creation. Put it up on Facebook with lots of #epic #liveauthentic  type hash-tags and VOLIA!  The PCT is now “officially” extended in certain circles with a nifty new trail…

[Nick Gatel]

Perhaps it isn’t HIKING unless it is a pmags “alphabet soup trail,” documented almost daily on a blog or trail journal website, “Liked” by at least 2K people on Facebook or “Followed” by the same number of Twits, and the HIKER needs to find something that is missing in their life that the trail will miraculously provide. HIKING needs to be an epic journey shared with multitudes on the trail and minions of Internet people. It also requires a Trail Name that is bestowed on the HIKER by said trail multitudes that are also HIKERS.

 

 

[BlackHatGuy]

I guess I’m neither a HIKER nor a hiker.

I’m not a HIKER because I have no interest in long trails or thru hiking. 5-7 days out is my sweet spot, then I’m ready to go back home. I’m not a hiker because I have no interest in pouring over maps and planning my ‘own’ route, so I’m ever grateful for the multitude of established trails already out there – more than I’ll ever be able to do in my lifetime (of which there isn’t all that much left).

Really, I just like walking outside/being outside with other people. I never backpack alone because I don’t enjoy it, primarily because I can’t get over my anxiety of being out there by myself (and feel no need to ‘train’ myself by repeatedly doing something I don’t really like until I’m used to it).

I have no trail name (and when others have tried to bestow one on me, I simply don’t use it. What’s my trail name? Doug.) I have nothing epic to share, so I don’t do social media (not to mention, I’m not all that social in a grand sense). I’m not UL, in either pack or belly.

Perhaps I’m just simply a walker who sometimes takes a few days to get where I’m going, even when I’m not going anywhere in particular. I’m okay with that.

[Nick Gatel]

Perhaps I’m just simply a walker who sometimes takes a few days to get where I’m going, even when I’m not going anywhere in particular. I’m okay with that.

As I have posted here many times, it’s just walking. We often times make more of it than it is.

There is nothing wrong with a thru hike, and nothing wrong with reading and talking about them. A few years ago I followed Balls and Sunshine’s hikes. Then I followed Carrot Quinn’s 2nd PCT hike. All three have been discussed here. Last year I read Chris Townsend’s account of his PCT hike, written 30 years after he hiked it, and he discusses how thru-hikes have change! especially the social aspects; much different than the typical long trail genre. This year I have been following Brown Girl on the PCT, a young black woman who shares an even different perspective than what I have read previously.

I do enjoy off trail solo trips, but these are not things most people want to do, and they are not superior to any other kind of walking, other than it is what I like.

In my mind, the important thing is to be outdoors as much as one wants to spend time and not let life get in the way of living, whether it be long or weekend backpacking trips, camping, boating, or bicycling – all of which I enjoy.

Unfortunately, for several months a year, popular trails like the PCT and the JMT have become human freeways and we love them to death.

 

[James holden]

paul …

i just wanted to interject some BEARS into the discussion … we are talking about canada and BC after all =P

i never knew that HIKING was such as big thing in murica … i dont think ive ever heard of trail names up in the frozen north unless its something like “shat pants when faced with grizzly”

most canuckistanis just simply walk out their front door to go hiking … even in urban vancouver weve got tons of trails and hills within a short bus ride of town, and the rescues to prove it …

for the most part we dont live off trails for months on end here or have a HIKING lifestyle … the weather and terrain tends to be less friendly outside of the middle summer (living in a tent in multiple days of heavy rain in the coastal PNW aint fun for most folks), and the mosquitos are particularly vicious at times …

there is a definite “outdoors” lifestyle however with many folks who hike, trail run, climb, kayak, etc … everyday …. but i suspect thats the same for many mountain/coastal towns

;)

[Paul Magnanti]

A person I consider a good friend is a well-known long distance hiker. He is not based in the US.

As he started hiking the long distance hiking trails in the US, he was surprised at the amount of attention paid to the designated routes, and the culture around it, versus just being outside for the sake of being outside.

Anyway, no need to extend the PCT or any trail officially. Anyone can do it on their own if they wish, have the comfort level and the experience.

Look at maps and backcountry road atlases. String together jeep roads, existing trails and x-country options.

It is how a lot of the famous long trails started after all…

 

[David Thomas]

If you want to hike from the southern US border, north through the US and continue into Canada, there’s the Chilkoot Trail that I hiked with my family last year.

Start at tidewater in Skagway, Alaska, walk north out of town, and north along the Chilkoot Trail until you enter Canada at the pass.  Continue as far as you want (Bennett where you can catch a train back, or Carcross or Whitehorse).  16 km to from Skagway to the trailhead, then another 53 km to Bennett. So not exactly PCT in terms of length, but starting from home, we had 6 border crossings that week.

[Paul Magnanti]

. Last year I read Chris Townsend’s account of his PCT hike, written 30 years after he hiked it,\

Nick, or anyone for that matter, you may be interested in The Great Divide by Stephen Pern.  An Englishman who walked the Continental Divide back in 1986.  Not the CDT per se.  In fact, there is a portion of the book where he burnt some “yellow guidebooks”. :)

Another look at a different time.

I read it not long after I moved to Colorado.  It was released again last year or so in Kindle format.

 

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