Please help my list out

[Matt Cason]

Okay I am new to lightweight backpacking, although I have been backpacking for over 12 years now. Currently my pack weights about 50-55 lbs and this is just way too much. I have put together a list of items I already own or am thinking about getting and I would really like to get some outside feedback, I do not want to go with a tarp so I plan to keep my Bivy.
Function Product Weight

Clothing Worn

Hat with Brim OR Nimbus Sombrero 3.4
hiking shirt Golite Men’s Lite-weight S/S top 4
underwear Golite Lite-weight Brief 2
hiking shorts Golite Men’s Baseline Shorts 8
hiking socks Wigwam Socks and Liners 10
hiking shoes Vasque Sundowners (Already Own) 70

Other Items worn or carried

trekking poles Leki Ultralight Ti 18.5
whistle Fox Mini 40 Whistle 1
watch High Gear Summit 2
MP3 High Gear Trailaudio 512MB 4

other clothing

wind shirt Golite Wisp Wind Shirt 2.5
insulation layer Only in Winter
rain jacket Will use Golite Wisp here too
rain pants Golite Mens Reed Pants 4
beenie/warm hat

sleep system

tent/bivy Bibler Tripd Bivy 38
Ground Cloth Bibler Tripd Bivy Ground Cloth 6
tent stakes Bozeman Mountain Works Hi-Vis Ti Stakes 1.42
sleeping bag Golite Feather Lite Bag 18
sleeping pad Thermarest Z-lite 15

packing

backpack Gregory Z Pack Large 56
stuff sack for clothing 250ci Bozeman Mountain Works Small 0.37
stuff sack for clothing 250ci Bozeman Mountain Works Small 0.37
stuff sack for sleeping gear 500ci Bozeman Mountain Works Medium 0.61

cooking and water

stove Vargo Jet-Ti Stove (own already) 2.7
fuel cantainer MSR IsoPro Fuel 4
cook pot/Mug Snow Peak Trek 700 Ti 3.3
pot lid built in on pot/mug
wind screen heavy duty aluminum foil 0.5
utensil Vargo Ti Spork (own) 0.489
Lighting Bic Lighter 1
water bottles Platypus 1L (two of them) 1.6
water treatment Pur Hiker (Already Own) 11
Platypus Filter Link
food storage/bear bag Ursalight Bear Bag System 2.7

other essentials

maps Natl Geo Topo 2
light Princeton Tec Scout 1.85
replacement batteries for light Princeton Tec Scout Replacement Batteries 0.22
first aid Adventure Medical Kits .3 (Already Own) 2.21
firestarting Sparklite firestarter 1
sunscreen Dermatone 23 paste 1.26
insect repellent buy at walmart small bottle
personal hygiene assorted toiletires (toothbrush(cut down), toothpaste, hand gel, TP) in waterproof baggie 2

consumables

fuel container MSR IsoPro Fuel 4
food Dry food dehydrated 20 oz /day 100
water 3 Liters worth 96

Total Weight (Ozs.) 502.999
Total Weight (lbs.) 31.4374375

[Anonymous]

Maybe you could let us all know where you plan to be backpacking. Is this a summer time only list ?

For example, the Golite Wisp windshell is not going to keep you very dry very long in a downpour but could be appropriate in the right climate and trip.

The more info you give the better we can help you out.

[Matt Cason]

I mostly go during spring, summer, and fall. Normally through the Smokies and Blue Ridge Mountains of NC, SC, and TN. Where we do get quite a bit of rain in these months especially summer afternoon thunderstorms.

[kevin davidson]

Clothing worn– try lighter weight shoes such as Montrail Vitesse, Lowa Tempest Low or Mid,or Vasque Velocity trail runners/trail shoes( 25 -32 oz. pr.). You will be carrying much lighter loads– you really won’t need the Sundowners. You can use lighter sox (say 2 pairs of Smartwool Adrenaline crews–one to wear one to wash–4 oz. total). Liner sox are usually not needed with such light footwear and summer conditions.

Other clothing– you should really carry a rainshell or poncho to supplement the Wisp (personally, the windshell should be a hooded one for versatility) —
maybe Rainshield or Frogg Toggs ,5-7 oz.or close.
The Wisp will wet thru in a few minutes in a downpour).

