Front Pack?

[Matthew / BPL]

I am thinking about picking up a ZPacks or LUL front/multi-pack to hang off the shoulder straps of my GG Kumo and ULA Catalyst packs. I’d like to carry a .5 liter bottle, snacks, compass, car keys, etc. I’ve carried water in my ULA straps and have experimented with an MLD strap pocket. I like both solutions and thought it might be nice to consolidate into one pack.

I’d be curious to hear about anyone’s experience using a front pack in this manner. Thanks.

[jimmy b]

Normally I don’t like the idea of things hanging from my pack if I have options. Especially out front. I have shoulder pockets for snacks and use a drink hose to the bottle in my side pocket. Things like keys that have no use get buried in my pack to avoid accidental loss.  I do however like attaching a small pouch to my sternum strap for my small bino’s when hiking with birding being the main event. It’s just easier to have them ready to go, so I see some merit in the idea. IMO its what you are comfortable with.

Also whenever I have the urge to justify carrying anything additional, I try like heck to talk myself out of it .

[Ken Thompson]

I don’t need more of my torso covered up. Warm enough already. Water on a shoulder strap and a pouch on my waist belt or other strap. I don’t need much while underway. I’ll stop to eat a large snack. Usually when refilling water as I’m lucky/choose to hike in areas where I don’t have to carry large loads of that resource.

[Roger Caffin]

Aarn Packs push this idea, with a pack on each shoulder strap. I have tried it several times, and I found it was awful for me.

The front packs made me sweat something awful.

The front packs prevented me from seeing where I was putting my feet.

The front packs got in the way of my arms.

The front packs swung all over the place when I was putting the pack on or taking it off.

My wife found the front packs very uncomfortable for her own reasons.

Cheers

 

@Matt

Carrying water on the front is exactly why the zpacks multi-pack was developed and it works very good for that.

[Ken Thompson]

But you wear it as a waist pack Jobn

[Jennifer Mitol]

I tried REALLY hard to like the Zpacks multipack…it seemed like such a great idea!  but I apparently already have some, ahem, baggage in the front, so it never worked for me.

 

 

[Daryl and Daryl]

Mathew,

I’ve used one for 15 years or so on all my backpacking trips.  None of the complaints listed bother me.  Eliminates all backward pulling of backpack.  I carry about 5 lbs in the front bag. On trails I often don’t bother with shoulder straps.  Takes some getting used to.  Based upon past discussions here, over several years, I’d say most people don’t like them.

It would be easy for you to experiment before buying one.  Simply tie a shopping bag to the front of your fully loaded pack, add  3-5 lbs and test it.  I use a frame pack and connect the front bag to the top corners of the pack frame…not the shoulder straps.

 

But you wear it as a waist pack Jobn

I do now. As you know, I got to where I hated the weight pulling down on my shoulders.

How is that hipbelt water pouch you made after trying out the the one I have been using attached to my multipack belt?

[Jeremy]

I’ve used the Zpacks Multi-Pack for my past few trips and love it. I picked it up to carry my DSLR camera. Works great and it’s tough.

[Ken Thompson]

“How is that hipbelt water pouch you made after trying out the the one I have been using attached to my multipack belt?”

Too much with the sloshing sounds. Back on the shoulder strap. Since it’s only a half liter when full I do not notice the weight. Did modify my strap to get it a bit lower, seems better.

I did pick up a Multi Pack on Gearswap a while back. Broke a buckle in the mail. Just got it back from ZPacks and now working it out on to best utilize with my style of hiking. Not much use with all the life changes that last few months.

End drift.

[Matthew / BPL]

Thanks for all of differing opinions on both sides of the fence.

I already know I like carrying bottles, phone, compass and food up front and I am positive the anatomy of my chest won’t get in the way. I think I will take the plunge and pick one up.

[Daryl and Daryl]

http://www.backpacking.net/bbs.html

Mathew,

Similar thread in Make Your Own Forum at link above.

Is that you too?

Responses are similar to what you are getting here.

