What sewing machine?

[Dean F.]

My wife and I are in the market for a sewing machine. (Getting tired of hand-sewing girl scout patches, among other things.) So what features should I look for, for MYOG purposes? Or, do you have any particular models to be recommended?

We know less than nothing about sewing machines. Talk to me like I’m an idiot.

[Roger Caffin]

We know less than nothing about sewing machines. Talk to me like I’m an idiot.

Talk about an invitation!
OK, OK.
Rule #1: the sales rep will want to sell you the machine which gets him (her?) the biggest commission. This may have nothing to do with your needs.
Rule #2: a solid old-fashioned all-metal machine may well outlast a new modern plastic machine.
Rule #3: 90% of the frills on the latest internet-connected machines are utterly useless.
Rule #4: all you really need is straight stitch and one or two simple zigzags. A 3-step zigzag is very nice to have as single-stp zigzags (bar tacking) are not a lot of use on light fabrics.
Rule #5: do NOT buy cheap cotton thread !!! Buy the best quality poly-cotton you can find.

Finding an old (metal) machine, loved but no longer used, from an elderly relative or local may well be the best idea all around. Figure out how to strip it down a little bit, just so you can clean and oil it (and get all the dried up fluff and grease out of it). Then get some fabric of different weights and experiment or practice – lots. Think hospital internship. Learn to adjust the upper tension wheel – that’s important.

Cheers

[bjc]

Agreed on an older all metal machine. You might look for an old Elna. My wife bought hers in 1972 and it is still going strong and is heavily used. Last time we looked the used ones were about $500 which is what she paid for it new. It has sewn clothes, quilts, and lots of hiking gear including sleeping bags and pack bags. With maintenance the thing is as good as new.

[Richard May]

With @rcaffin’s rules 2 and 4 in mind, I’ve got an Elna Lotus TSP (purchased circa 1976) that was a hand me down from my mother when she upgraded. I’m just learning to use it and it is beautiful. Ebay has several Elna Lotus in a few configurations for under $300. They are different in that they’ve got different stitches, so be sure to look at that.

[bjc]

$300 is even better!

[Dean F.]

Huh. I had thought that the capability to bar tack was high on the requirements list. Or are you just poo-pooing a certain kind of bar tack?

Would a sewing machine need some sort of special capability to do eyelets or buttonholes? Or is that covered in the zigzags you already mentioned?

Is there any special need for long “arms” or whatever they are called, to get deep inside packs or pockets or other cavities?

I’ll check the eBay link when I get home, but I’m pretty sure I’ll get resistance from my wife on any machine that requires some sort of “installation” as opposed to just taking it out of the box… :)

[jimmyjam]

To make a bar tack you simply set the machine to zigzag and set the stitch spacing to 1 or less.

[William Kerber]

I’ve picked up the older, all metal machines at Goodwill, other Thrift stores, Estate sales or Craig’s List for $20-$30. You need to be ready to invest a little elbow grease in cleaning them up (many times they have old varnished oil) and lubing them. Or, check Craig’s list, if you have that available to you, and in certain areas you can find the older machines refurbished for around $200. I lean towards Singers and Kenmores from the 60’s & 70’s because I can generally find parts for them, if needed and they have user groups on Yahoo for sharing tips on maintenance and use.

 

Also, a $100 new machine will sew light material just fine. I use a Brother CS6000i to make hammocks, tarps and quilts, but the older, all metal machine is what I use for sewing straps and backpacks.

[Richard May]

@acrosome Regarding the Lotus, I should have said “models” not “configurations”; not all have zig-zags. The SP and TSP models do. I think the EC does not.

[Jim Colten]

Huh. I had thought that the capability to bar tack was high on the requirements list.

Bar tack is useful with heavier materials but with fabric you are likely to use on UL projects you want (need!) to spread the stress across a larger area of the fabric unless you don’t care about failures:-)  The X-box is a good way to attach straps and guy-out loops to UL fabrics, very crude ascii art representation:

|——–|
|\        /|
| \      / |
|     X   |
|   /    \ |
|/        \|
|——–|

What jimmyjam said about making bar tacks is just what you need to know.

[Jim Colten]

(Getting tired of hand-sewing girl scout patches, among other things.)