I won’t quibble with your sleep , pack, or cooking systems– they are quite serviceable– although there are lighter packs out there that could be considered in the 1 1/2 to 3# range—Granite Gear Vapor Trail or the ULA P-1 or P-2 come to mind.
If travelling solo,an alcohol stove would be a lighter alternative.

Repackage your sunscreen and insect repellant in
the .35 oz. droppers this site sells to save weight and bulk.

Unless there is something I don’t know about backpacking in the Smokies,carrying 3 liters of water at all times seems excessive. Practically everywhere I go,except in the Southwest,1 liter
will suffice. Especially since you’re packing a filter.

So, this should save a few pounds. You should figure out your base weight ( everything, less consumables and what you wear)–since this is the benchmark that is focused on– I think you can easilly get it down below 12 #.

Hope this helps.

[paul johnson]

I’m a die-hard bivy user. in my “quest” for perfect gear, i have acquired several, …er…some,…er…, the truth – many!!

i like the simplicity of a bivy – especially when “pitching” in a torrential downpour. though a skilled tarp camper (NOT me) has methods for staying dry while pitching.

noticed several pts on your list at which wt could be shed – i’ll mention just one.

first, let me say. you’re doing the right thing – going lighter. i started traversing this exact same route over a yr ago. my motivation was age/physical condition. yeah, 80lbs was doable (more like bearable) in the military. 50-55 when i was still in my early-mid 40’s – though i was definitely feeling the wt, esp.going up&down hills. it took an accident (a fall from only 8 feet), when in my late 40’s, that laid me up for 4yrs to force me to go L/UL. it should have been common sense, but i guess i had a chip on my shoulder as to how much this aging body could still carry (a stupid, macho carry over fr/training for power lifting competition as a much younger man). i’m having more fun on the trail now with 15-20 lbs total pack wt, than when i was a kid & far stronger young man carrying 3x the wt. my base pack wt is 7.5lbs for above freezing temps.

How about lighting up the bivy a bit? since you like Bibler, what about this? while i’ve never owned a Tripod, i have studied it closely & learned as much as i could about it. chose the Bibler Bipod Bivy instead. quicker, easier to setup – this is great when pitching it in the rain. still has enough head room & interior space. save b/t 10oz & 14oz in wt over the Tripod (depending upon whose wts you read for each bivy). Have you thought about the Bipod? …or, even a poleless bivy having just a wire hoop (or no hoop at all)? these are far lighter. as long as you’re not claustrophobic, they work well – IMHO. i also like the Integral Designs Unishelters (both eVENT & TegralTex – similar to Bibler’s ToddTex) & Salathe (TegralTex). You might check them out. ID told me in a phone conversation a few months ago (not with Evan Jones – don’t know who it was on the other end of the line) that they may make an eVENT Salathe in ’06 – this isn’t definite; they were only thinking about it at the time.

On a diff note, what I’m carefully considering at this time is the SixMoonDesigns Lunar Solo ‘e’ – a full blown floored single-wall tarptent that weighs 24-27oz depending upon the wt of the floor chosen. Lighter than any pre-bent, sectioned pole bivy. requires one trekking pole (or some type of pole/branch) to pitch. If you check it out, or try/buy it & have any opinions, maybe you could share them. I for one would appreciate it.

ok. i lied. a second place to shed some wt. the “footprint” for the Bibler. try GossamerGear’s Polycryo 1.3oz ground cloth. very inexpensive. when i feel that i need to use a groundcloth, i use them. work fine.

thanks for taking the time to read my comments. Godspeed and good luck on your journey towards the light.

[Matt Cason]

I just want to thank everyone for their comments. Like I said I am just getting into Lightweight backpacking, previously my packs have weighed anywhere from 45 to 60 lbs and have given me back problems. I have made some changes to my list thanks to yall such as I changed the footprint for the bivy to a gossamer gear polycro, changed the Golite Wisp wind shirt to a Golite Ether (looks like it holds better in rain, let me know if I am wrong), I cut back my water being carried to 2L this is only because I sweat a lot and can easily get dehydrated so I like to have enough on hand, changed Vasque Sundowners to Vasque Velocity GTX XCR’s, and dont need the Wigwam socks and liners so that changed to Smartwool Adrenline Trail Running Crews, and I am also going to repackage my insect repellent and sunscreen as suggested. I have decided to stay with the Gregory Pack I like the other suggestion especially the P-2 but this one only weights a little more, I am also going to stick with the Bibler Tripod Bivy instead of the Bipod. I think the extra room is worth the extra pound. Like I said I am not trying to get ultralight here just a light lighter than before. I have looked at the SMD Lunar Solo also. I like it a lot and had trouble deciding between it and a bivy. But I went with the bivy because of its sturdiness. The Lunar is very light and seems easy to setup. Anyways my new weight according to my list is 419oz or 26.2 lbs. Any other thoughts or ideas are greatly appreciated.