 

[James Marco]

Well, front packs are not a new idea. I tried them 10-15 years ago after figuring out that they let you stand with better posture.  They do.

However, the distribution of weight also matches the distribution across your shoulders. This means that all weight is now carried on your shoulder straps. This says your shoulders and back will carry the weight as well as your hips, legs and feet. Your hips, legs and feet always carry any weight, this cannot be helped.

More modern thought:

A) With lighter loads, ie less than around 30 pounds give or take, a stiffer framed pack (or a technique of creating a frame from a pad and your gear in your pack) and a hip belt will relieve 75-85% of the weight otherwise supported by your shoulders and back muscles.

B) The shoulder straps/torso strap become only stabilizers for the weight of the pack.

C) The forward lean to offset the weight is the normal hiking posture with the staff(for loads between 20-30 pounds) picking up any extra weight caused by leaning forward.

So, you end up with the weight mostly transferred directly to your hips, legs and feet, avoiding  all but about 10-15% of the weight on your back and shoulders. A front pack, or pair of them, moves the weight onto your shoulders and back.

[David Chenault]

The idea is sound but for me the Multipack was sweaty and blocked the view of my feet too often.  The Osprey Grab bag is smaller and mounts lower, but still holds quite a bit.  The new version is lighter than the original and has plenty of pockets for organization.

[Matthew / BPL]

@ Daryl & Daryl – Nope, that is not me on the other forum. I’ve not even heard of that forum before. I’ll read the thread now, thanks for sharing it.

[David Thomas]

I’m with Daryl (and his other brother Daryl) – I haven’t minded it when I did it.  That’s included:

Taking weight off another backpacker who was struggling.

Taking the daypack of a companion on a death march (Rim to Rim to Rim in the Grand Canyon in the Summer) because he was slower than I was.  I found while of course it was more weight, my back actually felt better for being more front-to-back balanced.

Early in a trip (with kids along) when food weight is at a maximum.  I’ve therefore imagined it as a helpful technique for through hikes on longer sections.  There are 3 ounce daypack options and with all your gear to choose from, you ought to be able to put soft stuff against your chest plus enough heavy stuff to balance our your backpack weight quite a bit.  This could allow you to take a smaller volume (therefore lighter) main pack if your main pack doesn’t have to accommodate your totally worst-case load.  AND you get a day pack to use as, well, a daypack plus as a hang bag, stuff sack, pillow case, etc.

[James Marco]

David, yes. With heavy loads, >15-20% of you body weight, “emergency” carries (as you mentioned,) family hiking and for hauling an extra 20 pounds around with you front packs are worth while. As I said I was referring to lighter weights, less than 30 pounds. Take nature as your queue. Women carry extra weight around permanently on their chests.  With less than 30 pounds or so, you are better off without a front pack, though. With 50 pounds or more it easily makes sense, but we are out of the realm of packing light.

[tom duffy]

The European mountain runners often sport bodybpacks to have some weight/pockets on the front. I too find merit in the idea.  I like AARN front packs but prefer the very small framed ones around 5-6 litres.

AARN sells an adapter for his front packs..a “hip belt holster” which luckily just fits the hip belt of my Mountain Laurel Designs Exodus without any sewing.

In summer if I am dry camping I approach the comfort limit of some frame-less packs despite an ultralight baseweight.  The exodus has often too much volume so just shifting weight  forward  is my aim (4kg of dense things like water/fuel)….and reaching my “on the move” gear.

They are small enough to avoid some of what Roger dislikes above. They are framed with an curved alloy strut (unlike my pack) alloying me to put this weight directly on the hip belt…. and allow some air flow.  It is stabilized to the other side and I clip it to the shoulder strap daisy chain so doesn’t swing and pull like water bottles in shoulder bags or bounce like a simple chest pouch with significant weight in it.

I can stand straighter and get some air flow around my back.

All up I have to add ~265g but avoid using the MLD sternum strap/hip pocket/shoulder pouch or a chest pouch (eg OMM, Zpacks) so gain maybe half that.  It’s a lot with a 500g pack but seems less if you are adding 4000g of water anyway.  It remains lighter than my framed/semi-framed packs on these walks. They are designed to pivot when unclipped as shown.

