River Crossing (ahem) for the Uninitiate….

[Mina Loomis]

Companion forum thread to: River Crossing (ahem) for the Uninitiate….

What is this trip report really about?  Why post it?  We ran into an unexpected challenge.  River crossings.  I know, many of you readers will have cr

[Dan]

Good job, it looks like you met the challenge of your water crossings! That’s the beauty of the wilderness, you never know exactly what you’re going to find.

Now that you’ve experienced them, you will probably find them to be an enjoyable obstacle to navigate. Last summer, my wife went back and forth across one water crossing three times so I could get good video of one of our dogs swimming across alongside her.  :-)

Just one quick note. Looking at the photo, it looks like someone is crossing with their hipbelt and sternum straps buckled. Perhaps the conventional wisdom has changed, but I was always taught to unbuckle straps before crossing. If the water takes you down, you want to be able to ditch your pack quickly.

[Todd T]

Perhaps the conventional wisdom has changed, but I was always taught to unbuckle straps before crossing. If the water takes you down, you want to be able to ditch your pack quickly.

My rules:  Always unbuckle the sternum strap.  Unbuckle the hipbelt only if a fall would sweep you into dangerous waters (excessive depth or speed, falls, rapids, etc.).

Rationale:  No need for the sternum strap so take it out of the equation.  Hipbelt helps A LOT with stability, so don’t undo it unless the consequences of having it buckled in a fall are worse than the instability.

[Dan]

Sure, I think everyone uses their judgement about straps once they have experience. I just wanted Mina to be aware of the issue.

[Mina Loomis]

>I just wanted Mina to be aware of the issue

Yes, I’ve read much over the years about how to cross high water.  But reading and doing can be very different.  Once many years ago crossing a smaller creek with fast water my husband and I tried the linking together technique and we just destabilized each other.

WRT undoing the hip belt.  The image at the top of the narrative is K carrying C’s pack, and C without a pack.  It looks like maybe K had the belt buckled.  The other photo I can’t remember; I might have unbuckled mine based on my book learning.  But I think some of the crossings I probably left it buckled because I felt more stable that way.  “Someday” (isn’t that what we always say?) I ought to go out during a storm when the creeks are high here in Austin, with my poles and my practice pack, and practice crossing back and forth, with and without the belt buckled, and see if I can get used to it unbuckled.

[jscott]

River crossings and steep icy passes  are my main bugaboos. (Bugaboo?) I once entered a wide stream over the south fork of the San Joaquin river and found myself spontaneously singing a hymn LOUD as I proceeded. I knew there was a falls not far past my crossing. I use poles and love them for river crossings. I can probe the next step and maintain three point contact as I raise one foot and and slowly advance it ahead. Patience and careful placement of each step and pole point is crucial. Meanwhile, my emotions are telling me to hurry up and get the hell out of there. Race across! No.

I’ll look for better crossings well above and below the trail if the marked crossing seems dangerous. Again, patience is important. I’ve also been fooled by clear water that turns out to be far more deep and fast than I estimated. And stones on the bottom can be slick. It’s a tricky business.

I think folks who enter wilderness in a big snow year in early season should go with the attitude that they’ll turn back if crossings prove too dangerous. Alas, most of us who go early season are the most intent on finishing a loop and seeing the sights.

the Bob Marshal contestants (ha! lovers of wilderness) should have much to say about how best to ford dangerous waters. These guys rock when it comes to early season river crossings.

 

[AK Granola]

I wonder if the skirt makes river crossings harder? With water pushing against it? I also wondered about your shoes, slipping off rocks and such. But maybe the rocks are just too small to really balance on. Sounds like a very challenging set of waterways to cross! I have crossed many, but the really fast flowing ones still make me nervous. I try not to look at the water which sometimes destabilizes me. I also hate log crossings; I’ll wade the water any day over balancing on a slippery rounded mossy log!

Yellowstone is on my bucket list, but not sure I’ll ever get there. Sounds beautiful!

