Sewing is difficult, sewing machines are worse

[MJ H]

I am sewing a tarp, which is the first time I have used a sewing machine. Sewing itself is hard, but the worst part is keeping the machine running. It’s winding a bobbin, which is a skill, then running two different pieces of thread through lots of very small spaces, then fiddling with tension, then going out to find sewing machine oil, then going out to find mineral oil after not finding sewing machine oil, then starting over with a new bobbin because all the thread on the first bobbin got ruined from when the machine had no oil. Apple or someone needs to take a crack these machines

[Tim (Slowhike) Garner]

On UTUBE, type in the machine you have, and you will most likely find instruction on using your machine.

That’s a great place to learn things.

UTUBE University.

[Jerry Adams]

My mom had a sewing machine in ~1970.  There were all these bearings that you had manually clean and oil.  I used that to make a pyramid tent (that was sort of heavy and I never used much).  I think that broke the machine.  My poor mom…

My wife bought a Janome about 20 years ago but I’m the only one that ever used it.  That has sealed bearings – you don’t have to clean or oil them.  I’ve made many packs, tents, clothing,… without ever doing anything to service it.  Once something got stuck on the foot pedal so it went full speed until something ran into something else until I managed to unstick the foot pedal.  There were some mechanical things out of place, but after I unscrewed them and put them back to where they belonged, it’s worked fine since.

More modern machines work much better, although some people have the opposite opinion.  And it depends on the machine.

Maybe try a different machine?

After you figure out all the techniques, it gets much easier?

The reason I make my own gear is because I enjoy the creative process, but I think most people would rather just buy finished gear.

[MJ H]

I would have not gotten very far without YouTube. There’s just a pretty big gap between watching something and doing it.
This is just a cheap Singer that my wife got over a decade ago on clearance at Target. I don’t expect to make much gear. I was just curious and figured it doesn’t hurt to know things are put together.

[Jerry Adams]

a lot of people like Singer machines

maybe you just have to play around with it. “Practice makes perfect”

[MJ H]

I think so. If I can run the machine well after a couple more sessions, I’ll probably stick wit hit. I had the brilliant idea of putting a different color thread on the bobbin, so I could tell which thread was supposed to be on the bottom. But I only have one spool of good thread.

[Jerry Adams]

I used to use gutterman thread from fabric store, but occasionally it broke.

I switched to gutterman mara 70 thread from rsbtr which is stronger

[MJ H]

That is the thread I’m using. I’ve never had it break. I have broken a needle. I’m pretty sure that was my fault since I was trying to straighten the fabric and wound up with the needle going into the top of the foot.

[Jerry Adams]

Not good idea for needle to go into foot

I’ve done that before too

[Megan W]

Better than going into your hand (well, finger)…done that too.

[Jerry Adams]

I hate it when I do that too

[Sam Farrington]

Once found a clip of Asian workers sewing large and sometimes intricate fabric projects.  Maybe something could be found on U-tube.  It is simply amazing to watch.

In my first meddle with granny’s sewing machine, probably at age 4 or so, I drove the needle right through my forefinger.  Could not believe it was happening, and it raised quite a fuss in the family.  But got the hang of it eventually.  But go slow, not like those piece workers who wail to go fast enough to make a living.

All the same, once you’ve seen it, you know it can be done.

[MJ H]

I am still going to finish this. But I’ve had things to do. I also bought a used Deschutes Plus that required no assembly and that I took out for it’s first trip.

[Ron Bell / MLD]

It’s all about balancing the hooha, the bobinator and the cry hole. After about 10,000 hours you’ll get the hang of it.

[MJ H]

I thought I was doing good and then the tie-outs happened and sewing through the ribbon killed me. Maybe I should have started with a bivy?

[Terran Terran]

Looking at a Janome gw8100 with accessories on AliExpress for $225. I learned on an old Singer when I was a kid, several years ago. As an alternative to buying a MLD Pro Poncho which is roughly the same price. Other than the tieouts, how hard can a poncho be? I’m looking on opinions on both.

The poncho is 5,000 hh polyester while Ripstop by the Roll has 4,000 hh polyester. I’m guessing total materials would be around $50. Most of the available ponchos are nylon and less waterproof. The 3F UL poncho is of course around $200 cheaper. I like the idea of a tarp for supplementing a larger tarp, not as a stand alone. Mostly to block off the end of an A frame.  I’m afraid as a poncho though, I may find it annoying. Thoughts? Thank you.

[Haakon R]

Not very encouraging reading as I just ordered my first batch of fabrics :)

Planning to start easy (I think) with an ultralight shopping bag and move on to a alpha direct hoodie.
These will be my very first MYOG projects using technical materials, but I got started sewing at the end of last year, doing a test project with a sweater in stretch cotton jersey. Turned out surprisingly well, so I’m kind of bummed I played it safe and went with something I didn’t really need :) Did the whole thing on an overlock machine. We have a couple of machines at work that we can use, so I haven’t invested in my own machine yet.

[Terran Terran]

I’m not sure why I picked this thread. It was the most current one I could find. Like anything new, it may seem overwhelming. It’s no different from anything else. It’s just construction. Straight lines and accurate cuts. Using the proper tools. Joining similar materials together using glue, mortar, nails, pins, or in this case thread. Maintaining your equipment, learning to dial it in. There’s a few tricks to everything, but basically, it’s all the same thing.

I think you really need a surger for knit fabrics. A few more adjustments. Tension and stich length will vary with the fabrics. Some of the newer to me tech fabrics may be a bit slippery. The Janome I mentioned comes with a dual feed foot to help keep things even. It’s computerized for easier adjustment, but I don’t think that’s a big deal. I don’t need 50 different stitches, but for $225 total, it appears to be worth the price. It’s $325 on Amazon. Still there may be one with similar quality and similar price that’s a bit more stripped down and heavy duty.