[paul johnson]

acc. to the GoLite website – both ’05 windshirts you are considering (i.e., Wisp & Ether) use the same WispHP fabric.

i own a ’05 Wisp & and a ’05 Ether (my mistake while ordering on the web – neglected to remove one of them b/f checking out). as far as i can tell, they are the same fabric, just like the website says.

If you let me know, i can post back on how water resistant they are, or you can use the forum posts search feature & see my comments elsewhere.

Wild Things Epic windshirt is a tad heavier at ~6oz (hoodless) & 10oz (hooded) – a tad less breathable, but more water resistant (Epic is NOT waterproof).

Integral Designs eVENT Rain Jacket breathes very well (much better than GTX) & is 100% waterproof. It’s only 8.8oz in size medium if i recall correctly. Order a size up from normal based upon my first-hand experience.

Already down to 26lbs!!! You’re progressing very well.

[Matt Cason]

I just want to thank everyone for their comments. Like I said I am just getting into Lightweight backpacking, previously my packs have weighed anywhere from 45 to 60 lbs and have given me back problems. I have made some changes to my list thanks to yall such as I changed the footprint for the bivy to a gossamer gear polycro, changed the Golite Wisp wind shirt to a Golite Ether (looks like it holds better in rain, let me know if I am wrong), I cut back my water being carried to 2L this is only because I sweat a lot and can easily get dehydrated so I like to have enough on hand, changed Vasque Sundowners to Vasque Velocity GTX XCR’s, and dont need the Wigwam socks and liners so that changed to Smartwool Adrenline Trail Running Crews, and I am also going to repackage my insect repellent and sunscreen as suggested. I have decided to stay with the Gregory Pack I like the other suggestion especially the P-2 but this one only weights a little more, I am also going to stick with the Bibler Tripod Bivy instead of the Bipod. I think the extra room is worth the extra pound. Like I said I am not trying to get ultralight here just a light lighter than before. I have looked at the SMD Lunar Solo also. I like it a lot and had trouble deciding between it and a bivy. But I went with the bivy because of its sturdiness. The Lunar is very light and seems easy to setup. Anyways my new weight according to my list is 419oz or 26.2 lbs. Any other thoughts or ideas are greatly appreciated.

[Matt Cason]

I just want to thank everyone for their comments. Like I said I am just getting into Lightweight backpacking, previously my packs have weighed anywhere from 45 to 60 lbs and have given me back problems. I have made some changes to my list thanks to yall such as I changed the footprint for the bivy to a gossamer gear polycro, changed the Golite Wisp wind shirt to a Golite Ether (looks like it holds better in rain, let me know if I am wrong), I cut back my water being carried to 2L this is only because I sweat a lot and can easily get dehydrated so I like to have enough on hand, changed Vasque Sundowners to Vasque Velocity GTX XCR’s, and dont need the Wigwam socks and liners so that changed to Smartwool Adrenline Trail Running Crews, and I am also going to repackage my insect repellent and sunscreen as suggested. I have decided to stay with the Gregory Pack I like the other suggestion especially the P-2 but this one only weights a little more, I am also going to stick with the Bibler Tripod Bivy instead of the Bipod. I think the extra room is worth the extra pound. Like I said I am not trying to get ultralight here just a light lighter than before. I have looked at the SMD Lunar Solo also. I like it a lot and had trouble deciding between it and a bivy. But I went with the bivy because of its sturdiness. The Lunar is very light and seems easy to setup. Anyways my new weight according to my list is 419oz or 26.2 lbs. Any other thoughts or ideas are greatly appreciated.

[EndoftheTrail]

NM

[kevin davidson]

The XCR flavor of the Vasque Velocity is most probably too warm for summer time use in your neck of the woods. I would encourage use of a more breathable shoe at the expense of waterproofness. They generally dry out relatively fast,anyway.

