Aleve vs Ibuprofin

[EndoftheTrail]

"C'mon now, Ben, lighten up. Didn't you notice the little wink, wink smiley face at the end of my post?"

No, I didn't notice any winking at all. :)

[James McDaniel]

For me, ibuprofin doesn't do anything for me. My surgeon after my hernia operation got me hooked on naproxen. I haven't touched ibuprofin again.

+1 Aleve (Naproxen)

[Anonymous]

"No, I didn't notice any winking at all."

:(

[Roger Caffin]

Hi Kris

Sorry about the lecture, but you did ask!
Just my 2c.

Cheers

[Mark Verber]

I rarely use either, but when I take something it's aleve. Ibuprofin does nothing for me… Naproxen helps a lot. As was mentioned by others (and a friend who is a pharmacologist) a single, over the counter aleve dose (220mg) is unlikely get to an effective level. I have been told to take a loading dose (440mg). After that, the recommendation of 1 every 12 hours or so is effective.

–mark

[Unknown abc]

A good night's sleep usually does it fine, and Ibuprofen has always covered any headache or anti-inflammatory needs for me.

cheers

[cary bertoncini]

i haven't had stomach issues with the vitamin I, but naproxen made me sick a couple times, so I stay away from it now

it i'm really hurting i reach for the vicodin though

[Scott Toraason]

As an individual who has worked in the addiction field for years and until retired was a CDP (Chemical Dependency Professional), nothing mentioned in these posts remotely meet the ASAM (American Science Of Addictive Medicine) criteria for addiction.

I think we should be careful talking about addiction when we demonstrate no understanding what the word means.

[Mike W]

…

[jeffrey bennett]

For any of those that criticize the taking of Advil on the trail I hope they don't drink coffee or tea. If they do, then that would make them willfully ignorant of their own addiction. CAFFINE! Heck I bet some drink it twice a day. Now that’s a hypocrite, I mean an addiction, I mean…..you get the point.

For me I take advil and COFFEE as needed.

[larry savage]

Don't you just love threads covering medicine whether for anti-inflammatory, analgesic, or even sleep aids.
Putting aside the idea that perhaps our society in general doses up a little too readily the need for NSAIDs goes beyond just getting the muscle-skeletal,aerobic systems conditioned, and getting an old fashioned "good night's sleep".
Recovery time, acute injuries, and/or genetic or chronic medical issues can dictate the need for NSAIDs.
It baffles me how we reduce the discussion to either the living a pure life or drugging our systems to numbness camps.
Last Fall I did an extended mostly off-trail climbing trip in British Columbia and I used a pretty high level of Ibuprofen in my system to accomplish this. I was lean and conditioned but struggling with some nagging pain issues in the hip and groin. After discussing this with my physician we decided I should continue with the trip but being flexible to change destinations and goals. My physician is a runner and he did some kidney function milestones and we came up with a hydrating plan for the trip.
This turned out to be one of the best trips of my life with the balance sheet between taking a handful of NSAIDs versus lifetime experiences tipping way over into the holy crapola region.
A later diagnosis confirmed I had a necrotic hip joint and I had surgery to repair this and returned to climbing and backpacking this spring.
http://www.runthatbymeagain.com/?p=126, here is a link to a podcast relating to acute tubular necrosis of the kidneys from using NSAIDs which has proven fatal in runners.
There is also a possibility we have skipped over aspirin and natural anti-inflammatories like EFAs and herbs like ginger, Indian frankincense, and tumeric in trying to cherry pick from a list of two.
Next up – which religon do you take on your ultralight backpacking trips…

[Roger Caffin]

> A later diagnosis confirmed I had a necrotic hip joint and I had surgery to repair this

Which is a very good reason to not be surviving on pain relief pills. If there really is something the matter, don't hide it with pills; find it and fix it.

Cheers

[larry savage]

Though the original thread dealt with aches and pains my use of NSAIDs was for inflammation affecting my range of motion. I was pain free right up to last winter when I went skate skiing, this was the magic combination of movement that led to a further look.
Inflammation is not always synonymous with pain. Maybe one of the physicians around here can elaborate on this better then me, but NSAIDs treat inflammation and can have an analgesic effect.
There is a segment of our population with chronic pain that NSAIDs provide enough relief to live functional lives that include hiking and backpacking,regardless of personal feelings they should not be denied these experiences anymore then someone taking an antihypertensive medication or a treatment program for diabetes.

[Roger Caffin]

Er … ah … well …
Yes, I do take coffee 'as needed'.
:-)

cheers

[james lantz]

@ Ben

This is a good option for some people who may have GI upset with NSAIDS like ibuprofen. The acetaminophen & ibuprofen can be alternated every 6 hrs. The two meds work by two different mechanisms of action with acetaminophen working more on the central nervous system (recently it has been found that acetaminophen has some mild anti-inflammatory effects)& ibuprofen being an anti-inflammatory. Acetaminophen does not cause GI upset as ibuprofen does in some people. The different mechanisms of action have an additive effect which gives better analgesia in some people. (this is the rationale of Excedrin which combines aspirin, acetaminophen, & caffeine).
Also, if one is concerned about potential toxicity of the two meds, the combo therapy effectively cuts the daily dose of each by half which is especially important if the meds are taken regularly. Acetaminophen can have liver toxicity & ibuprofen can have kidney toxicity especially at higher doses.