[Bill Budney]

I’m afraid as a poncho though, I may find it annoying. Thoughts?

I couldn’t parse that, Terran. You are concerned that you might find a poncho annoying as a poncho? How so?

[Terran Terran]

As a poncho, the MLD Pro Poncho Tarp seems to have a lot of excess fabric. Harder to control in the wind.  Most reviews show it being used as a tarp. More tarp than poncho. It’s not cheap. My reason for looking at it is that it’s polyester and has a higher degree of waterproofness than most. MLD has a very good reputation with a good business model and isn’t made in China.

[Monte Masterson]

Liteway offers a 20D silpoly poncho tarp. Measures 107″ X 57″ and weighs 8 oz. $116. Made in Ukraine.

https://liteway.equipment/shelters/poncho-tarp/poncho-simplex

[Terran Terran]

The Liteway has a HH rating of 2,000mm. The MLD claims 5,000mm+. The similar size  Sea to Summit (nylon) is only 1,200mm. They all seem a bit light with the MLD being somewhat waterproof.

 

[Bill Budney]

Probably rehashing things you have already considered, but since you brought up the topic:

As a poncho, the MLD Pro Poncho Tarp seems to have a lot of excess fabric. Harder to control in the wind.

Most of that is the nature of poncho-tarps. 66×108 is a few inches wider and longer than average for poncho-tarps, but is not unusual. The wind thing is more imagined than real — a belt is all it takes to cinch it down pretty well in most below-treeline conditions.

More tarp than poncho.

If you want to use your poncho as a tarp then, yes, most poncho-tarps are like that. They are basically a narrow tarp with a head hole and snaps, buttons, or zippers to make “sleeves”. Two poncho-tarps could make a full-size tarp — some military ponchos connect together for that purpose.

It’s not cheap.

As with most other UL gear, you pay a large premium for materials and US manufacturing. Yes, you should be able to make it yourself and save quite a bit.

The functional difference between 3FUL and MLD is small, but the price difference is large. The MLD is more refined and uses high-quality materials, but you pay a lot for that. It’s the nature of the ultralight market.

My reason for looking at it is that it’s polyester and has a higher degree of waterproofness than most.

What is the benefit of polyester in a poncho? Are you thinking about stretch when it is in tarp mode? How important is that for a door?

Similar for waterproofness: Why does it matter to you? It shouldn’t matter in poncho mode, and probably doesn’t matter much in tarp mode. Any silnylon or silpoly should be more than adequate. Anything over 1500 is generally considered “waterproof”, and nobody complains about the Sea to Summit poncho. What is your concern?

Wind tolerance might be more of a concern — IF you pitch your poncho-tarp in windy conditions and IF you depend on it for your primary shelter.

Sleeves

All that said, sleeves, like Roger’s Mountain Poncho and The Packa are popular in Europe — many manufacturers there seem to offer at least one sleeved variant. You probably know that 3FUL has a sleeved poncho as well as their poncho-tarp.

I like the boxy shape of The Packa. It fits over me and my pack like an oversized jacket. If you get the size right, it has minimal extra fabric, and the ability to cinch it around your pack removes most of the slack. I can see why Roger chose that shape for mountain treks.

Another MYOG sleeved poncho is the Parcho. I’m not sure that it needs to that complicated, though. I am currently tinkering with cutting a rectangular poncho to make more form-fitting (but NOT tight-fitting) sleeves and a boxier shape. KamSnaps for closures.

Experiments

A cheap and easy platform for poncho experiments is the Frogg Toggs Emergency Poncho (Amazon, Walmart). It weighs 3.5 oz, so is really easy to pack. It is inexpensive so I don’t mind cutting them up and trying different kinds of vents, including an open front like a jacket. Gorilla Tape sticks well enough to make tabs and reinforcements for KamSnaps.

An In-Between (Outlier) Alternative

OneWind makes an in-between poncho-tarp with sleeve extensions that is a little different than most. It is ten inches more narrow than the MLD (so less excess fabric) but it adds sleeve extensions. This is the only poncho-tarp that I am aware of with real sleeves.

(Agreed that you could have started your own thread for this discussion.) :)

[Monte Masterson]

“The Liteway has a HH of 2000mm. The MLD claims 5000mm +. The similar sized Sea to Summit (nylon) is only 1200mm. They all seem a bit light with the MLD being somewhat waterproof.”

You have high standards. The Liteway won’t wet out until it sees a lot of use. We’re not talking about a floor material that needs the highest HH.

Most poncho tarps are 55″ to 58″ wide because of course that’s how wide most fabrics come in the roll. Equinox Terrapin, Rab Silponcho, S2S Ultrasil, Bach, etc are all in that width range. The Rab is made with 30D Cordura which is high quality.

The hood is by far the most difficult thing when making a poncho. Too much effort and complexity for me. I’d rather just buy. I have a GoLite (discontinued) poncho.

[Terran Terran]

A little picky. Mostly overthinking it. If I don’t know something, it takes me awhile to grasp it. I’m not very familiar with siliconized fabrics other than a Six Moons tent I had once. Loved the tent. Didn’t like the nylon.  I do appreciate all the information. The hood does look like the harder part to put together. I’d rather buy something, if I can decide what I want.

The Liteway Poncho Pyraomm looks like more of what I had in mind though a few ounces heavier. Lighter than my EVent jacket though. Looks like I just missed a 20% off sale. I’ll wait and see what comes up. Two degrees outside right now. Just thinking ahead to springtime.

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