The Ether is a more versatile windshell than the Wisp,because of the hood but although Wisp HP fabric is very water repellant,it will again, wet thru in a few minutes in a hard rain. It also is not as breathable as other windshells on the market. The Golite Helios windshell (a full zip) would give better venting options. I would concur with PJ that you might consider an Epic windshell for better rain resistance(still very breathable) or for a bomb proof waterproof breathable, the ID eVent jacket or the Golite Phantom gore-tex paclite jacket (often found on sale for well under list). You could also carry one of the lightweight inexpensive breathable rain jackets I spoke about in my earlier post to supplement a windshell and cover all bases.

Your new gear list is shaping up well. good luck!

[Matt LP]

I love my SMD Lunar Solo. I bought the Enhanced (new) version that came out about three months ago and have really enjoyed using it. This version basically eradicates any problems the older version had. I got the light floor version (23 oz.), and it has a great blend of very low weight, excellent rain protection, impressive ventilation, nice wind stability (even when swirling), plenty of room for one person (if you are no taller than 6’1″ or 6″2″, and a green color that really blends in. The footprint doesn’t take up a lot of space, and the design really shows great thinking. The vestibule protects well, is quite large, and is pretty uncommon for a shelter this light. All in all, you can’t beat this tent. I cannot say enough about it. Fantastic!

P.S. Once you set it up a couple of times, you will have no problems with this. I can put it up now in less than three minutes with no sweat.

[EndoftheTrail]

Mathew:

I have the “classic” version of the SMD Lunar. Curious about the bathtub floor, how many inches does the ‘bathtub’ walls extend up?

[Matt LP]

I just measured it right now. The bathtub floor comes up three inches. Works very well.

[EndoftheTrail]

Thanks.

[Mike Storesund]

Matt,
You may want to look at Mountain Laurel Design’s site and read what their team has to say about goretex shoes. In short, they take forever to dry out and they hold sweat in, which can lead to blister problems.

[Matt Cason]

wow thanks for the input, I will definately check their site out maybe I will go for the vasque veolicty’s without the goretex then.

[Matt Cason]

what do yall think about the Golite Ether as my wind jacket and the Golite Clarity as a rain shell?

[kevin davidson]

I don’t think that Golite’s waterproof/breathable technology is noticibly better than some cheaper
solutions on the market (unless you found a Clarity on sale). You might want to check out the Red Ledge Thunderlight ( under $50 at campmor and such places)and only slightly more weight than the Clarity.

[Mike Storesund]

While you can find lower cost items, if you like the GoLite label (which I do too), you might like to hear / read what Dr. J says about the GoLite Helios at Dr.J’s Lost Coast Report
I like the full zip and the hood. The only thing I would like included on the Helios would be some pit-zips for better venting, but then you would get more weight…

[Matt Cason]

I have decieded to go with the Helois as a rain jacket/wind jacket from what I have read it will suit fine for my needs as a rain jacket also. I also decided to not get the Bibler Tripod Bivy and instead go for the Tarptent Cloudburst 2, same weight more room and less condensation problems here in the southeast.

[Mike Storesund]

I like the Helios, it has worked well for me. I also have the Reed pants to go along with the jacket.
I’m surprised you chose the Cloudburst over the SMD Lunar, unless you intend to have a partner along. I believe the poles are potential failure points, that is why I use a flat tarp. Granted trekking poles can be just as much a failure point, but with a flat tarp you have so many more options.
Going from a 50 lb. +- pack to a 25 lb. +- pack is a great start. As you think more about it at the end of your adventures you will continue to find ways to improve your style and decrease your pack weight. Cutting out a half pound here and a few ounces there can be a little costly, but it doesn’t have to be if you shop smart. Only you can make the determination if the change is worth it. I started with that same 50 lb +- pack last year and I have now got my 3-day pack down to 18 lbs. with 2L of water and food included. I have found treks are much more comfortable and it is much easier to keep up with the 15-18 year old scouts. It is also easier to assist the younger scouts.
Good luck with your work in progress and enjoy as you enlighten yourself more.