[EndoftheTrail]

James, good to know. Thanks!

[Nate Meinzer]

Tylenol is only good for one thing–ruining your liver.

I've never noticed any significant pain reduction while using it, though I suppose it reduces fever, in the extremely unlikely chance a grown adult develops one.

I prefer ibuprofen, but always take it with a meal so as to avoid GI problems. (I've had an ulcer before and tolerate it just fine now, following this rule.)

Ibuprofen, aspirin, naproxen sodium, and of course opiates all do the trick. Too bad they cut most of the opiates with tylenol. Really is a shame, because Tylenol is only good for one thing. And it's not relieving pain.

[Roger Caffin]

Bear in mind that for some people all the NSAIDs are potentially fatal. They can cause anaphylactic shock and bronchial spasm. Translation: your airways swell up so you cannot breath. Very scary stuff.

Cheers

[Nate Belcher]

I'm confused, how is taking a couple ibuprofen on occasion to relieve some pain "bordering on addiction"

So if my doctor advises me to take an advil or two after playing 180 minutes of soccer or running 15+ miles I should quote "well Doc, I'm afraid I'll get addicted to popping advil every day. I've seen all those ads about drug addiction wrecking families and lives"??

Oh well, maybe you're a firm believer of holistic healing & eastern medicine.

Cheers Confucius

[Nick Gatel]

Nate,

That is a valid question. I think that our society and many medical professionals are often too quick to perscribe medication to "fix" things. I think it applies to psychology too.

I am not a holistic/nature healing type of guy. But I do try not to use any medication unless absolute necessary. Just my mindset, not paranoia.

[Larry De La Briandais]

I think the "bordering on addiction" was more a comment on taking these medications every day before the onset of any pain or other symptoms. That may not have been what actually happens, but that was how it sounded in come cases. I was thinking the same thing, and I take ibuprofen several times each month on average.

[Nate Meinzer]

You can't get addicted to aleve, ibuprofen, or tylenol. If you take it every day, that would be strange, but you wouldn't suffer any withdrawals when you stopped, and therefore, you wouldn't be addicted.

I've never even heard of anyone even claiming to be addicted to tylenol, etc.; it's just absurd.

[Josh J]

I would not touch either – or any drugs.

Are we so degenerate that we have to rely on pharmaceutical all our life?????? This is verging on addiction. Not me thanks.

Cheers

so if you have an infection that requires antibiotics, your not going to take them b/c they are a drug and pharmaceutical and bordering on addiction? even though they have saved millions of lives since their invention?

so if you lived in chronic pain every day, all day your not going to take anything? your going to “suck” it up

so if you have a heart attack, your going to say no to aspirin or any drugs to treat it and save your life?

so if you ever need surgery to save your life your going to tell the doctor, please don’t use any antibiotics, anesthesia one me b/c i don’t want to get addicted…..

so you or a child gets strep, doesn’t take any medication and because you don’t it goes to scarlet fever and then you die all because you wont’ take drugs…. ok let’s just live back in pre 1930s

so  i guess millions of people and as a whole human society are degenerate b/c we rely on chemistry to save lives, treat mental illness (which is a real thing) and in general make lives better

I don’t think the original OP was talking about everyday, it was for the opps i didn’t see that rock and i twisted my ankle and i still have 10 miles to the trail head…..

[Roger Caffin]

Replying to Josh:
It is not always that simple.

if you have an infection that requires antibiotics,
IF the infection really is bacterial, then fine, but too often people insists on antibiotics for viral infections. Doctors often go along with the demand just to appease the patient, but that breeds resistance.

if you have a heart attack, your going to say no to aspirin
I have to: aspirin sends me into anaphylactic shock. One may be better off with a low-dose statin in such a case.

Complex, ain’t it? I suggest it’s a problem with education. Modern drugs can be wonderful, if used properly. But what is ‘properly’? Sweeping statements either way often do not help as they ignore reality.

For the record: we take very pills of any sort. We survive just fine.
But what that means is that if I do take a Panadol (maybe once a year), it is really effective.

Cheers

[AK Granola]

Responding to the actual question, I have over time developed severe allergies to both aleve and ibuprofen and cannot take either without possible anaphylaxis. How to really scare your fellow campers! I can use aspirin now and then if I’m really aching, or Tylenol for headache. I do try to use them minimally, mostly because especially in the case of aspirin, I worry about developing another allergy and having none of these tools available to me when I really need them. I also carry an opiate med with me in case of severe injury. While I have never used it myself, I was able to give some (Tramadol) to another hiker who developed a herniated disk during our trip. It allowed her to walk out, instead of needing rescue. She was in agony and ended up in surgery several months later.

For general muscle soreness during hikes, which I feel every single day no matter how much I train or lift weights or prepare, and which I feel no matter how many days I’m on trail, I stretch, do yoga, do warmups, cool down in streams or lakes, and generally  make a point of taking time to rest my body. During the day, if I take a break, I’ll do “legs up the tree” pose. Elevating the legs really helps a lot. Self-massage also helps. All that takes time, so I am not a person to hike until bedtime; I need a few hours in camp to let things heal. A good night sleep is the other critical necessity for me.

If you do use the meds, I would say keep track of your use so that you are targeting it when and where you really need it so that it will continue to be useful.

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