[Mina Loomis]

I don’t think the skirt made a difference.  My first, failed, attempt was without it, just underwear and bare legs.  I took to wearing skirts for backpacking because I was getting seam chafe from pants.  Possibly my skin changed with aging.  The rocks were mostly not large rocks, more like 1-2 times the size of my foot, and slippery and unstable.  In general the shoes performed fine.  Xero TerraFlex.  They have pretty good lugs.  I’m not too bad with log crossings but my sister hates them.  Different nervous systems I suppose.  Yellowstone is awesome!  (So is Alaska but as hard to get to from here as Yellowstone is for Alaskans!)

[William K]

I enjoyed reading your report! I have not done river crossings in decades, not more than ankle deep. But, in WY’s Wind Rivers one June(39 years ago now) we did several thigh to waist deep rivers, plus one Tyrolean Traverse. But,we would link arms, facing upstream if memory serves. But, we had a big group, and that made it easier to cover the width of the river. We would put the 2 strongest on the ends. It was always very stable, the only real problem being the ice cold water from all the snow melt.

Is that not the way to do it anymore, the whole group linking arms? Oh well, it matters not, you got it done and had a great adventure! And after all, you might find yourself on a solo trip, so no one to link arms with! Now you are experienced doing it another way!

Bill

[Roger Caffin]

We have had to do a few river crossings over the years.
When the water is shallow (undefined), clear, slow and the bottom is sandy, we walk across. Nice cool water on the feet!
When the water is a bit deeper (darker) and maybe a bit faster, we may find strong sticks and lock hands together.
If the water is getting a bit rough, then a stick each, lock hands, me on the upstream (being stronger – I claim) and we move one step at a time. That is, one step between us. So one of us has two feet and one stick anchored at all times.

Special cases: rocky riverbed: keep shoes ON.
Big boulders: don’t try climbing between boulders: we have lost at least one walker here in Oz who got her foot jammed and then fell over. Better to just get rather wet.

Snow melt in snow: ugh. Socks off, shoes back on (ever stubbed your foot in icy water?) and trot across only if the water is shallow enough – with poles. Then quickly stand on gaiters, off the snow, and get dry socks back on. If the water is too deep: go around.

Deep in my pack there are two strong plastic bags. If all else fails, repack gear inside plasbags, and swim. If necessary, use anchor line between us.

Cheers

[Jerry Adams]

I noticed my 70 year old legs aren’t as good at balancing so it’s much harder to cross streams

When I do resistance exercises it strengthens my legs which makes it easier.  Also, I can put on my pants better – stand on one leg and lift up the other to put leg into pants,…

Squats while holding 5 pound dumbbells.  Stand up with one leg from sitting position. 10 reps repeated 3 times.

[Roger Caffin]

A comment about a popular myth (yes, I am biased).
Unbuckling straps before crossing river – WHY? So you can jettison your pack?
Seems to me to be a very silly idea, for two reasons.

* My pack floats. If I fall over, I can roll onto my back in the water and my pack will keep my head above water very nicely. A sort of life-jacket.

* If I let go of my pack in a flood, I may never find it again. All my gear, all my food – all gone. Now, how do I survive?

Is this a ‘committee’ idea, from people who have never left their committee room?

Am I being harsh? Or am I thinking about survival?

Cheers

[AK Granola]

Have you tested that, Roger? Your fully loaded pack on your back in water that is deep enough that you have to swim? It’d be interesting to try it in a swimming pool, but I’ll bet my municipal pool wouldn’t let me.

[Roger Caffin]

Yes.
I had the foresight to repack my gear inside a large plasbag before I ventured in.
It worked well. That is, the pack floated with me on top, and my gear stayed dry.

Cheers

[Todd T]

Whether the pack floats or not seems irrelevant to me.  The point is to be able to shed the pack quickly if you need to.  There are all kinds of things for the pack to get hung on depending on the river, so being strapped in could be dangerous.  If the pack does float, it would seem better to shed it and hold onto it instead of risking it floating up and turning me face down in the water.

