Winter Boot with removable Liners

[Sean T]

I am looking for a replacement for my usual winter footwear for the upcoming winter season.  I currently use Salomon Ultra 3 GTX with Drymax socks for snow use where I will need to deploy crampons (Petzl Leopard FL) and or snowshoes.  They work fine down to 20F but start to get damp after higher output sections in deep snow with gaitors or when I have to bump up the sock insulation in colder temps.

I also wear them for bikepacking in cold rain and will try some winter bikepacking this season as well.Pedaling with them isn’t so great because of the hard rubber sole lacks grip on my platform pedals and sustained high output wets them out because of the increased blood flow to my feet.

I was thinking of the Arcteryx Acrux2 which has a Vibram sole designed for high altitude approaches and I think this would be great on the bike, they are heavier than I would like and only available in 10.5US which is a half size larger than I would choose for a winter boot (sized up for me is a 10US).  The other option I have looked into is the Bora2 which I can get in my size, 9.5 or 10, has a removable liner which I really like the idea of.  The Bora2 is even heavier at around 19oz per boot but for deep winter use I would take the hit if the breathability, weatherproofing and grip were optimal.

I know the Arcteryx footwear has very mixed reviews about the fit and design so if there are any other lightweight alternatives with sticky rubber, removable liner I’d love to hear about them.

I have also looked into the Innov8 Arctic Claw 300 with ice spikes (bad for biking but great for approaches forgoing the need for microspikes) combined with a drymax liner sock, Lorpen Primaloft mountaineering sock and Rocky Goretex sock.  This would be the nimblest option but the spikes on the bottom might be problematic with pedals and the fit with 2-3 layers inside the shoe and an insulated insole could cause issues.

I only wear synthetic boots so please no leather suggestions.

Typical winter trips are in SoCal – San Gorgonio, Domeland, Movaje

Upcoming International trips that I am considering – Iceland (summer)  Chile (various bikepacking options)

Arctic Claw 10oz + Rocky GTX liner

Salomon Ultra 3 Mid GTX 16oz

Arcteryx Bora2 19oz

Thanks for any input!

[Eric Blumensaadt]

Cabela’susually has the largest selection of winter boots available. (But since el cheapo Bass Pro shops bought them out things may have changed.)

REMOVABLE liners are the key to winter camping B/C they can be removed to put in the foot of your sleeping bag to be warm in the morning.

BUT… you absolutely must use a Vapor Barrier Lining (VBL) to keep that liner dry and thus warm. My best VBL is 3 mm closed cell diver’s sox, specifically US Divers brand B/C they are factory seam sealed and have a Left and Right foot which keeps them from having excess material that may bunch at the toes. Wear thin poly liner socks with divers sox. 

[Edward John M]

Have you looked at heat moulded liners such as the Intuition?

An Intuition liner is as warm as 2 pairs of heavy socks plus liner sock

https://intuitionliners.com/shop/denali/

[Sean T]

I checked out the Intuition liners but they seem to only work with plastic mountaineering boots or ski boots.  I’d like to lighten by footwear or not increase the weight too much as the main issue is moisture management and an appropriate sole that can take strap on crampons as well as work with platform pedals bikepacking.  An example that I just saw was the Walkabout Michelin Wic GTX it however doesn’t have removable liners.

I don’t do any full-on mountaineering routes, multi-day backpacking

Have you used the liners in “regular” hiking boots?

[Edward John M]

No but I have worn them in US army ICW boots as a replacement for the Thinsulate liner. People do wear them in slipper type mukluks tho. They are meant to go in boots with no padding but your options are limited with synthetic boots until you get to HA plastic stuff but personally I would not use crampons of any type except on mountaineering boots, spikes and chains for LW boots would be safer.

Even flexible crampons need a far stiffer sole than most LW synthetic boots usually come with, it is asking a lot of a boot to do both bike and crampons

[Edward John M]

I should point out however that I do very little winter walking, I am a cross country skier and spent most of my snow time in Scarpa T-2 Telemark boots with those Intuition liners as the factory default

[Sean T]

Thanks for your input.  Definitely a big ask though the Arcteryx Bora2 would fit the bill if the sizing works with my feet (narrow).  Approach shoes are great for bikepacking due the sticky rubber on the bottom.  I have been happy with my Petzl Leopard FL crampons on the Salomons as I’m doing any front pointing or mixed climbing.  Side hilling across frozen sections and icy ridges are fine and I would even be comfortable with a stiff approach shoe in this context if I could bolster the insulation.  The Salomons are not good on the bike though and due get wet after a day which is why I’m searching.

I have gone through all approach boots of the brands I know and have taken a look at their offerings but many are much heavier than what I would want.  La Sportiva have some highly rated approach boots with great sticky sole and I’m sure they would be warmer than what I have but I’m not sure I’d solve my problem of day 2 and 3 getting wetter and wetter from the inside without using a VBL.  The temps in SoCal just don’t seem to warrant it IMHO but I could be off the mark.

[Eric Blumensaadt]

@ Edward John,

I use Scarpa T3 boots with my backcountry skis. And yeah, the liners are “relatively” warm but still get wet with sweat and, once again, I use 3 mm diver’s sox with thin poly liners, Much warmer that way.

Remove the liners from your boots then “telescope” the boot shell tops over one another and leave in the vestibule. This keeps spindrift snow out of them.

Place the liners in the foot of your sleeping bag at night along with the inside-out diver’s VBL sox. Put the stanky poly liners in a Ziplock freezer bag, don fresh liners and heavy “sleeping socks”. In the morning your will have nicely warm liners and VBL sox. Yes, one pair of poly liner socks per day. You will thank me.

[Edward John M]

I just noticed the post Eric

The T3 used a totally different liner to my newer T-2 boot, the T-3 has a sewn open cell foam as the padding and insulation; the Intuition is a heat mouldable closed cell foam that is also a VB boot, once they are moulded to your foot with your chosen liner sock it isn’t possible to change your sock combination. For me that is the Injinji toe sock in the ski boot version layered under an UL synthetic ski boot sock. I do carry a spare set and try to change daily and rinse/wash when possible.

[Alex Fedorov]

Definitely either try Acrux boots before buying or make sure you can return… They are narrow and have a very high instep – I have heard great reviews from people whose feet they are actually fit, but when I tried them at the Ice Fest last winter it was a complete no-go for me, I did not even bother borrowing a pair for a demo. And I tend to be comfortable in La Sportiva and Scarpa climbing boots and both brands are known to have a narrow last. If you want more of a backpacking/light mountaineering boot take a look at Salewa GTX Crow – i have a pair and they are super comfortable. I dont bikepack – so cant suggest anything more appropriate.

 

[Will Elliott]

It’s an interesting conundrum. Living in Alaska I’ve been lucky to try a lot of options for what you’re describing, and I don’t think there is really a good answer. All the mountain boots (eg Sportiva, Scarpa) are too stiff, and all the more traditional winter boots are too floppy. For bikepacking around freezing I wear insulated Xtratuffs. They handle French technique OK on glacier ice. But my Nepal Evos are actually great for winter biking, due to the stiff sole, and of course are solid on the steeps while still hikeable. I believe OR is coming out with a supergaiter soon that might help with their lack of a liner.

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