Allow me to suggest that maybe you are doing it wrong, Dean.

Our son (who is now the father of our grandson) was a cub scout and then boy scout until he aged out.  We came home from the first shopping trip for a cub scout uniform and I introduced him to Mr. Singer (vintage late 1940’s).  With a small amount of coaching he got everything attached and from that day on he did all of his own scouting related sewing.

That also was a start on acquiring a strong DIY ethic … which has carried him forward to a career designing and building flying machines..

[Diane “Piper” Soini]

I bought an old Pfaff from an estate sale for $35. It’s cast iron and came with tons of feet, some notions and the original manuals, one of which is in German. From the fashions on display in the model in the manual, the machine is from the early 1960s. It had a sticker on it with the last maintenance from a local sewing machine technician, and it was recent. I called that same technician after I bought it. He said I did really well, that these old machines are better than anything new because the new machines use plastic parts and this one is all metal and built to last. Probably the only thing I wish it did that it doesn’t do is automatic button holes, because I am terrible at doing them myself. But it does anything I would need. Even came with two rolled hem feet. Once I learned how to use them, oh wow, those are awesome.

[Rich K.]

If you know less than nothing, I’d suggest you buy a new one.  It will properly tension thread, the feed dogs will grip ultralight materials, and it will have a manual, and a warranty.  I’d say to just get a cheap one too, $100.  After you learn the workings on that one, you’ll be able to judge and test some real used workhorses later on that wont cost you all that much more.

 

 

[DancingBear]

Don’t overlook trade-ins at a dealer of new ones.  They often take pretty nice machines in for trade, fix them up and resell them.  It costs more than a Craigslist special, but you can be sure that the thing works, and won’t need service immediately, which is nice if you don’t know much about them to begin with.  Such dealers are often a good source of basic lessons, and they may even throw in a few lessons when you buy a machine.

+1 on getting an older, all-metal model. You definitely want a zigzag stitch so you can do buttonholes. Automatic buttonholes is a nice feature but not essential.  Having the removable bit (extension table, according to my wife) to allow you to get into shirt sleeves, etc. is a big deal.  It’s a pretty common feature.

I’ll add one rule to Roger’s –  Rule #6: Change the needle often!  They wear out and can be a source of immense frustration.

[Dean F.]

What do you all think of the Singer P-1250?

Metal.  Does zigzags.  Also does buttonholes.  Otherwise, very basic.  Does have a thread tensioning system.  Think any internal parts are plastic?

Some reviews describe it as “like taking a step back in time.”  Sounds like what you all are describing.  Rather expensive, though.

Or, if you want basic…

[Rich K.]

I’d save some $ and go with the 44S.  Its going to be solid enough for what you are talking about and give you lots of flexibility.

[Roger Caffin]

Button holes: can be done with basic single-step zigzag, or with 3-step.
I gave up on buttons a long time ago, so I don’t sew them any more. But once you get them figured out, they are not difficult.

Bartacks: OK for webbing, but they tend to wreck light fabrics. Too much stress concentration and damage to the fabric. Go for the X-box design instead: much stronger.

Now – FEET. You want a good roller foot and you want an adjustable zipper foot. These are essential.

Old Singer and old Pfaff – both good.
I have a 1950s black Singer – they are quite expensive on the second hand market, even though they only do straight stitch. Be guided by the price! These old machines will sew UL silk and hessian bags equally well.
I have an 80s Elna as well. useful machine for light fabrics, but it cannot handle pack material.

Cheers

[D M]

Wow, all over the place here……a lot of good suggestions.

I was a professional seamstress for three decades, everything from corsets to custom wedding dresses to men’s suits. I use Babylock machines and a few antiques I inherited, but for the money, Babylock is a great value. There is a model they make called “Denim Pro” that sews anything from many layers of denim (think flat felled seams) to silk with that one machine changing needles and tension of course…..This model is rhino tough and lasts and lasts before needing any maintenance or oiling. Nuff said.

[r m]

I’m after a sewing machine for MYOG too. At the moment I’ve got the gfs cheap entry level Brother, which to be fair to it does really well with light materials.  But there’s no way I’m sewing any pack cloth or doing bartacks in thick climbing webbing with it. (Maybe the bartacks in webbing is asking a bit too much?)

