Crater Lake Snowshoe Video Essay

Loved the videos and the gear breakdown. I especially liked the conclusion with the gear review.

Looked like a fun trip, thanks for the report!

I really liked the video format of this report; especially the equipment being utilized and the post trip comments. We can all learn from "what goes wrong" as much as "what goes right".

How did Mike fair regarding his sleeping bag moisture accumulation?

Thank you for a fun and informative report!

>> How did Mike fair regarding his sleeping bag moisture accumulation?

Hi All-

This trip was great fun. The ranger at Crater Lake told us that we were the (at the time) only group to successfully make it around the lake this year. And, he was amazed that we did it on snowshoes in three days in those conditions. I credit Darin with his ability to do the lion's share of the trail breaking and drag my old bones through the snow.

I had only 20 grams of accumulated moisture in my sleep system…but my pack was a lot heavier than Darin's. ;)

The forecast was for heavy snow and high winds, and I wasn't expecting long-mileage days, so I packed fairly heavy:

While hiking, I mostly wore a lightweight synthetic zip-T (Golite C-thru) under a Paramo Quito shell. On my legs, I had C-thru tights under Arcteryx Alpha SL pants, with REI Spring Gaiters. The system absorbed very little moisture and vented superbly.

I used a Nunatak Arc quilt for sleeping over an overstuffed Nunatak Skaha Plus jacket with BPL Cocoon 60 pants. I was very warm — I didn't even need the quilt until the wee hours of the mornings.

My shelter was a Stephenson Warmlite 2C tent, which I very highly regard. It was kind of overkill for the conditions we actually had, but would no doubt have been awesome if it turned out windier or snowier. (We had only an inch or two of snow and occasional gusts up to 30 mph on the second night.)

-Mike

>> plus 20 oz of water in the sleeping bag.

I think Darin misspoke about his bag weight. I think the starting weight was 32oz, which would mean 10 ounces of accumulated moisture, not 20. (But I'll leave it to Darin to confirm.)

>> What is the feeling about skis vs snowshoes? For a 33 mile on-road trip, wouldn't skis be a more efficient way to travel? I note Bob G's 48-hour trip on skis.

The "on-road" part is a bit misleading. There were many places where the wind had swept the snow into "waves" up to 10 feet high, sometimes with a knife edge on top. In other places, the path of the road was obscured due to drifts and we even resorted to GPS navigation. Plus, the avy detour we did involved a lot of switchbacks through thick mixed conifers. For 80% of the trail, skis would have been much more efficient (I'd guess 50% more efficient), but for the remaining 20%, skis would have been very difficult without skins and superb ski skills.

>> bigger Perpetuum bottle meaning less snow melting.

I think Darin just wanted the capacity to carry more water to avoid stopping to melt more mid-day.

>> Ridgerest

My pad was a 3/4 length Ridgerest Deluxe. It worked flawlessly. (I prefer not to mess with inflatables in the winter. But, you'll notice in the video that I had to strap it to the bottom of my pack as it takes up HUGE volume.) ;)

Excellent video essay Darin! What mapping software did you use?

Thanks Devin. I used National Geographic TOPO!. I highly recommend it.

Bob, don't worry about sounding critical, these are good questions. As Roger said, both Mike and I could have saved weight if we would have shared a tent and stove. But I wanted to try out the bivy in those conditions and Mike claims I snore loudly (which I think is an outrageous lie) so he wanted to be able to sleep far away from me; therefore, we went independently self contained.

Yeah, that's the rub right? Looking at the weights after the trip, I would have come out even if I would have slept in my Black Diamond Mega Light instead of the bivy and would have been warmer and safer to boot. There are always going to be condensation issues with bivy sacks–especially in those conditions. Mine came from sweating and breathing inside the sleep system. Mike is the expert on this subject, but I think the problem was that the due point was somewhere between me and the outside of the bivy sack so the water vapor from my body condensed inside the bag.

I like climbing into a bivy sack better than setting up a shelter after a long day so I'm looking at a vapor barrier solution. After the trip, I put a four-ounce Adventure Medical Kits Emergency Bivvy (sic) in my sleeping bag and slept inside my Marmot bivy. The moisture that collected in my sleeping bag during the night was negligible and I think most of that came from my breathing. Of course my base layer that I slept in was wet so the next experiment is to see if I can safely/comfortably live with that in the woods.

I've traveled on various types of skis and snowshoes during winter trips and I've decided I prefer snowshoes. While we were climbing up the hill out of the Kerr valley, I was thinking to myself, "Man, I'm sure glad I'm not on skis right now."

Mike was right about the larger Perpetuum bottle: the extra water weight would be worth not having to stop as frequently on the trail to melt snow. On this route there was no running water to be had and the lake was inaccessible so melting snow was our only option.

The RidgeRest worked out great. That's all I use on the snow, but it has to be the deluxe thickness. I don't recall seeing any melt water under the pad in the morning.

Roger wrote:
"But, I would have been collecting water from creeks and the lake along the way for sure! Why burn fuel to melt snow with water nearby?"

In the middle of winter, there are no visible creeks. The lake is visible, but it is absolutely impossible to reach. Melting snow is the only source for water.
–B.G.–

It's nice to be seeing more snow camping trip reports and this one was nice, thanks!

Regarding the bivvy condensation … yeah, breathing anywhere but directly to the outside will be problematic. Roland Turnbull (Book if the Bivvy) doesn't pretend to have have technique that'll avoid moisture problems with waterproof/breathable bivvies without gear drying opportunities every couple days.

But breathing to the outside (sleeping with face exposed) in snowing conditions is a tough sell. A microtarp might be useful but it does mean the hassle of setting up the tarp.

Vapor barrier? I recall only one temperature data point being mentioned in the video (30-40 degrees F) … that would be stretching my comfort threshold for vapor barrier use. But I tend to need colder temps than many so you should definitely do your own testing.

Excellent trip. We cannot have too many trip reports, and the terrain looks fantastic. Pretty cool to be on or near a "road" and have such a wilderness experience.

I'm rather taken aback by how much clothing you had! I do pump out a lot of heat, but can't imagine wearing that much wool on the move unless it was well below zero. I can't help but think that you must have stopped for the night with a lot of moisture in your torso layers that ended up in the down bag.

I'd say something similar about the Precip jacket. In my experience no WPB jacket comes close to venting properly below freezing, and every time I've worn one on the move I sweat like mad.

Darin, what software did you use to show your route on the map in the video.

Great job on videos!

Nice work Darin. Thanks for sharing. Great videos.

About source the bag moisture – are you sure your aim was accurate into that P bottle? : )