 

 

[Roger Caffin]

Hum … adding 4 L of water is ALWAYS a pain! Did that several times a week ago, climbing 500 m over rough ground each time.

Some more photos might be nice.

Are these clipped at both sides to the hip belt to avoid twisting?
Do they inhibit arm movement at all? (This might be an acceptable compromise of course.)
Can you get a 1.25 L PET rocket-base bottle in one?

It does seem as though there ought to be a solution somewhere.

Cheers

[Andrew Srna]

Mathew-
Check out the front pack option on the WAA ultra bag 20 litre, you can purchase just the front addon bag. Its the mds bag for marathon des sobles, desert ultra runners use it for stage races, may work for you.

[Matthew / BPL]

That’s an interesting pack and I’ve not seen it before.

I had forgotten about this thread. As I’ve simplified my gear I have less desire to carry up front. I do like an MLD zip pouch to carry a couple small things on my shoulder strap and I think the Lycra shoulder pockets on SMD/Palante/KS packs look handy.

[tom duffy]

I used the smallest pockets AARN sells….in theory 185g for a pair and holding only 5 liters (+1 externally) nominally for my daughters pack of course. I added a second midline clip, carabiners and the hipbelt-holster hence 265g in total.

The hope was occasional use on longer hikes without destroying my pack.

The clip in point for the belt adapter is low so the adapter does spin on the belt.  It may not be so easily with a better hip belt. For fun I tried it on a old osprey talon as it looks designed to fit a two 20mm strap hip belt (hence the bit of velcro in the middle of the adapter).  It fits but the Osprey belt clip connects via a 25mm tape buckle rather than 40mm so it spins and fails.  The ULA pack I saw last week would similarly fail without modifying the pack.

 

The belt mount slides on the MLD shaped belt is luckily held by the foam expanding.

His larger pockets have stabilizer straps but this size seems to have avoided them. The alloy strut runs diagonally across the back of the pocket. The two midline corners of the pouch attach to the other pouch the other corners to the shoulder strap daisy chain and the hip belt.  It is thus fairly stable perhaps as it is easy to filled.

This pouch is about 11 by 5.5 inches …..so will sit about 11 inches above the hip belt.  A 1.25 litre PET bottle is 11 inches high so the zipper closes but it is awkward to pack around (as the pouch is contoured slightly)

The alloy strut is pre-bent away from your chest to allow some air flow.

His video has him fitting two 6 liter pockets but as my aim is getting mass out of the unframed pack I sourced the two 2.5 litre bags.  (The MLD exodus as rear 5 liter pocket if they were ever a real problem.)

He sells lots of fun stuff but I didn’t need to carry padding…or waterproofing…or extra volume

Unfortunately his cuben stuff is still “back ordered indefinitely”. Below has a 7.5 litre pouch  which stays off the body but is probably still a bit in the way

 

[Ken Thompson]

Too obstructing in every way for me.

[Stumphges]

I experimented with carrying water and nuts on the front for seven days on a heavy trip to the Smokies this spring. I alternately carried the top lid of an Osprey Stratos pack and two shoulder strap-mounted 1L water bottles on the front. I did not feel my vision or agility was impeded by either, although I was almost always on trail.

The top lid carried surprisingly well suspended at about chest level and loaded with 5-10 pounds in the early days of the trip. Only the bottom edge of the lid touched my chest as the body of the bag tended to ride on the shoulder straps.

As food dwindled I put the lid back on the pack and started carrying 1L bottles of water on the shoulder straps. I liked this a lot but my wife said I looked like a dork.

For myself, I’m fine with a backpack to about 17 pounds. At that point I can feel my head and neck assuming the “forward head posture.” This posture is the source of many neck and upper body repetitive strain injuries, and has also been shown to increase loads at the junction of the sacrum and 5th lumbar vertebra, where I have a herniation, so I have extra motivation to make the front pack work.

I plan to continue carrying water on the front, despite the dorkiness.

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