Interesting that most recommendations are for ancient machines. Is that mostly because of the price of new high end machines? (I’m thinking *surely* we can build better sewing machines now then we could during WW2).

I have preference for a new machine, mostly because it’ll be straight forward for me to order what I want and will likely involve less screwing around.

Walking feet….Is that something we should be worrying about? What about triple feed? (Or does that blow the budget out to insane levels?) Might be nice for quilts and slippery material.

[Buck Nelson]

I did tons of sewing for twenty years, making gear bags and whatnot at work.

Unless you are planning on sewing multiple layers of very heavy materials, or are planning on sewing professionally, I would recommend buying a cheap, well reviewed modern machine. As a matter of fact that’s exactly what I did when I semi-retired and that machine has served me well. The reasons I bought an inexpensive machine:

I didn’t want someone else’s problem. I’ve sat down at many old sewing machines that had difficult to diagnose issues or broken parts.

It was an incredibly good value.

It has many more features than older machines. (Although most people will never use all the possible stitch functions.)

It’s just the machine, no table. When I’m done with my zipper replacement or tent repair I can tuck it under my desk where it’s out of the way and ready to go for next time.

Anytime that I can buy something that I need, does the job, is inexpensive and compact, it’s a good purchase.

 

 

[Kattt]

Anyone really getting into myog would eventually benefit from getting a serger. Depending how you set it up, it will cut, sew and finish the fabric ( to prevent fraying) in one run. If you go that way at some point, get an “air threaded” one, because threading a serger can be …difficult.

I have a few sewing machines ( Bernina and Babylocks) but the serger is a mechanical jewel that I have run hard for about 10 hours a week for two years now, without ever having a problem with it. It’s a Babylock Evolve, the last model they made that is not computerized ( thanks Peter Vacco for scoring this one for me all the way in Texas:).

Unless you plan on sewing a lot the serger is not necessary but it sure is nice to have finished edges etc. I second the recommendation of getting a new Babylock if you are not used to messing with tension dials; most people give up on their machine for this very reason. The name Babylock really is silly, but the machines are pretty good. Stay away from the computerized models.

[Dean F.]

Ok, my wife mentioned the Great Sewing Machine Search to my mother-in-law, who is in town visiting. She’s getting to the point where she can’t thread the needle for her sewing machine and offered to give it to us. It’s a Husqvarna Viking that she paid $800 for in 1960, which certainly sounds like a solid machine. (She got a good one back then because she was working making clothes and drapes.) She describes it as having “a lot of wheels that you change for different stitches” and she has gotten it serviced every five years or so and says that the repairman keeps offering to buy it off of her.

I would sort of feel guilty accepting it, though.

She can’t recall the model number offhand.

Also, I found a guy who refurbishes, services, and sells old sewing machines. Some of these are more like works of industrial art than anything else. Look at this 1906 treadle-powered Singer 27.

[Roger Caffin]

Hi Dean
> I would sort of feel guilty accepting it, though.
Wrong approach entirely.
Think about this from the PoV of your mother-in-law. She can no longer use this very fine machine. Does she want to see it junked, or would it please her to see it being passed on to her son-in-law for his use?

In the 1980s I visited the Australian Singer factory and spoke to the GM. He showed me pallets of NEW treadle machines ready for shipment to Africa. Their biggest selling machine!

Cheers
Roger

[Ryan Smith]

A lot of good advice already, but I will chime in on the bartack and X-box pattern with lightweight fabrics. I’ve used both with very lightweight fabrics and had no problem, but have since moved on to an easier “Z” pattern.  Works just fine for the loads we see, plus MUCH easier and faster to sew. For my cuben projects, this is all I will use on the tie out areas.  Just practice a bit and you’ll find what works for you.

Ryan

 

 

[Jim Colten]

Dean,

The “Mr. Singer” to which  I introduced our son came to me as a gift from my mother-in-law who had not used it in a long time.  I agree with Roger’s thoughts on that.

I also own a Husqvarna Viking that I bought used from a sewing shop.  Model 1620 IIRC.  This one was sans the cams that make fancy stitches.  It works great and it has a two speed transmission … low gear is good for sewing through webbing.  Also, it does the triple stitch zig-zag Roger mentioned.

[Author]

Posts