Ditch Your Stakes: A Guide To Alternative Shelter Anchors

[Addie Bedford]

Companion forum thread to:

Ditch Your Stakes: A Guide To Alternative Shelter Anchors

[Frank Deland]

Great diagrams. Just a reminder, however, when one buries tie-outs in snow and tamps it down, one might be digging through ice in the morning to retrieve what ever was buried.

[Roger Caffin]

> when one buries tie-outs in snow and tamps it down, one might be digging through ice in the morning to retrieve what ever was buried.
Make that 'every morning' in Australia. It can be very hard to even get a plain aluminium angle stake out of the ice: the ice locks in very hard onto the surface of the aluminium. I have had to use an ice axe to dig out each stake. But there was no ice there in the evening!
Different places, different conditions, different solutions. Mike has lots of solutions.

[Michael Davis]

Quote: "when one buries tie-outs in snow and tamps it down, one might be digging through ice in the morning.."

I think mike's reference to 'flossing' addresses this concern. The idea being that you will be able to slip your line off the deadperson even when iced over.

This of course assumes that you have used a stray stick as a deadperson and not your hiking pole. Oops! Could be worse; could be your ice axe down there! :-)

[Michael Davis]

Hi Michael Martin,
Those Nite Ize Figure 9's look interesting. The small size is advertised for line diameters of 2mm to 5mm.

Have you, or anyone else, used these with the AirCore PRO Dymeema guylines sold on this site. I have that line and it is 1.7mm diameter.

[Michael Martin]

Michael-

Sorry, but I don't know if the Figure 9 will work with AirCore Pro…

Anybody tried this?

[Roger Caffin]

> I think mike's reference to 'flossing' addresses this concern. The idea being that you will be able to slip your line off the deadperson even when iced over.

There are no dead persons around here! Down with political correctness!

More to the point, out on the plains there are often no spare dead sticks on the surface – or under the surface. We have to use stakes.

Different places, different problems.

[Christopher Kuzmich]

Great article.

Have enjoyed Mike's various books over the years. Laughing and learning at the same time? Priceless!

Thanks,
Christo

[Andrew Lush]

I enjoyed your article, Mike. Very informative and useful – thanks a lot.

Just one point: For lots of little critters, rocks = home. If you pull up up a rock to use as an anchor, you are consequently destroying the habitat of a whole suite of insects and other assorted arthropods.

Just something else to add into the mix when considering "stakelessness" and our responsibilities with "leave no trace' principles.

[Mike Clelland]

I agree about the little critters in the topsoil around rocks. It's something I should have addressed. But, if there is top soil, it should be easy to get a tent-stake in there. So no need to annoy the little locals

The rocks I use are mostly only in sandy river bottoms (no critters) and in high alpine boulder fields (no soil, no critters).

And – I want to re-state that I actually DO take stakes out there. But, there are some places you just can't get 'em to work.

Once again – thanks for all the kind words about the article and the cartoons. It's fun for me!

peace,
M!

[Roman Dial]

We packrafters, especially up here in Alaska, are often too wet, cold, lazy, and un-sophisticated to bother with knots on twine and so use the same straps we use to keep our packs on the boats to keep the rocks and sticks strapped to the 'Mid. Instead of friction knots we use the friction slider.

We used spectra cord (2 mm?) on the Cuben Fiber Oware Mid for only a week before the rocks abraded through it and we had to go to straps.

The straps I am talking about are not fastex buckles (they pop under tension) but friction straps. While they do weigh more than 2-3 mm spectra they are functional for a broad array of things and work especially well for shoe/boot repairs.

BTW Mike, your article was great.

[Roman Dial]

Tying off to bicycles works well, too. Use the pedals and lay the bike away from the shelter.

[Margaret Snyder]

I used rocks as anchors up on Jackson Glacier this weekend and it was much more secure than I could have imagined. My tent was drum tight while my friend's flapped about like a circus tent.

[Paul Davis]

It may just be me, but in the Yukon I spend a fair amount of time camping on gravel bars on the river, and in abandonned gravel pits along the Alaska highway bike camping. Both places are great as they are not good bear habitat, have good visibility, and are noisy if Mr. Griz strolls by…

So I have taken to semi-permanently tieing mesh stuff-sacs to my tie-out loops on my Bibler I-tent, and filling those up with glacial rocks, sometimes with small stones as fine as marbles….

In fact, the only time there seems to be enough soil around for a tent peg is in a government campground!

[Hendrik Morkel]

Loved the article, Mike C! articles are among the best because of the great use of language (grooviness!) and the illustrations just rock. Thanks, I learned a bunch =)

[Shaun Carrigan]

How long would you cut the guys to be able to use these techniques?
Thanks.

[Tjaard Breeuwer]

Last night I had solidly frozen ground with 2"(5cm) fresh snow on top. It was in an open forest. I tied of to trees and shrubs, but as Mike mentioned, they were often in the wrong place.

None of the them were close enough to 'stake' the sides of the tarp all the way down to the ground, leaving the sides open and spindrift inside.

Any suggestions?

[Travis Leanna]

Tjaard,
If you have very sturdy stakes, like a simple nail stake (not the easton ones, the heads can break off) or MSR Groundhogs, they will pound into the frozen ground easier than you'd think. Find a good rock and hit the stakes as squarely as possible, and they'll go in. Not as easy as summer, but that's expected.

When you want to get them out, they'll be frozen in. Take your rock and give them a good solid tap squarely on the head, which will loosen them up. They'll slide out of the ground with only a bit of tugging. Not too bad. Just make sure they have good strong pull-loops on them.

[Roger Caffin]

Hi Tjaard

Under those conditions you may find that Ti wires will go in easily and hold well. Works for me.

As for spindrift under a tarp – that's what a winter tunnel tent is for ;-)

Cheers

[Ike Jutkowitz]

Hi Tjaard,
If there's even just a few inches of snow on the ground, I'll usually dig down to solid ground and bury sticks, with the guylines draped loosely around them. I pile snow on top (keeping the end of the guyline accessible) and compress it by walking repeatedly over the top. Then I let it sit for 5 minutes or so until it hardens. Once the snow has set, I use a slippery half hitch to tension the guylines, as Mike describes in his article. Where I live, there's always sticks and snow in the winter so I don't ever bring stakes.

[Tjaard Breeuwer]

Roger, what do you mean with 'Ti wires'?

[Roger Caffin]

Hi Tjaard

See photo at http://www.bushwalking.org.au/FAQ/FAQ_Pegs.htm#Pegs
The orange stake D in the 1st photo is a classic Ti wire.

They are commercially available, for instance
(painted) http://www.ultralightoutdoorgear.co.uk/vargo_titanium_flourescent_tent_pegs_-_6_pack.html
(plain) http://www.aerostich.com/off-the-road-again/campsite/tent-accessories/wire-titanium-tent-stakes.html

Caution: the unpainted ones are extremely easy to lose in grass or mulch! Get the orange ones!

Cheers

[Ken Thompson]

Bump of a classic.

[Ken Thompson]

Mike, you are missed.

[Eric Blumensaadt]

I knew and have used all methods except two – the V tunnel-with-line in the snow and the rock pile with a stick.

The rock pile is the cleverest!

[Author]

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