My habit is to always unbuckle the sternum strap, and only unbuckle the hipbelt if the crossing is deep/fast enough that getting washed away is a real possibility.  Otherwise, I’d rather have the pack as stable as possible.

[Roger Caffin]

If the pack does float, it would seem better to shed it and hold onto it instead of risking it floating up and turning me face down in the water.
One thing I can just about guarantee is that trying to hold onto a free-floating pack in rough water will not work.
On the other hand, I have not had my pack flip me over and bury me, but I know how to handle the situation – from exciting experience.

In all seriousness, my very strong advice would be ‘do not tempt fate’. Don’t go in the water. Fast rough water is DANGEROUS.

Cheers

[Mina Loomis]

To answer a a couple of followup questions.  (Sorry to be tardy on this–I was away on a hiking trip.)  I too had read articles many years ago about linking arms to cross difficult water.  Way back in 2011 my husband and I were hiking the John Muir Trail.  That was a high snow year and a high melt water year.  Going southbound, the first unbridged difficult water we encountered was Mono Creek.  Not wide but fast, and maybe about thigh deep for me.  So having read about it, we linked arms, both facing upstream, with each a trekking pole in the free hand.  I’m a little more coordinated in general, so I went first and he followed.  What we discovered was that we tended to destabilize each other.  Perhaps it takes a lot more practice, and probably instruction from someone with experience, which we did not have.  We made it across but only by letting go.  And I broke a pole.  Not sure how.  Bottom half was just gone, never to be seen again.  Before starting the crossing we searched for a better way up and downstream a bit, not finding anything that looked better than where the trail crossed, but not far because the forest was pretty dense.  Later I asked others about the arm linking thing, and was advised that it is a technique to use with a larger group, not just two people.

When we got home from last year’s Yellowstone trip, I talked about it with a friend at REI (where I used to work part time) who has guided REI Adventures backpacking trips in the Bechler River corridor.  He told me how they do the crossings with clients.  They don’t link arms, but rather have each client cross separately, with poles, facing upstream (kind of like we did) but each with a guide crossing directly behind them downstream.  So the guides go back and forth several times to “guard” each client in turn until everyone is across.

[Roger Caffin]

We have never tried just linking arms, for the two of us. To me, that does not seem as though it would give much support. We hold hands, securely, with a stick in the other hand. Then we move one foot (out of the FOUR) at a time.

We don’t face upstream. Together we face across the river, with me on the upstream side to deflect the force of the water (a bit). A bit like the REI guy.

Got to the other side on one crossing with a very rough river bed, and heard applause from the people on the first bank. Grin.

Cheers

[Bill in Roswell]

Just to add a different spin on crossings, my preface are rocky bottom crossings in ME, NH, TN/NC Smokies, NM, CO, AR and WA. The catch being there are plenty of soft bottom crossings. Sipsey Wilderness, AL, early March. Rainy time o year so strong current, just below knee of my short legs. Very steep cut banks, so cross low point towards lowest bank on other side, about 75 ft away at mouth of a creek. Crossing was fine until mouth of creek. What happens when layers of dead leaves are covered by sand? Something akin to quicksand, as water went from below knee to mid-thigh in seconds. Hip belt was unbuckled. I grew up around swamps by the TN River. I laid backwards, the current caught my pack. Within moments my feet were free of the muck. As I drifted downstream I was able to grab a low tree trunk and work my way out. Fortunately my sleeping bag was in a trash bag (1983). Clothes were soaked, but temps near 70F. A fire got them reasonable. I knew a cold front was on the way. Next morning wind was up, sleet turned to snow hiking out. I bushwhacked 2 miles upstream, found a downed tree across the river. Managed to shimmy across, then bushwhack the no-trail side back to the car. Even a solo one night trip can be an adventure for most any river crossing when water is up!

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