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Two different Nylon vs Polyester fabric tests, WRT strength, weathering (UV)


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Home Forums Gear Forums Gear (General) Two different Nylon vs Polyester fabric tests, WRT strength, weathering (UV)

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  • #3827256
    Jeff McWilliams
    BPL Member

    @jjmcwill

    Locale: Midwest

    Seek Outside Youtube video

    SlingFin testing report

    Both tests seem to agree that despite the claims that polyesters degrade less from UV exposure than nylon, that nylons continue to be the superior fabric if you’re concerned about materials strength when any significant UV exposure (or weathering in general) is a factor.

    #3827263
    Jerry Adams
    BPL Member

    @retiredjerry

    Locale: Oregon and Washington

    Those are both very interesting jeff

    The big takeaway from the first video is that their sil poly tents ripped when it got very windy.

    My silpoly tent ripped like that once.  The fabric ripped about 3 inches above the tent stake tie out, perpendicular to the load.  Like in that video.  I assumed it was because I put a rock on it to keep the tent stake from pulling out, and I thought it tore because it was rubbing against the rock, but now I’m thinking it was just the weakness of poly.

    He subjectively judged silpoly sagged only a little less than silnylon when wet.  I compared nylon and poly grosgrain webbing.  Pulled on them with a scale like in that video.  The nylon stretched a lot more when dry.  The poly stretched the same when wet, but the nylon stretched much more when wet.  I measured with a ruler.  I forget the numbers now, something like a 6 foot length of poly stretched 1 inch with a 20 pound load.  The nylon stretched 3 inches dry, an additional 2 inches when wet.  That’s grosgrain not fabric.

    He said the sagging was because the nylon absorbs water which makes it heavier which causes it to sag.

    I don’t think that’s what’s happening – the fibers of nylon actually stretch more when they get wet.  Based on my stretching of nylon and poly grosgrain.

    When the mids collected snow, you can see how the length and width inside decreased.  That’s what I’ve experienced – ill wake up after it’s snowed and all the walls are moving in on me.  This us a weakness of mids, because the walls are angled.  On the other hand, you can just tap the walls from the inside and the snow will slide off, restoring the internal length and width.

    And when snow accumulates on the outside of the fabric, there is a huge amount of condensation inside, because the snow is cold.

    #3827292
    Dan @ Durston Gear
    BPL Member

    @dandydan

    Locale: Canadian Rockies

    I would be carefully about how conclusions are drawn here. These are presented as tests of polyester vs nylon but they are not a controlled test of that question because the fabrics also vary in numerous other important ways (coating type, coating thickness, calendaring, ripstop, fiber type, heat treatments, other treatments etc etc).

    There are numerous factors that can have a big effect on strength so without controlling or isolating those variables you can’t conclude anything about fiber type effects (nylon vs poly) or other factors. You can say that fabric 1 is stronger than fabric 2, but you can’t say why because they vary in so many different ways that are all confounded and the sample size is so small. These tests do have better results with some nylon fabrics under UV, but that is almost certainly for reasons besides the fiber type, such as the different types or thicknesses of coatings. There is no fundamental reason why nylon would do better under UV, so when you see a nylon doing better under UV it is a good indication that UV damage is being influence by other things. Similarly, when you see a 10D nylon outperform a 20D nylon you can also tell that other factors besides denier and fiber type are greatly affecting the results. These tests do a nice job of showing the fabrics these companies use perform well against a small collection of other fabrics, so their fabrics perform well but this type of study can not answer why that is.

    #3827305
    Alan W
    BPL Member

    @at-reactor

    Yes to Dan’s.

    Also, UV inhibitor additives and antioxidant additives can be (are) varied by the polymer supplier according to the fabricator’s requests and purchasing spec.  These additives have a large effect on weathering across almost all synthetic organic polymers, regardless whether the polymer is used in a tent fabric, milk jug, rooftop water tank, conduit, or whatever.  Alas, these additive compounds are relatively expensive.  Many function by being chemically consumed sacrificially more readily than the polymer chain bonds.  Less additive loading = consumed sooner = shorter environmental life for the fabricated polymer item.

    #3827359
    Roger Caffin
    BPL Member

    @rcaffin

    Locale: Wollemi & Kosciusko NPs, Europe

    Sadly, many of these additives are toxic.

    Cheers

    #3827360
    Terran Terran
    BPL Member

    @terran

    In conclusion. Some will and some won’t. Some do and some don’t. Too many generalizations. Pricewise, poly products are often on the low end as well as the high end. As a consumer, I’d say just buy from reputable manufacturers, but that too is generalizing and stifles the upstarts. Price can be a determining factor. Rather inaccurate. A higher price doesn’t determine anything.  Unless known brand names are mentioned in the material list such as Pertex, how are we as consumers able to tell the difference between one poly or the other?

    #3827365
    George H
    BPL Member

    @unworhty

    Nylon never failed me and the disadvantages poly is trying to remedy are not issues I worry about.

    Anecdote: On a trip a friend had a new poly tent. When stuffing it one morning in the supplied, generously sized poly stuff sack the sack ripped completely. It was clearly made with the same material as the tent

     

    #3827366
    Jeff McWilliams
    BPL Member

    @jjmcwill

    Locale: Midwest

    I have a bunch of tents, including ones made of Silpoly, Silnylon, the “old school” PU coated nylon that big name brands use, and now even a TNTUltra tent.  I bought one of the original DCF tents from ZPacks back in 2012 but sold it.

    I like Silpoly for its lack of stretch and low cost.
    I like TNTUltra and DCF because they don’t absorb water or sag.

    The tent issues I have experienced have been:

    • All the seam tape in my 2007 REI Quarter Dome 2 tent cracked and started peeling off.
    • My 2010 Black Diamond StormTrack 2 mountaineering tent got “sticky” in storage.  Black Diamond customer service was no help so it was thrown away.
    • In January 2020 we went backpacking in Death Valley with our TarpTent Stratospire 2 (Silnylon), and several of the zippers failed due to the fine wind blown desert sand.  I replaced the zipper sliders at home and it’s been working fine since.

    So far, (*knock on wood*)  none of my tents have experienced fabric failures.

    #3827399
    Terran Terran
    BPL Member

    @terran

    I think there’s a difference between exposing a tent to UV and wind for several days, one day at a time, compared to leaving it set up.

    #3827447
    Roger Caffin
    BPL Member

    @rcaffin

    Locale: Wollemi & Kosciusko NPs, Europe

    A difference, yes, mostly due to the lack of UV experienced in an over-night pitch.

    Cheers

    #3827454
    Terran Terran
    BPL Member

    @terran

    A tent won’t usually be set up facing the same direction everytime. However I suspect a little more is going on. It dries out. I’ll stop short of saying it’s self repairing. Looking at polyester, it consists of carbon, hydrogen, and oxygen. As the bonds break down, it’s going to lose moisture that it doesn’t regain when it’s consistently exposed. Just a guess.

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