“Expert” List Needs Fresh Perspective

[Sam Haraldson]

I have been practicing UL backpacking techniques for about five years now and I feel very good about the following list. Does this mean it's perfect? No.

Below is the packing list I've used as my go-to-list this summer and it has worked smashingly. Regardless, I'd love to hear some fresh perspective on it.

This is a solo gear list designed for three-season camping in the Rocky Mountains of SW Montana (but transfers well to other locales). Temperatures will drop to around freezing at night and can be into the 90s during the day. Rain, snow, and wind are to be expected at any time during the trip. The length of trip this list is designed for is a weekend but this gear can easily be pushed into a thru-hike list with a slightly larger backpack.

[Brian Barnes]

I also use a button up the front fishing shirt (mine weighs 8.5 oz Columbia PFG) for my torso. I consider not bringing it each trip (instead using a light merino or cap l/s shirt) but really like my old fishing shirt in for its ventilation options, sun protection, durability, quick drying…

Have you considered using a torso baselayer that is lighter than 10 ounces (e.g. cap 2 l/s is 5-6 ounces)?

[Sam Haraldson]

That shirt is the one thing I didn't actually weigh myself and grabbed some info off a website so it could be wrong. I have used a sub-six ounce wool baselayer with great success. This summer I was appreciating the convenience that comes with a fly fishing shirt (pockets for temporarily storing items and the ability to open the front for ventilation). Thanks for the comments.

[CW]

Sam and I instructed the WS1 course together this Summer. I wore my UL merino hoody and Sam wore his white fishing shirt. I got eaten up by mosquitoes biting me through the fabric while Sam was unscathed. Needless to say, I went and purchased a similar shirt before I went out for the WT1 trip and didn't get bitten a single time. My opinion is that the heavier fishing style shirt is completely worth it during Summer trips in the Rockies.

I don't see anything I'd readily change. While there is plenty of stuff you could swap out, I'm not sure you'd get much out of the exchange.

[Brian Barnes]

Glad to hear you both feel the same about this type of shirt. I too have less bites with my PFG shirt. I take it a step further and treat it with permethrin. The rest of the list looks dialed in to me.

[. .]

Nix the bear spray and just throw your trekking poles at the charging bear, like Andrew Skurka did in Alaska:

"WHAT CAN YOU TELL US ABOUT BEARS?
Number of bears that I scared the crap out of, literally: 1. Quick story: It charged from across a braided river, I saw it last-minute and threw my trekking poles at it because I didn’t have time to reach for my bear spray, it was so rattled by the throwing and the yelling that it took a 90-degree turn and ran away. It pooped itself as it went."

Source: National Geographic Adventure Blog

[Mike Clelland]

7.2 pounds of base weight?

Anything you might do at this point is gunna be tiny tweaking and it would be hard to get that number to PLUMIT. To get the weight lower, you would need to leave stuff behind (like the 5 oz camera). Or, you would need to rein stuff with a scissor (the pack) or widdle things like the first aid kit down.

Q: Why is your water bottle 3.5 oz???

Also – You don't have Toilet Paper on the list, and it warms my heart.

Well done (as always)

M!

[John S.]

Use a smaller volume cookpot (I'm a snowpeak 600 user) is all I can contribute. I'd also, like Mike says, not take bear spray in Colorado, but I do not hike solo. I may if I did.

[Gordon Towne]

Not a huge weight reduction here (though as has been said, you're already pretty low) but I've started using one of these colgate wisps in place of the toothbrush/powder toothpaste I see on your list. I even used one on a week long trip earlier in the year, and it wasn't doing a whole lot towards the end, but is adequate for a weekend. I just find it more convenient and less messy. One weighs .08 oz on my scale.

[Mike M]

Sam- great looking list- one thing that jumps out at me is the 900ml pot- that's the pot I use when hiking w/ my wife, solo I use a 600 and more recently a 450

also if your looking at shedding a wee bit of weight there are some lighter cuben options to look at vs the trash compactor bag (clearly at a cost $)

might save a little weight on the bear bag possibly too

[Eric Fredricksen]

If your compass is really 1.9oz (is the lanyard on there? Suunto says that model is supposed to be 1.2oz), and you don't really use it much, you could save an ounce by switching to the less awesome Suunto A-2 without the lanyard.

You could also shave a couple ounces by switching to Lightrek 3 poles, eg.

Yeah, I'm grasping at straws here.

[Franco Darioli]

"Also – You don't have Toilet Paper on the list, and it warms my heart."

That is odd. I use it to clean my bum.
Franco
ok, OK , I do wash but that would spoil my juvenile attempt at humour

[Ole Saether]

Very good list!

About the headlamp, is that a Freedom Micro with necklace?

You have the conversion from pounds to kilograms wrong: 5.08 pounds is 2.30 kilograms and 7.26 pounds is 3.29 kilograms.

[Sam Haraldson]

> Clelland – The pack has everything shaved off it that I can. And I carry two water bottles, totaling 3.5 oz.

> John – The suggestion of a smaller cookpot is a good one. I do carry a 550 from time to time. I like the volume of the 900 as I can cook a LOT of food in it, and I like to eat a LOT of food.

Gordon – The Colgate Wisp is the toothbrush I'm using (Mike C! suggested them to me last year).

Mike Moore – I'm open to all suggestions here. And yes, more cuben is a definite possibility as I find funds for that sort of thing.

Eric – 'Tis okay to grasp. Like I said earlier I feel this list is pretty well dialed so the minutiae is what needs inspecting.

