Lanshan 2 Pro tent failed after 13 nights of use

[Justin H]

I’m trying to figure out exactly where this is and it looks like it is the seam at the arrow point below? I would think that seem isn’t getting a lot of force exerted on it due to most of the stress being taken up by the seam that goes to the peak. Because of that, I am having troubles wrapping my head around it being a design flaw vs a manufacturing defect or user error. I just pulled out my Lanshan 2 Pro, which has a lot more nights than this failed tent and the seam doesn’t look stressed.

[John S.]

My apologies to solitone on my post above.

[Dan]

And how handling might have damaged it? I want to know, so that I don’t handle the next tent that way.

I don’t know how you handled it, although in another post you mentioned that you allowed wind to blow the fly onto some rocks, which created “tears.” That would be an example of handling that could damage a tent. UL gear is generally delicate and it’s best to treat it with care.

[Dan @ Durston Gear]

“I would think that seem isn’t getting a lot of force exerted on it due to most of the stress being taken up by the seam that goes to the peak.”

A trekking pole tent is going have the main lines of tension running between all the fixed points on the same plane (indicated in blue arrows). So from the corner in question there is a line of tension up the corner seam (which would be pretty strong) but there is also a diagonal line of tension running across this panel and over this weaker seam to the opposite peak. That is where this seam has broken.

Of course we can’t know how hard this corner was pulled, but we can know this is a weak seam to use on a tent canopy. If we look at the Gossamer Gear tents which are a similar tent design that also has these edge flaps, we see they are using a folded seam here that is much stronger:

[Justin H]

Dan – “A trekking pole tent is going have the main lines of tension running between all the fixed points on the same plane (indicated in blue arrows)”

Is that assuming equal stretch for both the seams on the outside of the rectangular panel and the panel itself in order to have equal amounts of stress put along all the lines of tension you diagramed? The way my brain is processing it is that, if you have significantly stiffer outer structure for the panel (i.e., the seams), and maintain equal tension on the four corners in order to maintain a rectangle, you significantly degrease the diagonal stress.

Maybe I am underestimating the amount of stretch seams have?

[Dan @ Durston Gear]

Yeah. Things get super complicated when we start talking about stretch including differential stretch, so my above post is not going to that level. I’m just trying to show there is stress running across this seam.

Hypothetically, if the seams along the edges of this plane had zero stretch and you had equal tension at all 4 corners then you could eliminate the diagonal stress. But the seams do have some stretch and the tension is often unequal. As soon as you have unequal tension then you start stretching that rectangle into a diamond on one of the diagonals running over the seam. We could get pretty geeky with it all, but ultimately there can be and often is quite of force running across this seam.

[Justin H]

Thanks for getting into the weeds with me Dan! Just wanted to make sure I had the physics all straight!

[solitone]

I don’t know how you handled it, although in another post you mentioned that you allowed wind to blow the fly onto some rocks, which created “tears.” That would be an example of handling that could damage a tent. UL gear is generally delicate and it’s best to treat it with care.

I see, but that is completely unrelated with that seam breaking. Those tears were hardly visible with the naked eye BTW, and easily repaired them with tenacious tape to avoid water spilling in.

[Dan]

I see, but that is completely unrelated with that seam breaking. Those tears were hardly visible with the naked eye BTW, and easily repaired them with tenacious tape to avoid water spilling in.

I was giving an example of the type of handling that could create damage, because you asked me to elaborate. When someone says that rocks tore small holes in the canopy of their tent, my mind obviously goes in the direction of user error. A different event (or even that same event) could easily have caused some damage near the seam, ultimately leading to that blow-out. You can claim it didn’t happen, but you don’t really know, and the story about rocks causing tears is pretty extreme.

[solitone]

I was giving an example of the type of handling that could create damage, because you asked me to elaborate. When someone says that rocks tore small holes in the canopy of their tent, my mind obviously goes in the direction of user error. A different event (or even that same event) could easily have caused some damage near the seam, ultimately leading to that blow-out. You can claim it didn’t happen, but you don’t really know, and the story about rocks causing tears is pretty extreme.

I inquired about potential causes of seam damage, not other types of damage. I remain skeptical that wind alone could damage a seam’s stitching. Moreover, the gust of wind that carried the tent onto the rocks while it was drying occurred after the seam had already torn, so that couldn’t have been the cause.

Do you have any other reasonable suggestions for a ‘different event’?

 

[Terran Terran]

It looks like a zippered tent. If it’s pitched tight, then zipped closed, it could create stress.

looking at their website, they’re using silnylon , boasted to be 4x stronger than the old fabric. My guess…The seam gave before the fabric stretched. What may have worked before, didn’t work with the upgrade.

[Dan]

Do you have any other reasonable suggestions for a ‘different event’?

I wasn’t there. We are only speculating based on the information you choose to provide.

[nunatak]

Isn’t it about $200 now to get one of those? Which puts it awkwardly close to an Xmid

[solitone]

I wasn’t there. We are only speculating based on the information you choose to provide.

Some people have argued that the problem stemmed from a flawed seam design, and they’ve offered reasons to back up their perspective. You’re suggesting that it was due to user error, but so far, you haven’t put forth any convincing hypothesis to support your theory. I’m still uncertain as to what I might have done incorrectly.

I’m not sure what additional information to provide. I set up the tent, sleep in it, wake up, fold it, roll it, and put it back in its stuff sack. The only change from my previous setup is that I’ve started using four MSR Groundhogs (the long ones) instead of the Minis for the corners. This change allows me to apply more tension than I could with the Minis. However, it’s not extreme, as I only use two fingers to pull the guylines, but I don’t have a way to quantify the force.

