Why am I cold skiing?

[Philip O]

Hi, just had the first day on the skis here in the Alps, it was windy as usual and between 14 and 30 Degrees Fahrenheit. My layering systems (I tried 2):

Base Layer: Arc’teryx Phase SL t-shirt or Merino 140g t-shirt

Mid Layer: Patagonia Cap4 Thermal (3.8-oz (129-g) Polartec® Power Grid™ fabric)

Insulation Layer: MHW Ghost Whisperer Down Jacket or Arc’teryx Atom LT

Shell: Arc’teryx Alpha LT Jacket (Gore Tex Pro 3L)

For Bottoms I was wearing a Polartec Powerstretch 3/4 Pant underneath a Tweave Durastretch Softshell Pant. No problems there.

I was usually fine during the descent but I was always cold on the lift, in particular under the pits, I noticed it was slightly worse with the Atom LT. I am wondering if somehow wind creeps up under my shell? Any other ideas? It was quite uncomfortable.

Thanks in advance!
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[jscott]

Chair lifts can be cold. My guess: you need a puffier puffy.

[Paul Magnanti]

Insulation Layer: MHW Ghost Whisperer Down Jacket or Arc’teryx Atom LT

Yes. You need a better puffy. Those puffies with +/- 3 oz of down fill or equivalent synthetic are three-season favorites. But because they look like winter jackets, people treat them like winter jackets.

They ain’t.

You need a puffy with at least 5 oz of downfill for it to be a winter worth puffy IMO esp when still.  Not as critical,  but baffle box (sleeping bag) style vs stitch-through construction will be warmer, too.

 

[Philip O]

Any suggestions for such jackets? And would I still be wearing the hardshell over it? Or would those heavier jackets have good enough windshells themselves?

[Paul Magnanti]

The Montbell Frostline at $239 has  7 oz of down fill and is a good combo of price, weight, and functionality.

I do not downhill ski, however.

If you are looking for something just to throw on and off when using the chair lift, I imagine there are less expensive but very functional options.  The old “Michelin Man” style puffies tend to have thicker nylon shells and lower Fill Power. These type of coats tend to be more durable and less expensive if heavier and bulkier. Cabelas, Bean and similar still sell these very functional, warm and durable coats. If getting on and off a ski lift all day and handling sharp-edged skis, the old style coat may be a better option.

I have a similar old beater down coat from EMS I use for winter car camping trips esp in the desert. The gritty sand will shred anything..including my more expensive, lighter but certainly less durable gear. And what this sand does to the more delicate zipper vs my older EMS puffy is something as well.

Oh yes, light to moderate wind is fine with these old style puffies.

[Philip O]

Thank you, that’s helpful. I must say I’m a bit surprised. I did not use to have that problem. Any idea why to I’m particularly cold in the pit area? I checked and the base layer was bone dry as far as I could tell…

[Bruce Tolley]

“Any idea why to I’m particularly cold in the pit area? I checked and the base layer was bone dry as far as I could tell…”

That is called cooling through evaporative heat loss.

[Philip O]

Could you elaborate on that? And also do you have a recipe to solve it?

 

[Paul Magnanti]

And also do you have a recipe to solve it?

2/3 cup packed dark brown sugar
1/2 cup (1 stick) unsalted butter, room temperature
1/4 cup honey
1/2 teaspoon ground cinnamon
1/4 teaspoon ground nutmeg
1/8 teaspoon ground cloves
Pinch salt
3/4 cup spiced rum
2 cups boiling water
4 sticks cinnamon, for garnish

Using an electric mixer, beat the brown sugar, butter, honey, cinnamon, nutmeg, cloves, and salt in a medium bowl until blended and smooth. Transfer the mixture to a 4-cup (or larger) measuring cup. Add the rum and then 2 cups of boiling water. Stir until the butter mixture dissolves.

Paul Mags addition: Add portion to a four cup thermos.  Share with friends. You’ll be popular! Add a splash or two of more run and you’ll be more popular. ;)

 

 

[Bruce Tolley]

I own an ArcTeryx Atom LT jacket. It is specifically designed for mid layer insulation when you are generating a lot of heat, hence the fabric sides that allow rapid evaporation,

If you have room under your shell, I would agree with Paul M to go for a thicker  insulating layer or adding some sort of thin vest like an old fashioned wool sweater vest or Ibex Shak vest.

I do not downhill ski anymore but do some cross country and a lot of snow shoeing both of which are fairly aerobic and heat generating. I find a very thin wind shirt can also help alot by itself and also under the hardshell. Unless it is stormy or very windy I mostly leave the hardshell off.  I also like the windshirt under a softshell.

Cheers

[Philip O]

Should I try beefier base layers? Maybe replace the lightweight Phase SL and the Cap4 with a Polatrec Powerstretch base?

I could replace the Atom LT with a heavier Down Jacket but then I wouldn’t be able to use the WP/B Shell over it.

Thoughts?

 

[Bri W]

If you want to combine down jacket and shell, I use the Outdoor Research Floodlight jacket. It’s waterproof, so it works nicely as a shell. I wear thick Brynje wool/net baselayers and a thin VBL jacket under it so that if I do sweat, I don’t sweat out my down (the jacket is not waterproof from the inside). That kept me super warm in 10s° with a windchill. It was actually too warm while I was snowshoeing in low 30s°. It’s just over 1 lb. in weight, though.

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