A Word Of Caution Regarding Luke's Ultralite

[Don Burton]

I saw the Massdrop “drop” too. I’ve always understood Massdrop not to be a real money maker for most companies but more of a marketing tool. This is probably a good idea for him because he’s turned off a lot of people in the UL community. This is a way for him to get his name out to many thousands of potentially new customers. Most will not buy the shorts but they might check his site out and buy something later. I would be surprised if they’ll sell 100 units through MD. If he made $15 per unit which I think is unlikely, that would only be $1500. Hardly enough to get back on your feet.

[JCH]

Call me “Pollyanna” :)

[Marion Watts]

Throwing a bit of information out there…. Just today I received my M10 Rain Pants from Luke’s Ultralight. I emailed back and forth with Luke starting September 9th, and ordered September 11th. All emails were promptly answered, usually within an hour or two, by Luke himself. I received an email two days ago with a shipping notification, which was several days earlier than the quoted timeline. Pants arrived as expected with a seemingly good eye for quality.
<p style=”padding-left: 30px;”>I know not everyone’s experience lately with LUL has been stellar, and if I had read this post before I ordered, I doubt I would have. But my experience was a good one, and I thought I should post as such. Hopefully, Luke and his company are on the rebound, and will make right with any customer not treated properly.</p>

[Andy H]

@ Marion

wow that’s kind of shocking to hear. I cancelled an expensive order at the end of august as it was the end of the 180-day Paypal dispute timeframe. I ordered it at the beginning of March. Sent an email letting him know i was going to do so and to give him a chance to make it right and didn’t hear back. I left a smaller order from April active to see if it’d be filled and still nothing.
I see now that he has chosen to not make good on his pending orders. This is really disappointing, I feel stolen from at this point. Had he answered any of the four polite emails I sent him inquiring as to the status of my orders then perhaps I’d most likely have waited it out. Injury or not he should at the very least communicate individually with the people who have paid him, not by Facebook posts and website status updates. Terrible business practice and I now question his morality.

[Marion Watts]

@Andy.

Agreed, my order seems to be the anomaly recently. Not exactly sure why my experience was so different from many others…

[J R]

I’ve tried not to judge Luke’s throughout this situation, just not enough information. But this is the last straw in my mind — Luke is a lying crook. Sorry.

They sent a letter to some customers, after weeks and months, claiming Luke was in a car accident — which then became two car accidents —  and that’s why orders couldn’t be filled. Now his website says he was in the hospital for “a seizure, heart problems and some other medical issues.” So which is it, car accidents or seizures and heart problems?

He also now says he is taking and fulfilling a limited number of new orders, and he is participating in a Massdrop, all while apparently completely ignoring orders that have been outstanding for months. All while claiming, “I’ll do my absolute best to make things right to my customers.”

Sorry, but it’s now clear to me: liar and thief. This is not even remotely close to how an honest and sincere businessman deals with a rough patch.

[Greg Mihalik]

“So which is it, car accidents or seizures and heart problems?”

Not defending, haven’t built a flowchart/timeline, and have no dogs in this fight, but a lot of stuff can happen as a consequence of a severe car accident, months after the event.

That said, a timely consistent narrative would go a long way towards helping folks understand what’s happening.

 

[JCH]

Not defending, haven’t built a flowchart/timeline, and have no dogs in this fight…

Ditto.  The only thing I’m comfortable saying for sure is that the lack of timely, complete, earnest and coherent communication out of LUL is very unfortunate…both for those whose orders are “in limbo” and for the reputation lost.

[J R]

a lot of stuff can happen as a consequence of a severe car accident, months after the event.

Yes, but does that include the ability to fulfill a new Massdrop but not to fulfill outstanding orders for which funds have long since been collected? =/

[Opogobalus]

Has the situation improved? His fb page has an update saying he’s up and running and trying to write things (but that’s from early October).

[Carl S]

Jonathan,

Thanks for the reminder; he still owes me almost $100. I imagine there are so many others out there. I have heard about people placing orders and receiving goods recently; if this is true it is a slap in the face to the many who were stiffed earlier this year.

You know, people are generally understanding under circumstances like this; hikers, and fellow veterans, more so. Being honest, communicative, and solving the problem, even slowly, rather than running away from it, would work for most people including myself. It’s sad that they have chosen the route of running from the problem and hiding in a hole. Even more infuriating to think that they could start up again and act like nothing happened. That is inexcusable under any scenario.

[Bob Moulder]

It’s almost as if LUL thinks it will just go away.

It won’t. I remember being stiffed for $40 in 1981 and it still sticks in my craw.

And it’s a shame for Luke because even at this late date people will be incredibly quick to forgive if a little bit of contrition is shown and things are made right in a timely manner for those who still have outstanding orders.

I don’t know how people sleep at night with things like this hanging. Bad karma.

[Opogobalus]

Damn that’s a shame. I wonder if his plan is to fill some orders to get enough cash together to refund people? If so it’s still incredibly poor to not communicate that.

Or maybe that’s giving him too much credit, maybe he is just trying to write off that period and ignore it till it goes away.

 

Speculation only. He’s a member of this forum right? Surely he’s read this..

[JCH]

He’s a member of this forum right? Surely he’s read this..

