BPL Forum Posting Policy Revision in Light of Recent SPAM Attacks

[Jerry Adams]

portlandhikers.org has similar spammers – seems like higher frequency lately

more moderators than just Rog

Four "clicks" to get rid of the spammer and all his posts

[Adrian B]

March 2007: http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=9398

Edit: I forgot I have to manually code http links….

[Adrian B]

Somehow despite the dated software, and obnoxious mid-thread ads, this remained one of the best forums I spend time on, because of the people. Now you've just shut a huge number of them out, with no short term prospect of return, and you hope this will raise the quality level?

I suggest rather than trying to extract money from reader generated content (forums), you take inspiration from the packrafting forums, and set up a separate independent forum with a "sponsored by BPL" link back to the pay site. See their (I think very admirable)forum mission and disclaimer.

Forums are not expensive to host, see http://www.activeboard.com/pricing.spark – starting at eight dollars a month (!) for 25,000 page views. You would probably get volunteers from here to help you with migration of the database.

[Ken Thompson]

+1 Adrian

Any guess as to how long this situation will last? Well the pay to post situation. We all know about the software limitations. They have been built in. Adrian pointed out the problems with that choice years and years ago.

[Mary D]

More spam is hitting the backpacking.net forum, too, but nothing like here. Again, we have lots more moderators as well as alert members. I received ten spam notices (an unusually large number) in my email a few days ago, but one of the moderators in an earlier time zone got them all. I tend to pick up the ones that post about now (after 9 Pacific time) when the eastern time zones mods have gone to bed. We also notify the site owner so he can ban the ISPs. That seems to slow them down for a week or two at least, sometimes longer. We do monitor new members, since a lot of our spam comes from folks who post half a dozen innocuous messages and then insert their commercial links. We usually can spot them from the beginning (poor English and ISPs from Asia), but since we welcome international members we can't ban them until they actually post spam. We don't wait, though, for those whose posts are complete gibberish and whose ISPs are identified as known spam sites (easily found by googling the ISP number).

[Thayne N]

Sucks to hear about the spam. Would love to see the forums opened up free of charge to non-members which is what got lots of us here in the first place…

If any improvement or change to the forums is to come, may I suggest improving the PM system? It's nice to have it archived and accessible, the current bpl setup is tedious!

[John Donewar]

We're still getting spammed despite the countermeasures that BPL has taken by one "aallenhua billaaa".

Party On,

Newton

[Mary D]

Just clicked on "recent posts" and the spam post is right after this one!

EDIT, LATER: Roger got it! Thank you, Roger!

[Roger Caffin]

We seem to still have some 'sleeper' registrations.
But with everyone's help, they are controllable.

Cheers (and thanks)

[John Donewar]

And there is still more coming through!

Look for "eelatevalri"

Party On,

Newton

[Ken Thompson]

Update?

Any realistic timeframe as to if this will be fixed? Or is this RJ's way of killing off the forum, the place where he gets criticized the most often?

I miss hearing from people who have given a lot to this community. Realizing though that since this is a business that those people who don't spend their money here are of no interest to the front office.

Would love to proved wrong.

[Michael Ray]

I suspect (and fear) some of those well-loved non-paying members while choose not to return even if it costs them nothing. Truly a loss to the community. The longer this goes on the more likely it will be as well.

[Roger Caffin]

> is this RJ's way of killing off the forum, the place where he gets criticized the most often?
Ah Ken, you are too optimistic.
My understanding is that there should be at least a partial fix within days.

A permanent general solution to spammers may take a little longer.

Cheers

[Ken Thompson]

A word from a BPLr with no financial stakes asked me to post his thought here, so I will.

Ken,

Since I am not able to post myself anymore would you mind posting this to the spam news thread on my behalf? If you don't wish to let me know and I will ask another paying member to do so. :)

I am sure I speak for a great many of the (currently) non-paying members when I say the way this is being handled seems more about encouraging membership fees and less about shutting out spammers. I have been a member of this community for years and have spent hundreds of dollars with BPL. Are you telling me that it is technically impossible to allow my account to post while not allowing accounts that are 10 minutes old from posting? For shame BPL. Either you are not being honest about your motives or you are not able to think through the consequences of your actions.

ChemE (Chris Lucas)

[Roger Caffin]

> Are you telling me that it is technically impossible to allow my account to post
> while not allowing accounts that are 10 minutes old from posting?

With some Forum SW, that is correct. They do not have any provision for running a script which can look at the account creation date. Yes, I know, antique SW, but that's what the ISP has.

I expect Ryan to post an update within a few days. I KNOW he and Ben (our SW guy) have been working on hard on a solution. I'll let Ryan explain soon.

Cheers

[Rob Lee]

It's interesting to see non-members complain they are being treated unfairly and paying members defending them. As long as this content is entertaining and informative to me I'll pay for the ride ($.07/day). Even though many are significant contributors and some are real characters, I really don't understand the attitude that I should be so enamored with non-paying posters that I should pay their way. Duh,this is a business. This reminds me of the majority of voters on Tuesday who want a seat on the wagon, and are perfectly willing to let me pull.

[Nick Gatel]

It's interesting to see non-members complain they are being treated unfairly and paying members defending them. As long as this content is entertaining and informative to me I'll pay for the ride ($.07/day). Even though many are significant contributors and some are real characters, I really don't understand the attitude that I should be so enamored with non-paying posters that I should pay their way. Duh,this is a business. This reminds me of the majority of voters on Tuesday who want a seat on the wagon, and are perfectly willing to let me pull.

---

Rob,

If you have ever read some of my posts in Chaff, most would say I am an extreme Capitalist. There are some (many?) valuable non-paying members who for reasons of their own don't care to subscribe. Their absense is a greater loss to BPL, than not being able to participate is a loss to them. And I know for some of these folks money is not the issue at all.

Maybe the message is a subscription-based forum is not the best business model. Maybe for RJ it is – that decision is up to him.

[Mary D]

Latest update from Ryan, posted this afternoon (Thurs 11/8) is here:
http://www.backpackinglight.com/cgi-bin/backpackinglight/forums/thread_display.html?forum_thread_id=70133&skip_to_post=599449#599449

[Richard Scruggs]

For myself, this website has been a great resource, even before Ryan set it up to host forums, and it continues to be a "special" place to learn a great deal about gear, skills, places, and people related to lightweight backpacking.

I don't recall which came along first after I discovered and started following BPL in its early years — adding the forums or requiring membership for access to some areas — but I do know for certain that, for me, the BPL website with or without forums has been worth the cost of paying for a subscription.

The forums have added value to the website, but they have also brought headaches, even more so lately with the spam.

Hope Ryan keeps BPL's website around a long time, with forums limited or otherwise, or even without forums. It's a truly great and unique resource.

(edited in the interest of brevity)

[Rob Lee]

Nick said:"Maybe the message is a subscription-based forum is not the best business model. Maybe for RJ it is – that decision is up to him."

Absolutely.

Some of the comments read like a script from a bad relationship you should end, but you don't because you want to salvage the "investment". Ryan seems like a smart guy. If he wants the BPL forum to survive it probably will.

[Author]

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