Franco – Toilet paper as insulation aka multiuse. Hmm… perhaps I should start carrying it again ; )

Ole – The Micro lamp is hung off a lanyard I wear around my neck at all times (along with whistle and firestriker. Thanks for the heads-up on the metric – I'll fix that up.

[D G]

Though using the cooking pot for your drinking mug (this assumes you are a coffee/tea drinker) is the lightest/minimalist setup I find personally that having a separate cup makes life simpler, even though there is a slight weight penalty.

The absolute lightest would probably be something like a styrofoam cup (you could even wrap your duct tape around it for more durability).

[Unknown abc]

Do this to your nightlight and save .12oz. :]

http://www.gossamergear.com/gossamergear/images/Holey_Nightlight.pdf

[Sam Haraldson]

Now THAT is an example of the kind of OCD behavior necessary to shave grams. Sweet!

[Dale Wambaugh]

I go with a Sierra cup for the mug/bowl option. I cook in a 550ml pot and use an REI Ti Sierra cup at 1.6oz/45g and holds 10.5oz/310ml.

I won't bother to extol all the virtues of the Sierra cup, but one function is to scoop water for pre-filtering before nuking it with a Steripen. I found myself adding various recycled containers for scoops that took up room and I found the REI cup on sale for $15. Goes on day hikes too.

Another way to squeeze more utility from your Ti pot is to add the Snow Peak "Hot Lips" silicone mouth guard. The weight is negligible and they are $6.95 pair. FYI, it doesn't work with the Sierra cup :(

[Unknown abc]

You could sacrifice the following:

knife -.5 (take a razor blade – .1oz.) = .4oz saved
wind jacket (drop and take only rain jacket) -4.1
camera -5.36
take just 1meter of duct tape. 2m is a lot. -.15oz.
two lights? just take the Micro. -.5

sunscreen -.5
lip balm – .34
replace these 2 with: dermatone stick [+.15oz worn, (https://www.dermatone.com/store/pc/viewPrd.asp?idcategory=5&idproduct=17) if you are wearing long clothing and a tilley, then you don't need much more sunscreen but for your ears, neck, and back of hands, right?] = 0.24 oz. saved

Total saved: 10.75oz.

[Sam Haraldson]

Evan,

Some of these are good suggestions but others I can't do.

Good:
knife -.5 (take a razor blade – .1oz.) = .4oz saved
duct tape. 2m is a lot. -.15oz.
lights? just take the Micro. -.5
sunscreen -.5 / lip balm – .34 : replace with dermatone = .2oz. saved

I carry the Swiss army knife because of the scissors/blade combo but I could definitely get by with just a razor. I'll look into Dermatone as that would not only mean saving weight but it would also mean taking less items.

Can't do:
wind jacket (drop and take only rain jacket) -4.1
camera -5.36

The wind jacket is a part of my overall clothing system and is a calculated piece of clothing necessary for warmth. The day I leave my camera at home to save weight is the day I quit backpacking ; )

[Unknown abc]

Replacing your ULA Amp with a ZPacks Zero (silnylon, size L -2000cu.in., 2.7oz.) would save you 7.9oz. for $55, assuming you can sacrifice water bottle pockets and other features.

OK that's all I can think of. Your base weight low enough now that with some of the tweaks other posters and I have pointed out, you'll really only end up shaving significant weight by dropping a lot of the smaller stuff, or spending many hundreds of dollars to save a couple ounces over what you already have.

-Evan

[Miguel Arboleda]

Great list, Sam! Can learn a lot from it.

I'm curious about the lack of a baselayer. Do you find that the Columbia Silver Ridge shirt is enough? I know that in most situations I rarely need more than my merino baselayer t-shirt and windshirt to get through the day in the summer at altitude, even in most rain and cold but don't you find that nylon fabric gets really cold and plasters your skin when wet?

Nothing that I can add to the comments already made. I might suggest a destructive and perhaps heartbreaking way to reduce weight… why not cut out the side and top panels of the the pack, leaving the back panel, the front panel for the add-on pocket, the side pockets, and the base. You might even cut out the entire front panel if there was a way to secure the contents. You could then replace your trash compactor bag with a waterproof sil-cordura dry bag and tighten the side cords around this to act as the pack bag itself. I've always wondered why people carried packs that had the pack material PLUS the waterproof liner. Sort of like the difference between a double layer and single layer shelter… You could save a lot of weight that way.

[Sam Haraldson]

In the early spring and late fall I will switch to my merino wool hoody rather than the Columbia shirt as it is more comfortable underneath a windshirt or rain jacket but for the majority of the summer I quite enjoy the airy-ness of the Columbia and that outweighs any other slight discomforts of it.

Skurka di something similar to what you're talking about for a trip he took last summer in AK. He chopped apart a Pinnacle (basically re-creating the BPL Arctic Pack). I like your attempt to think outside the box, but I question whether some of the logic is flawed (playing devil's advocate here – keep the brainstorming coming though). A trash compactor bag isn't sturdy enough alone to act as the outer layer of a backpack and replacing the trash bag with a heavier, dedicated waterproof bag would offset the weight saved by chopping the panels out of the pack. Thoughts?

[Mike Clelland]

Water bottle:

---

The thinner plastic on the "spring water" bottles (and NOT the beautiful SMART water bottle) weights less.

0.8 oz for a 1-liter sized spring water bottle. Two bottles weigh 1.6 oz. Saving you 1.9 oz!

[Mike W]

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