Yosemite help for NEWBIE please

[Wendy C]

I am new to posting here so I hope I am doing this in the right place.  My 3 girlfriends and I are starting from Happy Isles Trailhead to Little Yosemite to half dome (have permits) to Sunrise Over Clouds Rest to Little Yosemite Valley on a four day trip.  At the end of that four days my friends will leave and my husband and adult son will join me (my understanding is that they can use my permits as long as I am the lead on it).  At that point we will only have from Sunday morning to Tuesday mid day.  I am looking for good suggestions of routes to take my husband and son that doesn’t backtrack over ground I have covered but will be awesome.  I am open to backcountry for those nights or just staying somewhere and dayhiking out from the camp spot.  Any advice for this newbie?  Please?

 

[Baosito]

I don’t know when you are going to start your hike, but if the condition is allowed, you can continue on the JMT southbound and head to Tuolumne Meadows and check out Lyell Canyon. That’s probably my favorite section after entering YNP from Ansel Adams Wilderness. If Tioga Rd is open, you can always hop on the shuttle (YARTS) from Tuolumne Meadows back to the valley for a few bucks rather than walking back (if that’s what you prefer).

[Wendy C]

That would be a great plan I think!

[jscott]

If you’d like to spend a night out, Lyell Canyon is a flat walk in from Tuolumne meadows for six or seven miles. You could nab a campsite there and then dayhike up towards or to Donahue pass. This is wonderful country. You could then return to Tuolomne or spend a second night out. OR, loop up to Vogelasang from the campsite six miles into Lyell canyon and then out on day two. Or overnight a second night at Vogelsang. or just hike in and out to Vogelsang from Tuolumne meadows! there’s plenty of very easy and delightful country off trail going up and east from Vogelsang lake–no worries, no possibility of getting lost! Of course this assumes the snow is melted by then.

And yes, hiking back down to the valley from Tuolumne by any number of routes is delightful and pretty easy, as it’s mostly down hill after an easy up out of the meadows.

 

[Matthew / BPL]

You are not allowed to trade people out on a permit. Everyone has to enter at the same trailhead on the same day. Your husband and kid would need their own entry permits to join you from whatever trailhead they intend to enter from.

[Wendy C]

hi, i called and talked with two different people who said I could as long as I was the lead on the trip. I will call to check again. Thanks!

[jscott]

I’m thinking that Wendy’s right here and as long as the number of folks on the permit remains the same it’s alright. I mean, does the park even list the names of all those entering on each carried permit, or just the lead name and the number in the group? That said, I usually hike solo there, so I could be wrong.

Wendy, you guys could also just day hike out of Tuolumne meadows (you can stay in the backpackers campground without a permit for a night or show up at the office at 2 or 3 pm–I forget the time now, it’s posted–and try to nab a cancelled campsite at the large campground, again assuming it’s open!). Day hiking up to Cathedral lake is magical. You pass right under Unicorn Peak. Even just strolling a mile in towards Lyell to Twin Bridges and returning and going up to the top of Lembert dome would make for a fine day if you’re feeling relaxed.

https://www.nps.gov/yose/planyourvisit/tmhikes.htm

[BlackHatGuy]

The FAQ page on NPS.gov only mentions not being able to swap out the trip leader, it says nothing about swapping out those with the trip leader. See here: https://www.nps.gov/yose/planyourvisit/wildfaq.htm

[Matthew / BPL]

So let’s say I had a Happy Isles permit with a Donahue exit for three people. Are you all saying that I could hike from HI to Reds Meadow with two friends and then they could exit and two more friends could continue on with me from Reds to Piute Pass?

Or that I could hike solo for the first couple days and have a couple friends hop on at Tuolumne Meadow?

If so, this contradicts my understanding of how wilderness permits work but it would not be the first time I was wrong about something! Wendy, I apologize if I am in fact wrong and I’m glad you are talking with rangers about this plan. I hope you have a nice trip.

[DWR D]

pretty sure Tuolumne Campground is close this season for construction of improvements… and possibly next season also

[jscott]

Mathew, yes, the time frame of a permit isn’t variable. but as long as the number of people admitted on a permit over a given time frame remains the same, even if the particular people swap out–i.e. if you have two friends for two days and they go off, and two others take their place for the next 3 days of a five day permit–there shouldn’t be an issue.

[Bruce Tolley]

I guess I am as puzzled as Matthew. I always thought the backcountry Rangers had the right to ask the see the permit of anyone in the backcountry that looks like they are there for an overnight.  If you are swapping people in and out of a group, some people are entering and leaving without physical possession of a permit.  But since the main purpose of permits is management of access (and minimizing human impact and human traffic), perhaps it all is explicable.

[DWR D]

The way to do this is you make a copy of your permit. The ‘swap hikers’ coming in without the leader show that copy of the permit if asked. I have never seen the rangers ask for I.D. But if they figure out the leader is not with you and ask, just say the leader is faster and up ahead. I don’t know if this conforms strictly to the rules, but it does work. Honestly, I don’t think the rangers car about names, they just check that the hiking dates are right and number of people is not more than on the permit.

[Matthew / BPL]

I called the Inyo NF White Mountain Ranger Station in Bishop this morning because Yosemite had not opened yet and because I didn’t want to deal with their hold times. I spoke with ranger Mary who hadn’t heard of a setup like this before and discussed it with other rangers present in the office. They came to the conclusion that this is not the intent of the permit but that it should be acceptable given that the leader would be present for the whole trip and the other member names are not listed so there would be no enforcement mechanism unless people were hiking in without the leader or more people were present in the group at any moment than the permit allowed.

I stand corrected and apologize for stating things in a black and white manner in my first response. This seems like a grey-area issue but Inyo confirmed a plan like Wendy’s works in their jurisdiction, at least.

I learned something!

[DWR D]

One problem for the ‘swap hikers’ is that if they are headed up the mist trail and a ranger looks at the permit, it will show a start date several days before. One thing about the permits for all the parks (I think all), is that you have to start the day designated as the start day on the permit. Not sure how they could explain that to a ranger… went down to get something from a friend who hiked it in part way??? dunnno

[Matthew / BPL]

The OP mentioned not backtracking which I think means they start at A, the friends exit and family enters at B, and then they end at C (or perhaps A). This is how I explained it to the ranger I spoke with.

[jscott]

I also had a ranger or two tell me that after I enter at the designated trail head, I could alter my route. I jsut needed to be out on the posted day. I seem to recall that I could also exit at a different trailhead. But I was hiking solo and rangers tend to be more cavalier with ‘only’ one hiker. If I was part of a large group, maybe rangers would be more strict about staying with the stated itinerary.

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