[Matt Cason]

Clothing Worn
OR Nimbus Sombrero 3.4oz
Golite S/S top 4oz
Golite liet-weight briefs 2oz
golite baseline shorts 8oz
smartwool adreniline crew socks (2 pair) 4oz
Vasque Velocity Trail Runners 28oz

other items worn or carried
Leki Trekking Poles 14.8oz
Fox Mini 40 whistle 1oz
High Gear Summit watch 2oz
High Gear Trail Audio 512MB 4oz

other Clothing
Golite Helios for Wind/Rain 3.5oz
Golite Reed rain pants 4oz

sleep system
Tarptent Cloudburst 2 38oz
Gossamer Gear polycro ground cloth 1.3oz
Bozeman Mountain Works Hi-Vis Ti Stakes 1.42oz
Golite Feather bag 18oz
Thermarest Z-lite 8 segment 8.7oz

packing
Gregory Z Pack Large 56oz
250ci Bozeman Mountain Works Small stuff Sack .37oz
500ci Bozeman Mountain Works Medium Stuff sack .61oz
Equinox Ultralight Pack Cover 1.1oz

Cooking and water treatment
Vargo Jet-ti Stove 2.7oz
Snow Peak Trek 700 Ti Mug 3.3oz
aluminum foil windscreen .5oz
Vargo Ti Spork .49 oz
Bic Lighter 1oz
2 Platypus 1L bladders 1.6oz
Pur Hiuker water filter 11oz
Ursalight Bear Bag system 2.7oz
MSR Lite-lifters pot grabber 1oz

other essentials
Natl Geo Maps 1oz
Princeton Tec Scout headlamp 1.85oz
Scout replacement batteries .22oz
Adventure medical kits .3 2.21oz
Sparklight firestarter 1oz
Dermatone 23 paste sunscreen 1.26oz
insect repellant in dropper bottle 1oz
assorted toiletries (toothbrush, paste, hand gel, tp) in waterproof bag 4oz

Weight w/o Cumsumables = 241.03oz (15.06lbs)

Consumables
MSR IsoPro Fuel x2 8oz
Dry food 20oz/day 100oz
2L of water 70 oz

Total Skin out weight – 419.03 (26.18lbs)

[kevin davidson]

Which gives you a base weight (everything less what is worn and consumables) of less than 11 lbs. Not bad for one’s entry into backpacking light.
But ya gotta lose the MP3 player.

[Jordan Calicott]

Matt, I also live in the southeast. I looked over your gear list and I have a few suggestions:

1. The trekking poles that you are carrying (Leki Poles= 14.8 oz) are pretty heavy. If you want to lose a lot of weight, I would suggest buying the Gossamer Gear Lightrek poles. They only weigh like 5 oz PER PAIR!
2. Since the Helios is really a wind jacket, why not get some wind pants instead of the waterproof pants. Wind pants would be 2 oz lighter. Check out Montbell’s wind pants. Another option is to just drop the rain pants all together. I personally don’t care if my legs get wet but that is just me.
3. If it is just you going backpacking, I mean if you are tenting by yourself, why do you need a 2 person tent? Choose a tent that is 1 person and that will drop the weight considerably.
4. Do you really need an 8 segment sleeping pad? You can make it torso-sized by cutting a couple segments off of it. That could save you a couple of ounces. Better yet, buy a Gossamer Gear Thinlight Pad and save several more ounces.
5. If you want, buy the Gregory G pack. It is smaller and lighter. If you want an even lighter option, Check out the Gossamer Gear packs.
6. If it’s not going to rain, don’t take a pack cover. Gossamer Gear sells a waterproof, lightweight pack liner.
7. If you want a lighter stove, try buying an alcohol stove. They are much lighter, depending on which one you buy, and you don’t have to haul around those heavy canisters. If you want to go even lighter, buy some Esbit Tablets. They only weigh .5 oz each and each one burns long enough to boil a liter of water.
8. If you want a lighter utensil, consider picking up a plastic Taco Bell Spork (.1 oz) or a strong, plastic Boston Market spoon (.1 oz).
9. Instead of the Bic lighter, try buying the Bic mini (.5 oz) or buying some waterproof matches with a relighting birthday candle (.3 oz)
10. Your Pur Hiker filter is quite heavy (11 oz). Try buying either Aqua Mira (.5 – 1 oz) or Katadyn MP1 Tablets (hardly anything!)
11. If your mug has a handle, why do you need a pot lifter? Drop the pot lifter all together.
12. I live in Arkansas and I have never had a problem with bears. If you have also never had problems with bears, I would suggest dropping your bear bag system.
13. If you want a lighter option for lighting, drop the Princeton Tec Scout and buy a Micro Photon mini light (.2 oz)

All of these adjustments will save you a considerable amount of weight.

P.S.- Which part of the Southeast do you live in?

[Author]

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