UL Tent: Big Agnes SL2 vs Big Sky Evolution 2P?

[Anonymous]

Ready to buy a 2-person double-wall 3-season tent. New to backpacking but want to start out right (i.e. light). Looking for ultralight 2-person so I can use it solo as well. The BA Seedhouse SL2 feels cramped for us. I haven’t actually seen the Big Sky Evolution 2P, but it’s a bit bigger and has lots more features (2 doors, 2 vestibules, 4 pockets, fly window, fly vents), and it’s lighter as well. However, the floor & fly are silny, and I have concerns about durability & waterproofness. Price is less important than comfort (roomy enough, dry) and ease of use. As a newbie, I want to enjoy myself and not regret sacrificing comfort for weight. 3rd choice is MSR Hubba Hubba or SD Lightning. Any help deciding would be appreciated. Thanks.

[David Ure]

You may want to consider the BA Sarvis SL2+. It is a hybrid single / double wall, under 4 pounds packed, and can fit two plus gear.

[EndoftheTrail]

I own a BA Seedhouse 2 SL and love it — but always for solo use! I too crave space and comfort, and this tent strikes the right balance in terms of ample space (for one), light weight, and excellent design/quality.

For two people, however, I would highly recommend a bigger tent with two doors/vestibules. No direct experience with Big Sky Evolution 2P, but the specs look very impressive, and BackpackingLight.com wrote a very positive review on this tent just recently.

If I were looking for a fairly spacious but lightweight tent for two, this tent would be on my short list.

[paul johnson]

>> “want to start out right (i.e. light)

not much info regarding conditions of use (altitude, rainy+humid, etc). went the same route as you’re planning & ended up spending too much money further ‘lightening up’. my suggestion is to start even lighter. here are three single-wall options (you may just end up there if/when you decide to lighten up even further) which are appropriate for a wide range of conditions, but not all conditions. I own option 2, and find it far superior, even from a condensation standpoint, to other single-wall tents i’ve used in the past. There really is no comparison, IMHO:
1) Six Moon Designs Europa ’05, with a heavy floor is ~37oz if i recall correctly
2) Six Moon Designs Lunar Solo ‘e’ – yes…, you said 2person, but the SL2 has only 28sq ft (i owned one & sold it) + a ~5.5sq ft vestibule. The Lunar Solo ‘e’ is 27.5 sq ft+a 10sq ft vestibule. So, they’re almost the same size. This weighs ~26.5oz if memory serves. BTW, this shelter has recently won top honors in its category in the BackpackingLight Lightitudes awards.
3) Henry Shire TarpTent Squall2. 2lbs or so – never really looked into it to know for sure, just read/skimmed it in passing, so weight may be a bit off.

A final choice is a tarp with bug netting. An example would be the GossamerGear SpinnTwinn with a bug net insert which you can purchase from GG or elsewhere (there are several options for purchase). This should end up weighing about 16-18 oz, incl. the bug netting, stakes, and guyline.

If you can’t find any/all of the items mentioned above, post back, & i will reply with URLs (“links”) to the products.

EDIT:
agree with BT’s comments. option 2 is for solo use only & 2person in an emergency/survival situation. not sure if you’re intending to use a 2person for solo use (many people do) or for 2person use. i should further clarify, that i sold the SL2 for weight and packed size issues, not performance issues. the two additional stake points required due to the single-pole design (functioning as a “spine” for the tent body) i didn’t like, but it was understandable given the pole design. SL2 is “freestanding” which generally isn’t necessary, but does make pitching on some surfaces a bit easy. also, when first lightening up, i felt double-wall was the way to go for condensation reasons (live & hike in New England). however, the above mentioned 3 single-wall shelters should work well based upon my experience with the SMD Lunar Solo ‘e’. some dbl-wall tents, in my experience, get hotter and muggier inside than the Lunar Solo ‘e’ since when “zipped-up” for storm conditions. with little breeze, air exchange is greatly reduced than with the vestibule unzipped and/or the fly partly rolled back. the above mentioned shelters should have better air flow when “buttoned up”, so to speak.

[EndoftheTrail]

Given that OP seems to share my bias against overly cramped space…

I mentioned above that IMHO, the Seedhouse 2 SL is rather suboptimal for two (i.e. it’s do-able, but cramped). Well, the Lunar Solo will be even worse! Sure, the Lunar is almost the same in terms of square footage, but the walls slope down much more, reducing headroom severely for two people. I feel sorry for the person who gets to sleep on the far side, away from the door.

Both Six Moon Designs Europa and Henry Shires tarptents (Squall 2 or Cloudburst 2) are well worth looking into. Again, for two people, I would recommend against the Lunar Solo.

[Anonymous]

Thanks for all the feedback. In terms of conditions, I’m in Seattle and most of my trips will be in the Cascades and possibly Olympics. Planning to do Wonderland and Timberline trails next summer. No interest in winter/snow camping. Roominess for two is definitely paramount, as is avoiding condensation and rips/tears in the fragile (?) silnylon floor. Any advice on how to avoid unnecessary damage to this lightweight but vulnerable material? I will look into the Six Moons Europa, but it may be too complicated for me (I’m a beginner).

