Butyl Rubber gloves for VBL gloves?

[Anonymous]

When looking at conductivity of different solid materials, i noticed that butyl rubber has an unusually low conductivity for a common, cheap solid material–.09 in the international system of measurement.  The conductivity is significantly lower (about 2.7x) than nitrile (.24), and still noticeably better (2x less) than neoprene (.19).

Sounds like it would make an excellent VBL glove for more extreme cold use.  I will definitely be trying it out this winter.

Conductivity reference source:
http://www.electronics-cooling.com/2001/11/the-thermal-conductivity-of-rubbers-elastomers/

[Dustin Short]

Probably overthinking it as most of the benefit from VBL is in the vapor barrier, not the low conductivity. A thin fabric glove over any rubber would mask any gains from changing material. Also as the article points out, the conductivity is dependent on material thickness (more precisely dT/time is based on thickness). So just wearing a thicker nitrile glove may accomplish the same.

All that said, butyl gloves aren’t that expensive so definitely worth trying if you’re interested.

[Anonymous]

I figure a little extra warmth is better than none.  I seem to have to take my main gloves off often during cold weather trips, and a thicker pair of these gloves will offer some stand alone warmth for short periods.

I wonder how feasible or difficult it would be, to take two butyl gloves and bond them together with a good percentage of CO2 gas trapped in between the layers?

Insulation and VBL in one, if it will hold the CO2 gas and is not that difficult to do.

[Anonymous]

Another thought i had was the following:   You can buy 4 cups worth of loose areogel silica particles for 35 dollars.  Take two different sized butyl rubber gloves, one that fits your hand pretty well (but with a thin, fabric glove liner on, something like Rab MeCo), and one that is a bit larger/looser.  Pour loose areogel particles in between the two gloves, and then seal at the cuff area.

With say about a 4 to 5 mm space in between, and most of the air space filled with areogel particles, two layers of low conductive material, non air permeable material, you could get a fairly warm glove that moisture won’t ever be a problem with at more extremely cold temps.  Essentially worry free insulation.  But i guess the areogel particles might ground down after awhile?  Would that greatly affect its insulating properties?

With 4 cups of areogel particles, you probably could make at least a few different sets of gloves.  Fairly inexpensive project.

Dang curiosity and wandering, questioning mind.

[Eric Blumensaadt]

Whatever VBL gloves you find workable I’d get very thin synthetic glove liners to wear beneath them, preferably polypropylene or polyester. Feels far better and keeps “prune fingers” at bay.

[Billy Ray]

I’ve always found any kind of rubber gloves to be extremely cold… I don’t have any comparative science to quote, but from years of experience I would not use rubber gloves in a cold climate. In my experience the most important thing to have warm hands is to get gloves that are not too tight and flex without resistance… tight gloves cut off circulation to your hands so keep that in mind with your experiment… putting on layers inside a glove that fits right can make it too tight. For the 3 seasons I wear a medium glove. Winter gloves I usually wear a large. The other word for the wise I can offer is to take an extra pair of gloves in the winter in case the pair you start with gets wet… pretty bad to have cold, wet gloves in camp…. or frozen/icy gloves in the morning :(

billy

[Anonymous]

Thanks Eric, i do plan on wearing thin, synthetic gloves underneath and having the butyl rubber gloves sized up a bit.

[Anonymous]

I’ve used thin rubber gloves before for this purpose, and yes, i would agree that most of them don’t offer any warmth per se and some feel cold without insulation over them.

That’s why i’m excited by the butyl rubber.  Butyl rubber gloves are not common in home improvement stores or automotive stores.  It seems that nitrile and to a lesser extent latex, have become the most common materials for gloves in these and other brick and mortar stores that most have access to.  Yet, nitrile is fairly conductive which is not so great for cold weather.

Again, if you look at the conductivity difference between butyl and nitrile, there is a pretty significant difference, with butyl being almost 3 times less conductive.

For a solid material that isn’t infused with a gas of some kind (like foams or aerogels are), butyl rubber having a .09 thermal conductivity is impressive and fairly low (slightly better than polypropylene which is the least conductive material commonly used for clothing).

So unless you’v tried butyl rubber gloves specifically in those conditions, it makes no sense in automatically dismissing them.   As Dustin pointed out, they are inexpensive and in that sense, worth trying out.  I ordered two pairs for 9 dollars.  They can probably be found cheaper than that.

 

A general ps to my earlier posts.  I’ve decided to not add anything to them to boost insulation.  Giving it a little thought, older style aerogel would be kind of stupid to begin with, as it would just ground down most likely, and CO2 gas would probably be a pain to efficiently trap in them.

I did think that styrofoam micro beads would work pretty well for this application, but then i would have to purchase a larger bag of it, as well as buying larger butyl gloves, so i think i will just stick with traditional over insulation for this one. If i wasn’t lazy, impatient, and semi-broke, i’d might try a combo of styrofoam micro beads with CO2 gas in between two differently sized butyl rubber gloves for curiosity’s sake.  The combo of two layers of non permeable butyle rubber, styrofoam micro beads, and CO2 gas would provide pretty impressive insulation, but perhaps too much so for most conditions that i would experience (and thus make my hands sweat too much).

[Dean F.]

As a VBL layer under some other insulated glove, sure, why not. But as Billy Ray said- don’t wear just the VBL. That’s pointless.

I doubt that sealing gas or aerogel between two gloves will be practical. (I’m being politic- in fact, I’m certain of it.) Regarding gas, the two gloves would touch in many places no matter what you do, unless you inflate the system like a ballon to the point that your hands are useless. Regarding the aerogel- you’d need baffles to keep it from moving around, in which case you have what is basically a combined VBL/insulated glove. Those already exist, for a lot less work. And I wouldn’t stuff $35 worth of insulation inside something as fragile as a butyl glove unless you’re made of money.

[Anonymous]

Hi Dean, yes, i had come to that conclusion about aerogel awhile ago.  With the CO2 gas idea, keep in mind that i said that if i was going to do that (i’m not, but if i was) i would likely also put in styrofoam micro beads to add some structure and space.  You don’t need baffles for such a small space and for something that is not that compressive.

[Author]

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