[solitone]

Isn’t it about $200 now to get one of those? Which puts it awkwardly close to an Xmid

I paid $300 for the XMid 2 and an additional $29 for shipping to Italy, which came to roughly 315€. On top of that, I had to pay around 126€ for VAT and import taxes, bringing the total to approximately 440€. In contrast, when I purchased the Lanshan from the official 3F UL GEAR website, it cost me 180€, including shipping, and I didn’t have to pay any import taxes or VAT.

[K C]

Anyone here have no idea what a Lanshan 2 Pro is before reading this thread like me?
Sounds like someone complaining about how their jeans ripped that they bought at Walmart

[Scott Emmens]

Pretty freakin’ tough crowd on this thread, the bloke was only posting his experience with a fairly popular, although cheapish, tent. Give him a break. I’d be disappointed if my new tent tore after only 13 nights of use too. And doubly pissed if that was the Customer Service experience I received.

[solitone]

Anyone here have no idea what a Lanshan 2 Pro is before reading this thread like me?
Sounds like someone complaining about how their jeans ripped that they bought at Walmart

ahahah 😆 that was fun!

But seriously, I’m not really complaining. I’m just sharing my experience with this tent so others can be aware, as it appears to be quite popular, especially among those looking for a budget-friendly option. It’s generally seen as a good choice for the price.

[Monte Masterson]

3F UL Gear tents aren’t near as popular in the US as they are in Europe, Asia and South America, but as stated earlier, their shelters have a solid reputation. And when it comes to price/value/quality they are probably one of the best tents available. Yes they are mostly copies of western designs, however I don’t underestimate how good many Chinese made products can be. Are they in the same league as Tarptent or Durston? No.

Scott is right though, someone from Italy comes onto BPL looking for answers as to why his/her tent’s seam failed relatively early on and is met with some not so welcoming replies. Solitone simply laid out the scenario and writes in a very eloquent and well-mannered fashion. He/she handled the snark with total class. And we wonder why 12 hours can go by between posts.

Unless Solitone cranked down on the tieouts like a maniac there was no “user error”. It’s either 1) poor seam design or 2) improper sewing at the factory….flaws that weren’t caught by quality control (which can happen in such big mass production facilities). 3F’s silnylon isn’t a top quality 6.6 nylon but material probably isn’t the issue.

I wasn’t aware that Italian consumers faced such high import duties and VAT. Why are 3F UL Gear products exempt? How about Liteway from Ukraine? With the big price difference I’d either repair the damaged Lanshan 2 (if you have a sewing machine) or buy another one. I wouldn’t really expect a low-cost Chinese company like 3F to provide warranties much past initial purchase. I’d just assume the risk when paying such a low price. No slur against the Chinese, that’s just how they roll.

I can’t say for sure, but I’d bet 3F UL Gear outsells every other tent maker across the globe. Europe alone has 750 million consumers. And even though the US has the lion’s share of the most innovative ultralight gear companies (with only 4% of the world’s population), the United States isn’t viewed by the other 96% as the center of the entire universe.

[Terran Terran]

Levi’s always ripped out. They had no stretch. The low dollar pants I bought at Walmart would last a long time.

[solitone]

Thank you, Monte Masterson, for your kind words! You wrote:

I wasn’t aware that Italian consumers faced such high import duties and VAT. Why are 3F UL Gear products exempt? How about Liteway from Ukraine? With the big price difference I’d either repair the damaged Lanshan 2 (if you have a sewing machine) or buy another one. I wouldn’t really expect a low-cost Chinese company like 3F to provide warranties much past initial purchase. I’d just assume the risk when paying such a low price. No slur against the Chinese, that’s just how they roll.

In Italy, VAT is set at 22%. I had anticipated an import tax of around 12%, but I ended up paying more, around 18% in total. Perhaps additional duties were included with the taxes? It’s always a bit of a mystery.

Last year, I purchased a quilt from Liteway, and it ended up costing me significantly more than the list price on their website. They explained that there was an issue with a double currency exchange at the time, but I never quite grasped that concept.

Regarding 3F UL Gear, I made a purchase from them in spring 2022. I’m not sure where they shipped from or what kind of business arrangements they may have had, but I wasn’t charged either VAT or import tax. I can’t say for certain whether this would still be the case today.

You also said:

With the big price difference I’d either repair the damaged Lanshan 2 (if you have a sewing machine) or buy another one.

Personally, I prefer the security of a higher quality tent. Despite the damaged seam, I was fortunate to complete my 11-day trip, but things could have easily gone the other way. A better designed and constructed tent, such as Durston Gear’s X-Mid 2, provides greater reliability and is well worth the extra cost, in my opinion.

[Matthew / BPL]

Thank you, Monte. You said some things there that I have struggled to articulate and ended up deleting before posting. +1 to “And we wonder why 12 hours can go by between posts.” Maybe +5 or +100…

Thank you, Solitone. I’m glad that you are here and find your posts interesting. You communicate very clearly in English. I appreciate your patience and clarity.

Please, I encourage everyone to think about the block of text above the green Submit button. Let’s encourage people to post here. Let’s be welcoming. Don’t assume incompetence. Thanks and carry on!

[solitone]

Thank you too, Matthew.

I’m here to learn, and honestly, I feel like I’ve received a lot of insightful feedback.

[Terran Terran]

Bonfus is in Italy.

[Author]

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