[David Ure]

Have a look at this:

http://www.campsaver.com/product.php?cid=224&pid=tsv2sl

Alternatively, these have proven quite popular:

http://www.campsaver.com/product.php?cid=377&pid=12131

and these:

http://www.rei.com/online/store/ProductDisplay?storeId=8000&catalogId=40000008000&productId=47696586&parent_category_rn=4500457&vcat=REI_SEARCH

[paul johnson]

Europa 05 should be very easy to pitch – even easier than my Lunar Solo ‘e’ (which is easy to pitch). BTW, i find the Lunar Solo ‘e’ easier to pitch than the Seedhouse SL2 (which, BTW, also is any easy shelter to pitch).

In case that you have read any older reviews of the original Europa, any deficiencies in the original Europa design have been addressed and rectified in the Europa ’05.

Get the standard/heavy floor in the Europa ’05. It will probably be better for your conditions.

Here’s a link to a good, very light ground cloth and to a link to the SMD Europa “cut-to-fit” ground cloth:
GossamerGear Polycryo Ground Cloth

SMD Europa Tyvek Ground Cloth

[EndoftheTrail]

If you feel strongly against coming into contact with condensation, then you should probably veer toward “double wall” tents (like the Big Sky Evolution 2) and away from any single wall tent (like Europa or H.S. tarptents).

Do the following to help prolong the life of your tent’s fragile flooring:

1. Always inspect your campsite with care. Remove stones, twigs and other small but rough or sharp objects. (Do balance this with the “Leave No Trace” philosophy).

2. Always use a ground cloth to help protect your tent floor, and to keep it cleaner and drier. I use 2-mil plastic sheeting, which you can find in any hardware store (or Wal Mart). A $2-3 roll will provide enough for 2-3 groundsheets (one sheet alone will last you many camping nights).

[Richard Nelridge]

Though I have never seen the Europa 05, the design is a hybrid single wall double wall tent. The lower 2/3s of the tent is mesh that keeps condensation and contact with the outer wall material to a minimum reducing the likelyhood of your sleeping bag touching any condensation. Only the upper third of the tent is a single wall silnylon material.

[D G]

I own and have used the Europa 05. It’s a great tent and extremely easy and fast to pitch. It is almost like a double wall tent, with only the top portion single wall. Great ventilation.

I can answer any questions you may have.

[paul johnson]

Lunar Solo e & Europa 05 have a minimum of 15″ of netting b/f the single wall starts. This greatly reduces coming into contact with any condensation. Ben has some good comments on site prep & inexpensive (perhaps slightly heavier???) ground cloth.

[Anonymous]

Thanks again everyone for the additional information and resources. The plastic groundcloth is an excellent idea. I still have a nagging concern about silnylon as a fly material. Is it actually waterproof? If I end up getting rained on for a weekend, will I stay dry?

[Richard Nelridge]

The Silnylon should stay waterproof, but needs seam sealing. The problem arises for maintaining waterproofness of the silnylon floor when the overlying per square inch of force (head of pressure) (as when lying on it) forces the water through the fabric. That is why some opt for the heavier floor while others put a waterproof material underneath the tent floor.

[EndoftheTrail]

I wouldn’t worry about the waterproofness of silnylon — once the seams are properly sealed. I have a Lunar Solo, and when we had the torrential rains earlier this year in southern Cal., the tent passed with flying colors. As for the floor, that’s where the issue of pressure comes in (i.e. sitting on a tent laid on damp ground can force water to seep through the floor). I still opted for a thin flooring since I know I’ll always use a lightweight plastic sheeting. Opting for a heavier floor plus plastic sheeting seems like an overkill (to me anyway).

My Lunar Solo also have mesh openings all around. Still, even in relatively dry southern Cal., I’ve experienced condensation. I’ve also read multiple user feedback about condensation inside Henry Shires tarptents — even though they are excellent, well-ventilated tents. It’s the nature of the “single wall” beast.

Putting in perspective, the condensation is really more of a nuisance than any kind of a danger. For me, I just wipe the ceiling/walls dry before getting up so I don’t brush against the moisture. No big deal.

But, if it’s a big deal to OP, then he/she should focus more on double wall tents (although the Europa, being a hybrid design, may be an exception).

[paul johnson]

heavy floor + gnd sheet = overkill

even though i suggested this, i would generally agree with Ben. however, the original poster is a “newbie” and is currently not as skilled in site prep as a more experienced person – hence my suggestion of both. the suggestion of both was not for “waterproofness”, but to help protect the floor from punctures if the site is not prepped properly. i should have been clearer on this point when i mentioned that in my prev. post. my apologies for misleading anyone. additionally, i’d rather err on the side of caution when giving advice, as it appears the other respondents have done also (i.e. err on the side of caution and give good advice).

[EndoftheTrail]

Good point, Paul.

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