If someone is capable of ignoring the fact that they are not conducting themselves honorably, then they are capable of ignoring threads such as this!

[Opogobalus]

I was referring to the fact he hadn’t defended himself. It’s easier to ignore an email than it is to ignore bad press I suspect.

[JCH]

Jonathan – it’s all good, I certainly wasn’t trying to argue :)

Like Bob M. said, I don’t know how some people sleep at night, but I’m long past expecting everyone to think like me. I can say that I won’t be doing business with LUL anytime soon, and definitely not until/unless there is a full and public accounting for past behavior and proof of a subsequent long history of exemplary business practices and customer service.

[Kief H]

Yet another Massdrop offering from Luke’s today: Hexon windpants. Seems like insult added to injury for folks awaiting orders, refunds, or explanations.

[Parker]

Luke is local to me and I have had him make me various items over the years (rain jacket, rain pants, waterproof down jacket, laundry shorts, etc.).  Up until all of this happened, his communication was excellent, the wait time was minimal, and the products were top notch.

Then all of these issues popped up.  I didn’t order anything until he mentioned on his facebook page and website that he was working on getting back on his feet and was taking limited orders.

I, like many others, am the type of person to give someone a second chance, so I asked him to make me a pair of Micro10 gaiters.  He turned those around in about 2 weeks and quality was spot on.

I recently asked him to make me a pair of Vapor 30 rain pants.  Communication during ordering was great.  Wait time was stated as about 3-4 weeks.  So far so good.

Obviously none of this helps those that are still out product or refunds.  Hopefully he will make everything right at some point.

[Parker]

Ok, wanted to follow-up on my previous thread now that I have received my latest custom order from Luke.

I actually ended up meeting Luke in person to pick up my order (I am local to him), which gave me a chance to chat with him about everything that has been going on.  As most are aware, he had a bunch of bad stuff happen all at once (two car accidents) and is still working to get over all of the medical issue from that. The combination of his accidents and medical issues, then his main sewing guy left for college, and orders blew up, all at the same time, compounded to really create a mess.  He is well aware that he has made some (many?) mistakes in handling everything.  He told me that he has completed many of the back-logged orders and has refunded many others.  Hopefully he has made most everyone square at this point.

At this time, he is only taking very limited orders and those orders are only taken by e-mailing him directly.  He has turned off the ability to order directly form his website as he doesn’t want to get completely backed up again.  He has hired someone local to assist with sewing, however that person only sews the mass market stuff (laundry shorts, etc.).  This is the stuff you are seeing on massdrop.  All of the technical/custom orders are still made by him (and only him).  He doesn’t have a “shop”, just a residential basement, so he has to keep order volume low.  A lot of other places have stopped doing true “custom” work, so this is where he sees his niche.

As I mentioned in my post above, I had him make me a pair of custom Vapor30 rain pants with sealed seams and side zips.  As with all the other products I have had him make for me, they came out great.  Quality is just as good as it has always been.  Delivery time was a little longer than originally quoted, but not drastically.  Overall, another good transaction.

After talking with Luke for awhile, it was easy to see that he is a person that really likes to do what he does (i.e. making this custom gear).  He doesn’t have aspirations to create another Zpacks or anything like that.  He is happy working out of his basement and making custom stuff one order at a time.  It seems to me that he got in way over his head with how popular his stuff was and this was compounded by his accidents and medical issues, and his main sewing guy leaving for college.  Everything just exploded and it wasn’t handled very well at all.

That said, it appears that he either has, or hopefully will be, making things right with those that were owed products/refunds and it appears that he is working hard to keep himself from getting overloaded again.

This is at least my take.  You can make of it what you will.

[Carl S]

Rob,

Glad to hear that you were taken care of. As of today, I still have not received any word or reimbursement. Hopefully he will reach out soon. We are on 9 months now with no communications.

 

Carl S.

[Greg Mihalik]

Thanks Rob.

I don’t have a dog in this fight but it is good to hear that he is a decent guy, trying his best to do the right thing.  Life can be pretty shitty at times. Hopefully he will rise to the top and carry on.

[Parker]

Carl S. – Have you been in contact with him recently?

Luke’s e-mail is: [email protected]

Mark’s e-mail is: [email protected]

Mark is his father and he has been helping with customer communication, etc.

I also have Luke’s cell phone number that I can provide if you like.

[Carl S]

Rob,

thanks! Let me try these emails and see if that will work–have been using his company email up until now. If that doesn’t work, I may come back and get the cell number. You were very kind–appreciate it.

 

Carl

[Adam Kilpatrick]

:-)

Sounds like Luke is getting back on track. Which is fantastic, he really does come up with some great niche UL/SUL gear.

[Tim D]

Thanks Rob, I’ve been holding off on an order until Luke recovered.  I want to support a fellow Vet and knew he hit a bad spot in his life, but didn’t realize how badly the stars had aligned against him all at once.  Running a small business is tough!   I have good friends who’s income would simple stop if they hurt their hands/wrists and couldn’t work.  Kudos to him for hanging in there and making things right.   He has some unique gear and the couple pieces I have are very well made, sounds like it’s time to send him a no-rush order.

Thanks for the update!

[Author]

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